Conlang Diachronics Relay II (now with schedule!)

Museum for the best conlanging and conworldery threads. Ask mods to move threads here.
User avatar
the duke of nuke
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 467
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Location: Leicestershire
Contact:

Post by the duke of nuke »

Sounds good to me! It also means that the Ishe Coastal dialect can pick up loanwords from that of Naəgbum, which will be fun.
XinuX wrote:I learned this language, but then I sneezed and now am in prison for high treason. 0/10 would not speak again.

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

Just to clarify, this and the Cursed Relay not only take place in the same conworld, they are on the same timeline, right? Or are they two separate projects?

Also, what might a Lukpanic language have an influence on?

User avatar
the duke of nuke
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 467
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Location: Leicestershire
Contact:

Post by the duke of nuke »

The Cursed Relay takes place on the same timeline as, but somewhat later than, the current Diachronics Relay II (this thread). They're set on opposite sides of the same continent and are part of the same large-scale project.

The Lukpanic languages' lasting influence is as a substratum under the later Coastal Western languages; they're completely supplanted by the latter around -200 YP. Alces and myself have derived Lukpanic dialects for our respective Coastal languages.
XinuX wrote:I learned this language, but then I sneezed and now am in prison for high treason. 0/10 would not speak again.

User avatar
the duke of nuke
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 467
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Location: Leicestershire
Contact:

Post by the duke of nuke »

Apologising in advance for the double post...

Alces' new Coastal language has got me making some progress on my own. I've now run up against a few issues with the background to this language:

- Are any of the Steppe languages close enough geographically to provide loanwords? If so, which?
- What about the Lake languages? For that matter, where is the Lake?
- Are the locations of the Lukpanic cities fixed yet? If not, I've got a map that should work: here.
XinuX wrote:I learned this language, but then I sneezed and now am in prison for high treason. 0/10 would not speak again.

Cedh
Sanno
Sanno
Posts: 938
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:30 am
Location: Tübingen, Germany
Contact:

Post by Cedh »

thedukeofnuke wrote:Alces' new Coastal language has got me making some progress on my own.
Me too: I'd like to claim the Lukpanic dialect of Kpitamoa and its Coastal Western successor.
thedukeofnuke wrote:- Are any of the Steppe languages close enough geographically to provide loanwords? If so, which?
- What about the Lake languages?
Of the steppe langs, we don't have any lexicon for Satnímʔa unfortunately (a shame, the lang looks very promising), and only a few words for Hāňheliubľ. Either of these might be nearby, though maybe not both of them.

Of the Lake languages, I think Šetâmol should be a good source for loans at least into eastern Coastal languages, and since the speakers of Hošər might have moved into the steppe (and from there possibly towards the coast), that would be a candidate as well. Óhylvídós and Shtåså are spoken in different regions. Also, I think it's likely that some words would have been borrowed from Çetázó at the PCW stage.
thedukeofnuke wrote:For that matter, where is the Lake?
- Are the locations of the Lukpanic cities fixed yet? If not, I've got a map that should work: here.
Seems good to me. I've added a possible location for the lake (same link; new version of your map).

User avatar
Alces
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:09 pm
Location: Merseyside, England, UK
Contact:

Post by Alces »

Ìletlégbàku's grammar is mostly worked out; I still need to do the lexicon though. I've added various ideas about their culture and history (here, here, here) too.

User avatar
Nortaneous
Sumerul
Sumerul
Posts: 4544
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:52 am
Location: the Imperial Corridor

Post by Nortaneous »

One of these days, I should put the Iŋomœ´ > Hāňheliubľ sound changes into a format that can be used by a SCA. The only problem is that there's a lot of fuckery with the stress accent, and SCAs don't do that sort of thing well. And I don't know if I still have the changes.

I also need to redo the syntax, because it's fucking horrible.

