Elkar?l emoticons

Questions or discussions about Almea or Verduria-- also the Incatena. Also good for postings in Almean languages.
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Elkar?l emoticons

Post by Dudicon »

Well, I've completed the Elkar?l ASCII transcription scheme, and I have to say it turned out to be harder than it looked. I've tried to stay as true as possible to the graphical nature of Elkar?l's writing system, but in a few places I've had to work with things a bit to get them to come out right. For instance, instead of trying to create an independent form for each of the "headgear," I instead created a general headgear template and then differentiated each from there. You'll see what I mean. Also, for ease of typing, every character used in this transcription is available right on your keyboard, without use of special characters or anything of the like.

So, on to the scheme! I'll present it in the same order as it is presented on the Elkar?l page itself, for ease of reference as well as for the reason that that's how I did it.

Consonants
Stops:

Code: Select all

p    t    ch    k   q     0
{ }  ( )  E 3   <>  [ ]   (( ))
Insofar as it seemed possible, I strove for symmetry when the original writing system called for it. The ch head-shape is one place where I gave up trying to do that--it was a hard enough shape to match once. Also, the k shape isn't perfect, but it seemed the best based on my mission for this transcription.
Sonorants:

Code: Select all

m      n      ?      ng     l      ly     r
{| |}  )| |(  3| |E  >| |<  &| |&  (| |)  ((| |))
As you can see, the general headgear template I referred to above was x| |x, so as to help distinguish them from everything else.

Vowels

Code: Select all

u     ?     i     e     ?     a     ?     o      ?
(:-(  (:-|  |:-|  ):-(  {:-(  {:->  [:-(  {:l-)  {:-)
Again, the vowels were a tough match. I've tried to faithfully represent the actual expressions given. To double a vowel, 8 is used in place of : for the eyes, and to get more than double vowels, multiple 8's are used (or, if you feel like being mathematical, you could measure out exactly how many duplicate vowels you wanted with a combination of 8's and a possible extra :).

Voicing, implosives, and fricatives
(shown on tek)

Code: Select all

Voicing: (l):-(l>
Implosive: (ll):-(ll>
Fricative: ~():-(>~
Remember at this point that a lot of how these turn out depends on the font you're using. I designed the system using Verdana (the font this board is in), with the idea that that's the font it would most often be used in, so it looks best in that. However, I'm presenting it in Courier because that's the least ambiguous of the fonts. Trust me: in Verdana, those lower case L's look a lot more convincing as wrinkles.

Prefixes (shown on tek when applicable)

Code: Select all

n- 8
ch- ():~(>
g- ():-$(>
t- ^
p- c
q- <
Note ch- and g-.

Suffixes

Code: Select all

-a .
-u C
-e <==|o
-sh #
-ch X
-m 8
-r )-)
-kh W M
-th -,
-d 88
-?l E
-e is probably the most awkward of this set of symbols, but it ironically does possibly the best job of actually representing what it is supposed to represent. Note that, with -kh the <W> and <M> go on opposite sides of the face proper.

Object anaphora

Code: Select all

-r- > or P
-l- o
-n- :
-?b o==
-?d =o=
-?g ==o
-iph -l-
Note that the <>> goes after the mouth (if the mouth is a straight line, use <P> instead, in place of the mouth), <o> replaces the regular <-> nose, and <:> goes directly before the mouth.

Assignment anaphora

Code: Select all

u   ?   i   e   ?   a   ?    o    ?
*C  *(  *|  *)  *}  *:  *()  *3  *{
Suffice it to say, some of these require an imagination.

Numbers

Code: Select all

l   ll   lll   x
xl  xll  xlll  xx
xxl xxll xxlll X
Everything's piled together in the order prefixes-face proper-suffixes-object anaphora-assignment anaphora, exactly in the order I've listed them.

And so you have what you might call &|)8-() (():o(>.)-)E, were you so inclined.
Last edited by Dudicon on Fri Jan 16, 2004 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by pharazon »

Excellent! Naturally the first thing I thought was, "Can I make a program to do this?". The answer was, "Probably not, but what the hell", so I think I will. Plus it'll go in reverse. Expect it in several decades.

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Post by Glenn »

Very impressive, Dudicon 8) --you obviously put a lot of thought into this.
I assume that it is quite learnable as well--with a bit of practice... :wink:

p@,
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Post by Warmaster »

i didn't understand a single word of what you said dudicon, but it looked good, and thats what counts 8) :wink:
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Post by John Ramirez »

Wow! Great job!!

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Post by Jar Jar Binks »

Here's my first attempt, more is coming:

((|(:-(3 ~{|:-||} [):-(l}*: ((:-(|& <(:-(ll> c({:-(} El{:-(|(*: &|):-(>

(BTW. Remember to disable smilies when posting in Elkar?l!)

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Post by Jar Jar Binks »

A simple ~<[:-(3~

<l{:->|} (():o(>.)-) [):-(l}*{ (ll{:->)) El(:-(|}*{ ^{{:->} (({:->ll)
Answer: {{:->|(
(Edited to hide the answer and remove a "typo")
Last edited by Jar Jar Binks on Thu Jan 15, 2004 12:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by zompist »

Great job, Dudicon. Nice schmematization of the nasals, too. Or should I say:

(({:l-)|( {l(:-(|<

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Post by Dudicon »

Thanks, everyone, for the enthusiastic responses!
zompist wrote:Great job, Dudicon. Nice schmematization of the nasals, too. Or should I say:

(({:l-)|( {l(:-(|<
{|(:-(|(88 (l(:-()) (l(:-|)) <{-:->|(

Probably awful Elkar?l, but I think it should be at least understandable.

