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Ser
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Re: resources

Post by Ser »

Vuvuzela wrote:I love how, on the top bar thing, Google says "+Tú", rather than "+Usted", like it knows you.
You can use tú with people you don't know, depending on your and their age/gender/context/hyerarchical status/socioeconomic status, and the dialect. It's a myth that the difference is about knowing or not-knowing people. Yeah, it's very common for websites to use tú or vos, though usted is also seen.

Now some contributions to the thread:
http://mgarci.aas.duke.edu/cibertextos/ANONIMO/MIO-CID/MANUSCRITO/DEST-MSS.HTM
Right column: Menéndez Pidal's philological ASCII-friendly transcription of the manuscript of the Çid.
Left column: Miguel Garci-Gomez's adaptation of the transcription at the right, to make it easier for Spanish speakers to read it, adding marks to know who's saying what in the text (there's dialogue in the manuscript, but it's all left to context, dashes and quotation marks didn't exist yet), although all the vocabulary/grammar/etc. is left intact. Note the website is very old, and the notes don't work anymore.

http://bib.cervantesvirtual.com/servlet/SirveObras/06927218700692762979079/index.htm
Libro de Alexandre (written during the first half of the 13th century): authoritative version made by Francisco Marcos Marín, by comparing both extant manuscripts and choosing the word forms of one or the other. Comes with apparatus. (Click on "El Texto" to go to the text itself. Use the arrows at the top right to go the next page.)
Last edited by Ser on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: resources

Post by Jipí »

FWIW, in German Google uses +Ich ("+Me")

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Re: resources

Post by Gulliver »

A seemingly quite in-depth, no frills course in Cornish, that you can even get some kind of accreditation for, I think. It looks like it's basically a grammar with readings, audio and translation questions.

Edit: I believe it's written in the KK orthography. As most discussions in Cornish on the internet appear to be on the matter of how every orthography apart from [insert preferred system here] is a blasphemous horror, this may be relevant to know. Honestly, go on some Cornish forums. For every sensible post in Cornish, there are two posts discussing how the writer is destined for Hell and clearly is a kiddy-fiddler who eats poo for breakfast for writing arghans instead of arhans.
Last edited by Gulliver on Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: resources

Post by dhok »

If I weren't an exchange student in Finland at the moment, I'd give it a go...

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Pole, the
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Re: resources

Post by Pole, the »

Polish Google uses "+Ty", with the informal 2sg pronoun.
The conlanger formerly known as “the conlanger formerly known as Pole, the”.

If we don't study the mistakes of the future we're doomed to repeat them for the first time.

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Re: resources

Post by Qwynegold »

Gulliver wrote:A seemingly quite in-depth, no frills course in Cornish, that you can even get some kind of accreditation for, I think. It looks like it's basically a grammar with readings, audio and translation questions.

Edit: I believe it's written in the KK orthography. As most discussions in Cornish on the internet appear to be on the matter of how every orthography apart from [insert preferred system here] is a blasphemous horror, this may be relevant to know. Honestly, go on some Cornish forums. For every sensible post in Cornish, there are two posts discussing how the writer is destined for Hell and clearly is a kiddy-fiddler who eats poo for breakfast for writing arghans instead of arhans.

Thanks! But (not to clutter this thread up), could you take a look at this?
Image
My most recent quiz:
Eurovision Song Contest 2018

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Re: resources

Post by Melteor »

http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayFulltext?type=1&fid=1834216&jid=IPA&volumeId=38&issueId=01&aid=1834208
Paper on whistled languages; discusses Turkish vowel harmony in whistled language as well as whistled Greek and Yupik and Chepang.

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Re: resources

Post by Thry »

Vuvuzela wrote:I love how, on the top bar thing, Google says "+Tú", rather than "+Usted", like it knows you. Seems sort of similar to the way websites are all like "Welcome, Stephanie" and I'm like "How do you know my name? Oh, right, I told you, buy why are we on a first-name basis? YOU'RE A SOULLESS MACHINE! I DON'T WANT TO BE YOUR FRIEND!"

What Serafín said; like it wants you to feel familiar; a government or bank webpage often says "usted"; but then an add will always say "tú", and so will Google, games, etc.