Also, if anyone needs loanwords, Hāňheliubľ was heavily influenced by some sort of substrate, so if anyone feels like doing that... Alternatively, I could get rid of the substrate, but then I don't have an excuse to massively simplify the syntax, and I'm fucking horrible at syntax.
Last edited by Nortaneous on Sat May 08, 2010 3:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.

User avatar
dunomapuka
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by dunomapuka »

Great job everyone, I've been loving the recent explosion of work on Lukpanic and Coastal Western. I'm curious about whether Lukpanic languages might survive longer in marginal areas, like in the West, or on the Isle of Poalugbum...

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

boy #12 wrote:Great job everyone, I've been loving the recent explosion of work on Lukpanic and Coastal Western. I'm curious about whether Lukpanic languages might survive longer in marginal areas, like in the West, or on the Isle of Poalugbum...
Yeah, I've been wondering- my Lukpanic language is intended to be a divergent daughterlang rather than a dialect, so if the speakers moved to a farther off island, could they maybe avoid the takeover by Western tribes?

User avatar
dunomapuka
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by dunomapuka »

Mbwa wrote:
boy #12 wrote:Great job everyone, I've been loving the recent explosion of work on Lukpanic and Coastal Western. I'm curious about whether Lukpanic languages might survive longer in marginal areas, like in the West, or on the Isle of Poalugbum...
Yeah, I've been wondering- my Lukpanic language is intended to be a divergent daughterlang rather than a dialect, so if the speakers moved to a farther off island, could they maybe avoid the takeover by Western tribes?
Dunno if they'd avoid it forever... there's a certain tendency in conlanging to want to make every single language family last forever. Though maybe Lukpanic might remain for a while on those islands to the west.

Poalugbum should be the last of the cities to go Western. That would have some interesting effects on the dialect...

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

Oh, I don't mind at all if they get taken over. And are all the Lukpanic cities filled, or do you know of a good spot where my langauge could be spoken?

User avatar
dunomapuka
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by dunomapuka »

Mbwa wrote:Oh, I don't mind at all if they get taken over. And are all the Lukpanic cities filled, or do you know of a good spot where my langauge could be spoken?
Doanu is the furthest-west city, that could be a good choice.

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

Doanu has already got it's own dialect on the wiki. Was I supposed to start from one of those rather than Proto-Lukpanic?

User avatar
the duke of nuke
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 467
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Location: Leicestershire
Contact:

Post by the duke of nuke »

If you're referring to the table on the Proto-Lukpanic page, those samples are just ideas. You can derive a dialect to look like one of those (as Alces and I have both done) or just go your own way and replace the changes given.

EDIT: In case it's not clear, nobody has actually made a Doanu dialect. So go ahead!
Last edited by the duke of nuke on Sun May 09, 2010 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
XinuX wrote:I learned this language, but then I sneezed and now am in prison for high treason. 0/10 would not speak again.

User avatar
dunomapuka
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by dunomapuka »

Mbwa wrote:Doanu has already got it's own dialect on the wiki. Was I supposed to start from one of those rather than Proto-Lukpanic?
Oh, I see. Well how about Poalugbum? No one's done anything for that yet. Or, the area to the west of Doanu.
thedukeofnuke wrote:If you're referring to the table on the Proto-Lukpanic page, those samples are just ideas. You can derive a dialect to look like one of those (as Alces and I have both done) or just go your own way and replace the changes given.
Yeah, this is true. Though it would be nice if the changes for each city don't look completely random, but suggest regional isoglosses - for example, Kpitamoa's dialect looks fairly similar to the nearby Siŋmeasita, but doesn't look much like Doanu. But yeah, what I've put down for the dialects is really just a suggestion. I'm sure what you've got will work fine for Doanu.

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

Alright. I've got another question, though. As I said before, this language is more divergent than just a dialect, or at least I was planning on making it like that. Is it supposed to be an intelligible dialect?

caedes
Sanci
Sanci
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:35 am
Location: Poland

Post by caedes »

Eh, I just wanted to say that I am just finishing completely new sound changes for Hošər because I had problems with implementing the old on my SCA (which was actually the reason why I hadn't been working on the language for so long, I finally lost interest in applaying all those changes by hand, I apologize). And I don't like the old changes anyway, full of /S/ and more or less logical errors.