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Post by con quesa »

Amazing. Now I can make an Elkaril sig!
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Post by Space Dracula »

pharazon wrote:Excellent! Naturally the first thing I thought was, "Can I make a program to do this?". The answer was, "Probably not, but what the hell", so I think I will. Plus it'll go in reverse. Expect it in several decades.
Creating such a program would be much easier in Python. ;) 8)
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Post by Shm Jay »

Suggestion: Insert a spacing symbol because it?s hard to tell where one word begins and the other ends. I know there are some languages (Amharic?) that use : to space words, and :: to space sentences. Obviously you can?t use :, but you need something else. Maybe . to space words (more clearly, space-.-space) and .. to space sentences?

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Post by pharazon »

Space Dracula wrote:
pharazon wrote:Excellent! Naturally the first thing I thought was, "Can I make a program to do this?". The answer was, "Probably not, but what the hell", so I think I will. Plus it'll go in reverse. Expect it in several decades.
Creating such a program would be much easier in Python. ;) 8)
PERL!!!!!!!!! *stabs Space Dracula through the heart with a wooden ->*
More importantly, I want it online and my host doesn't support Python.
Last edited by pharazon on Fri Jan 16, 2004 1:09 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Elkar?l emoticons

Post by pharazon »

Dudicon wrote:Voicing, implosives, and fricatives[/b] (shown on tek)

Code: Select all

Voicing: (l):-(l]
Implosive: (ll):-(ll]
Fricative: ~():-(]~
Shouldn't that last character be > rather than ]?

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Post by GreenBowTie »

I think this is probably as good a place as any to say that the Elkaril, uh, script is probably the best con-script I've ever seen. Ten points to Gryffindor

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Post by pharazon »

While we're talking about Elkar?l, the ? in 'ebd?nm?k' in the lexicon is a typo, right? Or is that some subtlety of the vowels I'm missing?

(Another minor typo: ? is written ? in 'r?ntur' in the 'adjectivizers' section)

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Post by Jar Jar Binks »

GreenBowTie wrote:I think this is probably as good a place as any to say that the Elkaril, uh, script is probably the best con-script I've ever seen. Ten points to Gryffindor
And the most original one! I haven't heard of anyone actually having made a complete writing system based on facial expressions and headgear and stuff. And Dudicon: your ascii representation, well, ahem, ...rocks. Ten points to Hufflepuff.

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Post by Dudicon »

Shm Jay wrote:Suggestion: Insert a spacing symbol because it?s hard to tell where one word begins and the other ends. I know there are some languages (Amharic?) that use : to space words, and :: to space sentences. Obviously you can?t use :, but you need something else. Maybe . to space words (more clearly, space-.-space) and .. to space sentences?
Yeah, spaces are used to separate words, as in the examples shown.

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Re: Elkar?l emoticons

Post by Dudicon »

pharazon wrote:
Dudicon wrote:Voicing, implosives, and fricatives[/b] (shown on tek)

Code: Select all

Voicing: (l):-(l]
Implosive: (ll):-(ll]
Fricative: ~():-(]~
Shouldn't that last character be > rather than ]?
Whoops, thanks for pointing that out.

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Post by pharazon »

Ok, the program is semi-done. So far, it'll convert any Elkar?l text that requires only one face. I haven't implemented multi-face support yet (sounds fancy) because I have to leave soon; it won't really be very hard. The reverse transliterator should be easy too. So here it is: http://cgi-bin.spaceports.com/~pharazo/elkaril.html (you'll have to paste that into the window, like Geocities). Don't hold back in mentioning any bugs; I can't imagine having gotten everything right the first time.

Edit: I just realized one problem: it won't handle the stop form of the honorific suffix right, so don't bother telling me if you find that. I guess everyone will just have to suffer through this version for a while.
Last edited by pharazon on Fri Jan 16, 2004 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Dudicon »

pharazon wrote:Ok, the program is semi-done. So far, it'll convert any Elkar?l text that requires only one face. I haven't implemented multi-face support yet (sounds fancy) because I have to leave soon; it won't really be very hard. The reverse transliterator should be easy too. So here it is: http://cgi-bin.spaceports.com/~pharazo/elkaril.html (you'll have to paste that into the window, like Geocities). Don't hold back in mentioning any bugs; I can't imagine having gotten everything right the first time.
Very, very nice. And very, very useful.

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Post by Warmaster »

pharazon wrote:Ok, the program is semi-done. So far, it'll convert any Elkar?l text that requires only one face. I haven't implemented multi-face support yet (sounds fancy) because I have to leave soon; it won't really be very hard. The reverse transliterator should be easy too. So here it is: http://cgi-bin.spaceports.com/~pharazo/elkaril.html (you'll have to paste that into the window, like Geocities). Don't hold back in mentioning any bugs; I can't imagine having gotten everything right the first time.

Edit: I just realized one problem: it won't handle the stop form of the honorific suffix right, so don't bother telling me if you find that. I guess everyone will just have to suffer through this version for a while.
i'm getting 404's with that :(
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Post by pharazon »

Warmaster wrote:i'm getting 404's with that :(
Are you sure you're cutting and pasting the address into the window? I'm fixing it right now, so you'll probably get weird results anyway, at least in the Elkar?l -> emoticons direction.

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Post by pharazon »

It seems to work ok now, though still only one face when going to emoticons, but it goes both ways now. One question: how is the ng- prefix ("foreign, non-elcarin") represented in the writing? It's not mentioned on Mark's writing page.

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Post by Rory »

That page is a bit dodgy in Opera: the boxes keep jumping from the middle to the left and so on. Quite weird. But good work!
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