Search found 64 matches

by Howl
Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:57 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

It has often been speculated that the IE words for 4 (*kʷetwores) and 8 (*Hoḱtṓw) are related. If that is true, they should come from an earlier form like **kʷoktw. In the word for 4 the 't' was elided, and a suffix was added.  In the word for 8 the inital kʷ was lenited to a laryngeal. This is the...
by Howl
Sun Nov 19, 2017 8:34 am
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

The short answer is the accent. A major weakness of the earlier version of my model is that I wanted to derive accent secondarily. But this caused everything to be too complex and I could not get the rules to work cleanly. I am now looking more into how PU corresponds with PIE. And it is like explor...
by Howl
Wed Nov 15, 2017 2:28 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

One important later sound change in my model is that sequences of o-o were transformed into e-o sequences. This sound change is one of the reasons that the o-grade in modern PIE looks so much like a secondary development. You see this in the declension of the noun genos (latin genus, generis): gono...
by Howl
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:49 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

That PIE went through a stage with just one non-high vowel is something many if not most Indo-Europeanists agree upon; the evidence looks quite compelling. And the high frequency of this vowel seems to indicate that a number of different vowels have collapsed into it; this in turn gives a plausible...
by Howl
Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:10 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

I do not wish to repeat the argument for Indo-Uralic or the Mitian hypothesis. What I am looking at is the vowel systems of Indo-European, Uralic, Turkic and Mongolian. The vowel systems of the last three are remarkably similar. They have 8~10 vowels in the first (root) syllable. But they also have ...
by Howl
Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:17 am
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...
Replies: 217
Views: 82603

Re: Nostratic, Eurasiatic, Mitian, ...

There are similar reasons to doubt an Indo-Uralic relationship, though the morphological resemblances are more favourable. But if you look at these sound correspondences , it is quite clear that we are dealing with a loanword layer here, as they look exactly like the sound substitutions one would e...
by Howl
Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:36 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

Depends on the reconstruction, for which there are two: *gʷow- ~ *gʷew-, or *gʷeh₃u-. In the former, the length in the Sanskrit nominative is generalised out of the accusative, where *gʷowm > *gʷōm by Stang's law (necessary to explain the long vowel in Skt. dyauḥ < *dyew- "sky") while the oblique i...
by Howl
Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:46 am
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

Three laryngeals is the simplest explanation for the Greek triple reflex. Then the ancestors of the Greeks used the appropriate e-grade vowel when they just needed a schwa-like vowel next to a laryngeal. Of course, as was pointed out to me by a helpful Twitter account, Lycian has a word 'χawa-' (is ...
by Howl
Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:32 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

Both e > a / _h₂_ and e > o₂ / _h₃_ can be considered pre-PIE changes, since they can be only recovered by internal reconstruction. (There is some evidence that *o₂ was distinct from basic *o, but it's still reflected as a back vowel everywhere. We could reconstruct e.g. *o = [ɔ] versus *o₂ = [o], ...
by Howl
Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:37 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

Thanks, I was actually thinking of https://www.academia.edu/4199002/PIE_a, but the centum-satem paper gives more detail. Just perusing the list of *k- roots at Wiktionary, the idea of a-coloring does appear sporadic at best. Actually *g- has a higher proportion of *a vocalism. Carrasquer Vidal argu...
by Howl
Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:49 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: Nog een vraag over het Nederlands
Replies: 5
Views: 2075

Re: Nog een vraag over het Nederlands

linguoboy wrote: Is there a generally accepted terminus ante quem for the fortition of voiced fricative allophones in Dutch?
Dutch did not have dental fricatives after the 12th century.
by Howl
Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:19 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

I can't give a full account of MCV's theory, I have googled Vidal's theory. It's at: http://www.academia.edu/4169949/Centum_and_satem Basically he suggests that this 'qa' -> 'ka' (and thus the Centum/Satem split) happened in pre-PIE at the time of the 'Great Vowel Collapse'. And he also suggests a ...
by Howl
Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:37 am
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

I would suggest the bilabial fricative (ɸ) for reconstructing h₃. It is not in the velar region, but why does it have to be? It is less marked than the uvular fricative (X) proposed for h₂, which explains why h₂ has more direct reflexes (the 'h' in Hittite). And it would definitely cause rounding. ...
by Howl
Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:46 pm
Forum: Languages & Linguistics
Topic: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread
Replies: 2225
Views: 461593

Re: The Great Proto-Indo-European Thread

OTOH the dissimilation may be something other than voiced stop to a voiced fricative. Your thoughts? In this model, what causes the different vowel coloring of h₂ vs. h₃? Note that Carrasquer Vidal has suggested that *k (i.e. not *kʷ or *ḱ) had the same vowel coloring effect as h₂ does. So, this is...