However, I don't have a final name yet for the new language, but it'll be much more conservative in terms of phonology, which should be quite more realistic for a language spoken in lone mountain valleys and among those hills in that region.
Cuix ticpiä cuitlatl itic motzontecomauh ?

User avatar
dunomapuka
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:42 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by dunomapuka »

Mbwa wrote:Alright. I've got another question, though. As I said before, this language is more divergent than just a dialect, or at least I was planning on making it like that. Is it supposed to be an intelligible dialect?
Nope, doesn't have to be. Make it divergent if you want. What do you have in mind?

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

boy #12 wrote:
Mbwa wrote:Alright. I've got another question, though. As I said before, this language is more divergent than just a dialect, or at least I was planning on making it like that. Is it supposed to be an intelligible dialect?
Nope, doesn't have to be. Make it divergent if you want. What do you have in mind?
Well I've added pitch accent, a minor vowel shift, and a few little sound changes. I'll probably add a few more. I might try and add a few little grammatical quirks. I know it won't be too divergent, though. About how long until Proto-Lukpanic speakers get overtaken, so I have a rough idea of how divergent it could get?

User avatar
the duke of nuke
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 467
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Location: Leicestershire
Contact:

Post by the duke of nuke »

The proto-lang is spoken around -1500 YP; the Lukpanic languages are expected to become extinct sometime around -200 YP, although I imagine a century or so either way will be ok.

Remember that your dialect should probably share some features with the Isi dialect, which is geographically the closest to Doanu.
XinuX wrote:I learned this language, but then I sneezed and now am in prison for high treason. 0/10 would not speak again.

User avatar
Mbwa
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 pm

Post by Mbwa »

thedukeofnuke wrote:The proto-lang is spoken around -1500 YP; the Lukpanic languages are expected to become extinct sometime around -200 YP, although I imagine a century or so either way will be ok.
Okay.
Remember that your dialect should probably share some features with the Isi dialect, which is geographically the closest to Doanu.
Thanks for pointiong this out.

User avatar
Arzena
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 240
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 1:19 pm
Location: ¡California, Tejas, Marruecos!

Post by Arzena »

Dewrad's website appears to be down, anyone got a copy of Proto-Western lying around?
A New Yorker wrote:Isn't it sort of a relief to talk about the English Premier League instead of the sad state of publishing?
Abi wrote:At this point it seems pretty apparent that PIE was simply an ancient esperanto gone awry.
Shtåså, Empotle7á, Neire Wippwo

User avatar
WeepingElf
Smeric
Smeric
Posts: 1630
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 5:00 pm
Location: Braunschweig, Germany
Contact:

Post by WeepingElf »

Arzena wrote:Dewrad's website appears to be down, anyone got a copy of Proto-Western lying around?
I have one (not online, but I can email it on request, but not before Sunday evening - I am away from home and the Net this weekend).
...brought to you by the Weeping Elf
Tha cvastam émi cvastam santham amal phelsa. -- Friedrich Schiller
ESTAR-3SG:P human-OBJ only human-OBJ true-OBJ REL-LOC play-3SG:A

Cedh
Sanno
Sanno
Posts: 938
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:30 am
Location: Tübingen, Germany
Contact:

Post by Cedh »

WeepingElf wrote:
Arzena wrote:Dewrad's website appears to be down, anyone got a copy of Proto-Western lying around?
I have one (not online, but I can email it on request, but not before Sunday evening - I am away from home and the Net this weekend).
PW appears to be up again.

User avatar
Alces
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:09 pm
Location: Merseyside, England, UK
Contact:

Post by Alces »

Does anyone have a copy of the Proto-Coastal-Western lexicon? Tzirtzi's website is still down and I want to work on Iletlegbaku's lexicon more.

(I'd like to have a copy of the grammar too, just in case.)

Post Reply