Methaiun vs Kebreni

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Exez
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Methaiun vs Kebreni

Post by Exez »

In the Kebreni lexicon, some Methaiun words given as their origins, seem suspiciously Kebreni rather than Methaiun

For example, the verbs for die and follow are given as fonu < fonu and faru < faru for both. However the majority of the verbs show that the ending -u was added later, only in Kebreni; the Methaiun verbs were single stems. eg. fuzu < fus- and not *fusu

Should then we suppose that Methaiun verbs already had the ending -u, ignored by grammarians and reconstructionists? or it was a slip?

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Post by Exez »

Oh I also wonder about some Cadhinor words which passed into Kebreni but their Methaiun form is not given. For example
adnedu < admettan
aladaḣ < aluatas
demedu < demettan
kaadau < aletes caedel
lureḣ < lures
lyḣ < leus

From those I can deduce that the Methaiun forms were either identical to Cadhinor (lures, leus) or were introduced directly into Kebreni by Cadhinor-saavy scholars.

For adnedu and demedu I can guess intermediate Methaiun forms *adnet- and *demet- if they ever existed

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So Haleza Grise
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Post by So Haleza Grise »

Exez wrote:Oh I also wonder about some Cadhinor words which passed into Kebreni but their Methaiun form is not given. For example
adnedu < admettan
aladaḣ < aluatas
demedu < demettan
kaadau < aletes caedel
lureḣ < lures
lyḣ < leus

From those I can deduce that the Methaiun forms were either identical to Cadhinor (lures, leus) or were introduced directly into Kebreni by Cadhinor-saavy scholars.

For adnedu and demedu I can guess intermediate Methaiun forms *adnet- and *demet- if they ever existed
I always assumed with these that the Cadhinor was borrowed into Old Kebreni, given that dividing lines are always going to be fuzzy.
Duxirti petivevoumu tinaya to tiei šuniš muruvax ulivatimi naya to šizeni.

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Post by zompist »

The -u endings for some Methaiun verbs are a slip. As the -u ending is inflectional and we really don't know the Methaiun verbal system, I left out the endings. (On analogy with nouns we'd expect -o but without a verbal system it's useless to wonder.)

As SHG points out, timing issues come up with Cadhinor borrowings. If any borrowing is given in Methaiun, assume that it's attested in some form; contrariwise, if no Methaiun form is given, the borrowing may be no earlier than Old Kebreni.

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Re: Methaiun vs Kebreni

Post by Exez »

Some other questions.
  • In the Kebreni lexicon there is a Methaiun name Ȟaskumi > Keb. Ḣazum. However the name derives from Methaiun ɣask. Shouldn't it be *ɣaskumi? Is it a slip?
  • Secondly, we have the collective word wunu for 'government'. The word for leader (singular) is 'wun', or perhaps 'wuni' (CuCi being a usual Kebreni pattern for professions)?
  • What is/are the Methauin word/s for 'sad' and 'sadness'? Kebreni is 'lyr' for both, derived from Methaiun liur, but which is the exact meaning of the ancient word? Usually Methaiun adjectives end in -i, which was dropped in Kebreni. I understand that liur means 'sadness' while *liuri is 'sad', both merged in Kebreni
  • And how do the verbs which end in -s- work? They seem to be derived from nouns or other roots, usually by dropping and replacing the final vowel.
    For example we have the word nunto 'brain' and the verb nunts- 'think'. Are they both derived by a stem *nunt-? *nunt+s and *nunt+no?
  • Finally, in the Lexicon some Methaiun numbers contain poc, like poc pinaȟ "11" > Keb. pinaḣ. However there is no word *poc in Methaiun, rather poki 'foot'. Was it another slip? Should it be corrected as *poki pinaȟ?

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