Vuvuzela wrote:Oh, yeah, and the book seems interesting, too.

Distrutadlo monseñor, e fazed de él buen uso.
Note: I don't know shit about my language in its Middle or Old stages, so idc if that is wrong.

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Re: resources

Post by Shrdlu »

http://rci.rutgers.edu/~rdenzerk/A%20Pr ... Salish.pdf

A preliminary look at restricted counting in Proto-Salish

Ryan Denzer-King
Rutgers, the State University of New Jersey
This paper examines the hypothesis that Proto-Salish had a
restricted counting system ending at four, as suggested by the
disparity of Salishan numerals above four, as well as the
general analyzability of higher numerals. Besides these
overall trends in numerals, evidence for count ending at four
include a reconstructed Proto-Salish root with the meaning
‘ready/completed’, and a subtractive Bella Coola form for
‘three’ incorporating the root for ‘four’. The limitation of the
system to the numeral four may have its root in preverbal
cognitive processes, which seem to be limited to discrete
quantities of four or less. If Proto-Salish had a restricted
numeral system ending at four, the disparity and analyzability
of higher numerals is expected.
If I stop posting out of the blue it probably is because my computer and the board won't cooperate and let me log in.!

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Re: resources

Post by Gulliver »

The National Archives site (of the UK) has a fairly decent looking guide to medieval Latin, which is what lots of our older records were written in, made by our government, no less. A thousand years of bureaucracy is a horrid thing to waste.

At the History Centre near us, there was a day course in medieval pa... paleog... palaeography? yes, that looks right, which I'd recommend doing if you see it come up. It was only £3 or something. I was the youngest person there by thirty years, but that's not uncommon for me because I'm weird and live somewhere rural.

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Ser
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Re: resources

Post by Ser »

Ean wrote:
Vuvuzela wrote:I love how, on the top bar thing, Google says "+Tú", rather than "+Usted", like it knows you. Seems sort of similar to the way websites are all like "Welcome, Stephanie" and I'm like "How do you know my name? Oh, right, I told you, buy why are we on a first-name basis? YOU'RE A SOULLESS MACHINE! I DON'T WANT TO BE YOUR FRIEND!"

What Serafín said; like it wants you to feel familiar; a government or bank webpage often says "usted"; but then an add will always say "tú", and so will Google, games, etc.

Vuvuzela wrote:Oh, yeah, and the book seems interesting, too.

Distrutadlo monseñor, e fazed de él buen uso.
Note: I don't know shit about my language in its Middle or Old stages, so idc if that is wrong.
Disfrutaldo. :)

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Re: resources

Post by Thry »

Really, was it that way? That's cool! I developed unknowingly some similar metatheses for mediaeval Irlandic:

parat + me = parante! "stop me!"
parat + lo = paralte! "stop it!"
it + vos = eutes! "go away!"

Modern forms are:

me parat
lo parat, read "y parat"
vos it, read "us it"

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Re: resources

Post by Izambri »

Ean wrote:it + vos = eutes! "go away!"

Hmm, I really like eutes for "go away". It has euphonic strength, IMO.
Un llapis mai dibuixa sense una mà.

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Ser
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Re: resources

Post by Ser »

Ean wrote:Really, was it that way?
Didn't I tell you to go read the poem of the Çid? >__>

    E p̃ſtalde de auer lo q̃ sea guiſado (line 118)
    (Y prestadle bienes, lo que sea razonable)
    Siuos la aduxier dalla ſi nõ cõtalda ſobre las arcas (line 181)
    (Si se la traigo (a usted) de allá, si no, cóbrela con las arcas (llenas de oro))

Thry
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Re: resources

Post by Thry »

Serafín wrote:
Ean wrote:Really, was it that way?
Didn't I tell you to go read the poem of the Çid? >__>

    E p̃ſtalde de auer lo q̃ sea guiſado (line 118)
    (Y prestadle bienes, lo que sea razonable)
    Siuos la aduxier dalla ſi nõ cõtalda ſobre las arcas (line 181)
    (Si se la traigo (a usted) de allá, si no, cóbrela con las arcas (llenas de oro))

Perdonalde a aqueste pobre ignorante, monseñor de ollos azules!

