Religion Question

[zompist]

Mostly, the period had what I wanted (e.g. the text of the New Testament) and avoided the baggage of the next centuries.

[brandrinn]

Mostly, the period had what I wanted (e.g. the text of the New Testament) and avoided the baggage of the next centuries.

ah, i see. thanks for responding, i know you can be busy like a dog can be ugly.

[alephnaught]

Weren't the Elenicoi from Alexandria? Then I should think that they'd be Arians, as Alexandria at the time (and later the West) was a stronghold of Arianism (Arius was Alexandrian, after all!). The majority of bishops across the empire were Arians at the time, anyway.

Wasn?t St. Athanasius also Alexandrian?

Yes, but the schools of Alexandria were hotbeds of Arianism.

Though in 325 the majority of bishops were not Arians, though it was getting there. That came later.

AFAIK, a minority of bishops were homoousians, though if you exclude semi-Arians it's less clear.

It is entirely possible that these merchants were from St. Athanasius's following, since most of the people of Alexandria (and the east as a whole) were; it was officialdom that wasn't.

Oh, they were merchants? I thought it must have been a boatload of bishops or something; how else would they continue the apostolic succession?

And I think it might be instructive to read some Barnabas and Ignatius of Antioch; you'll find that Christian practice and (fundamental) beliefs were quite unified even as early as the second century. The Loeb classical library has all the apostolic fathers in a single volume (with the Greek on facing pages!!!).

In some ways, but the whole of the West didn't switch to the Alexandrian paschal calculation until the time of Charlemagne.

[dgoodmaniii]

Though in 325 the majority of bishops were not Arians, though it was getting there. That came later.

AFAIK, a minority of bishops were homoousians, though if you exclude semi-Arians it's less clear.

A minority were, but later; if it was a minority at the time of Nicea, how did Trinitarianism get endorsed by the council?

It is entirely possible that these merchants were from St. Athanasius's following, since most of the people of Alexandria (and the east as a whole) were; it was officialdom that wasn't.

Oh, they were merchants? I thought it must have been a boatload of bishops or something; how else would they continue the apostolic succession?

There must have been at least one bishop on board, but the bulk of them were merchants.

And I think it might be instructive to read some Barnabas and Ignatius of Antioch; you'll find that Christian practice and (fundamental) beliefs were quite unified even as early as the second century. The Loeb classical library has all the apostolic fathers in a single volume (with the Greek on facing pages!!!).

In some ways, but the whole of the West didn't switch to the Alexandrian paschal calculation until the time of Charlemagne.

True, but that hardly matters, does it? I thought we were talking about doctrine rather than practice, particularly such minor practices as that.

[Yiuel Raumbesrairc]

GREEK, CHRISTIAN, MERCHANT

We only read here about inconsistencies. Yet, having Greek Christian Merchants is what would be the most probable event imho.

In those days, still a large part of the population were still followers of "paganism". Indeed, the name says it all, paganism was mainly a countryside religion. So, we could think that because they were rather urbans (merchants aren't much of a peasantry), and hence, would be Christians.

Greeks were also at that time a travelling people in the Orient part of the roman Empire (still extent at that time, though it seems Zompist never showed a glimpse about that). The greek language was very important then, especially in the large cities of Alexandria and Byzance (Constantinople).

So, a Greek Christian Merchant team is all plausible, if the "door" opened in the Roman Empire (and probably was a salvation as well, as Christianism wasn't still a well placed religion in the Roman Empire, at that time.

THE ISSUE OF OTHER WORLDS VS OIKUMENE

It seems that one feel strange that Earth visits other worlds. I would call upon the stories about ETs visiting Earth. To me, they feel the same, only we are the visitors at this point. It has a lot of good points : I know it can give a manner of perspective to the story. Looking to your world through the eyes of a Terran can be quite marvellous.

And there he was walking in this alien forest. He was hearing no noise, except the wind's blow and the water's flow. No bird's singing, no beast's crying was there, as if only his feet ever crossed by those lands under that beautiful sun...

[Dewrad]

In those days, still a large part of the population were still followers of "paganism". Indeed, the name says it all, paganism was mainly a countryside religion. So, we could think that because they were rather urbans (merchants aren't much of a peasantry), and hence, would be Christians.

[/quote]

That's a common misconception, which has not-so-recently been refuted by several historians (q.v. Nigel Pennick, for example). Urban areas were not overwhelmingly christian until a couple of centuries after Constantine, so classical pagans != rural peasants.

[Yiuel Raumbesrairc]

Well, yes, but, if you wanted to find Christians, they probably mostly were urbans at that time. Indeed, a lot of philosophies and religious beliefs were to be found in the cities, not only christianism, and they were probably as strong or somehow big. It would have been fun if one of the Elenicoi had been non-christian, actually. That would have made their story even stranger.