Izambri wrote:Hmm, I really like eutes for "go away". It has euphonic strength, IMO.

True. It comes from /'iv.t@s/ > /'iw.t@s/ > /'ew.t@s/, which is probably what is was pronounced like during that stage.

Nowadays people go for "FOOOOOOOOR" from "y it for", cf. Spanish fuera, in the North especially; it's [fɑ:::], with emphasis too.

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Re: resources

Post by Izambri »

Dunno if has been posted before: http://www.palaeolexicon.com/
Un llapis mai dibuixa sense una mà.

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Re: resources

Post by Melteor »

Newton - web app for teaching yourself British-style intonational theory & another tool for the same; the style of notation is after Wells' English Intonation, so it's very friendly (albeit not as fine-grained as it could be.)

Main website has a lot of software.

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Re: resources

Post by Ser »

Noriega wrote:Just read this on Linguist List, I think some people here would be interested:

University of British Columbia Working Papers in Linguistics (UBCWPL) would
like to announce that the complete set of ICSNL precedings (1967-2012) is now
available online free of charge at

http://www.linguistics.ubc.ca/icsnl/index

This is an indispensible resource on Salish, Wakashan, and other language
families of the Pacific Northwest.

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Re: resources

Post by Nesescosac »

I've uploaded a survey of sign languages and the Deaf around the world. Here's a link to it.
I did have a bizarrely similar (to the original poster's) accident about four years ago, in which I slipped over a cookie and somehow twisted my ankle so far that it broke
What kind of cookie?
Aeetlrcreejl > Kicgan Vekei > me /ne.ses.tso.sats/

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Ser
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Re: resources

Post by Ser »

ORTHOGRAPHIA ESPAÑOLA / COMPUESTA , Y ORDENADA / por la Real Academia Eſpañola
The RAE's first orthography, published in 1741.
http://www.cervantesvirtual.com/obra-visor/orthographia-espanola--0/html/

      DE EL ORIGEN DE LAS
      letras,arte de eʃcribir,y utilidad
      de la Orthographia.


      PRopriedad inſeparable
          de las criaturas racio-
          nales, que las diſtingue
      de los brutos , es el poder co-
      municar ſus penſamientos , ſus
                   diſ-

      diſcurſos, ſus afectos , y en una
      palabra los ſecretos de ſus cora-
      zones : eſte comercio es una de
      las diſtintivas propriedades de
      la racionalidad, de que utilíſsi-
      mamente ſe aprovecha en el uſo
      de la converſacion , en la enſe-
      ñanza de las facultades , en el
      magiſterio de las ciencias, en las
      operaciones de artes liberales,
      en la manifieſta publicacion de
      ſus ideas , y en deſahogo de ſus
      internos afectos.
       Pero eſte, que es natural don
      de Dios , dado liberalmente á
      la naturaleza , quedaba de al-
      gun modo incompleto , y no
      con toda aquella perfeccion , á
      que ha llegado , ſi el arte iluſ-
                  tra-

      trado de Dios , no hubiera in-
      ventado , ó deſcubierto el mo-
      do de eſcribir , y de aſſegurar
      las eſpecies de los conceptos,
      que expreſa la lengua , la voz,
      y la locucion. Sin el arte de eſ-
      cribir , todo el theſoro de noti-
      cias , que nos comunicamos en
      mutua correſpondencia por el
      medio de las voces,quedaba de-
      poſitado en ſolo la memoria...

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Re: resources

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Re: resources

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Re: resources

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陳第 wrote:蓋時有古今,地有南北;字有更革,音有轉移,亦勢所必至。
R.Rusanov wrote:seks istiyorum
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Re: resources

Post by Herr Dunkel »


I'm a bit suspicious of that one, even though it seems comprehensive:
How is Pipil <nikutuna> equal something like [ɲuniktˈe(ɰ)i]? Or have I missed something?
Or even <inelwat> = [kumeatɬ] and <itukay> = [nutuɣej] (/k/ > [ɣ] is frequent enough, but I don't hear any [i] in the initial syllable) - not only that, but it seems that the elderly-sounding speaker (Marcos García) consistently produces [tɬ] for final <t>
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