Almean geology

Questions or discussions about Almea or Verduria-- also the Incatena. Also good for postings in Almean languages.
Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Almean geology

Post by Buks »

I’d like to open a question about an almost unexplored field: Almean geology.

I found some indications on Almeopedia about the origins of some mountain ranges and places, but I think the importance of geology is still underestimated, as I found no reports of earthquakes in the history pages.

On Earth, earthquakes and volcanic eruptions played a minor but at least significant role in the past (and they play still today), with cities destroyed and left, or rebuilt, sometimes losing importance. Earthquakes sometimes played a great role in architecture, by eliminating old style buildings and giving new material from the ruins to rebuild. Volcanic eruptions played a minor role in history, as not so many volcanoes are found in places where major civilizations developed. But think of the city of Pompeii in Italy, or the (not sure) role of the Santorini eruption in the disappearance of the Minoan civilization on Crete.

Certainly the influence of this kind of events are limited to geologically active zones, while in other places a generation could ever live without witnessing a single earthquake in their entire lives.

As written in the Almeopedia, Almea is surely a geologically active planet, as it is stated that continents are moving (Neinuoi and Luduyn peninsula). A lack of earthquakes and volcanic activity could imply that Almea is losing its internal heat and the tectonic movement is stopping or has just stopped. But this means that the planet is slowly dying, with terrible consequences over life, although in a very long time.

I thought of a geologically active scenario, with plates moving forming the present continents. It’s impossible to sketch the seismic zones without drawing the tectonic plates that moved to form the continents. Earthquakes usually manifest themselves at plate boundaries while inside them are very rare. As mountains on Earth could form only when the crust was bent and raised by tectonic forces between plates, I thought to draw the boundaries according to the existing mountains on the maps, which I studied very well. (Only for eastern Ereláe until now).

The sketch which came out is a collage of different plates, which I named according to the area they form or the major feature they contain. This apparently confusing situation about the plates are not uncommon on Earth. The Chinese area, and most of eastern Asia was formed by the fusion of multiple micro-plates. I drew the major plate, on the north, the Nanese-Dhekhnami plate, forming the biggest part of the continent, with which is slowly colliding the Eretald plate (Eretald and the Barbarian plain). South of them the Luduyn plate is colliding with the Eretald plate with more force. The situation in the East seems to be a little more complicated as the Xengiman could exist only if the sea Gurt Jeori is something like a big shallow gulf, part of the continent, thus forming the Xurnese plate. The relatively low altitude of the mountains in northern Qaraumia seems to indicate that the Qarau plate (easternmost coast of Ereláe) is something like the Pacific plate on Earth, which is colliding with the North American plate along the S. Andreas fault, sliding one alongside the other. The Skourene plate (including the Lenani steppe, Skouras and the Littoral) seems to be an ancient, worn out plate, which is wedged between the Xurnese and the Qurau plate. Between the Eretald plate and the Xurnese one seems to be there a micro-plate: the Bolon plate.

So we can figure out the faults, which mark the boundaries of the plates, and thus the most seismically active areas of the continent. As the Diqun Bormai are presented as something like Himalaya on Earth, they certainly are the most seismic zone on Ereláe. The Koranax, as one closest region to the mountain range but surely part of the Xurnese plate, is continuously hit by earthquakes, even very strong ones. The city of Gurdago can nevertheless escape strong earthquakes, thank to its position in the extreme south of the peninsula, maybe out of the fault.

The most interest part is the boundary between the Eretald plate and the Nanese-Dhekhnami one. This fault runs from the Elkarin mountains through Flora, Kebri and the Ctelm mountain. A mountain island as Kebri is usually hit by strong earthquakes, as part of a range of mountains. The same fate could happen to Érenat and to Barakhun. Also the mountain area of Ismahi seems to be good for seismic activity, although not so intensively. Flora seems to be a very young island and could be struck by strong but rarer earthquakes. As the Zëi Mišicama could be so active, the Eretald coast could be in potential danger of tsunamis. (As witnessed on Earth, not all earthquakes led to tsunamis, but they can influence history, as the 1755 Lisbon tsunami, which influenced the colonization history of Portugal and the European philosophy).

Other risky areas are the Lenani steppe around Lenani lake, the Gelihur peninsula, and with less risks, the mountain range on the Mnau peninsula. The Littoral could endure some earthquakes, but not so devastating as other regions.
Volcanoes can be a rarer geological feature, but usually present within a little distance from fault lines. They can be continuously active or dormant but dangerously recharging their magma chambers. (As example, nobody knew of the volcanic nature of mount Vesuvius before its 79 AD eruption). There are many kinds of volcanoes, usually near a fault line, it is easy to find dormant but explosive volcanoes (think of the volcanoes near the American West Coast), while in correspondence to hot spots usually there are non-explosive volcanoes, whose lava flow quickly to the sea or the ground around it.

Another unconsidered geological feature is the influence of rivers. Rivers carry a uncountable mass of sediments to the sea, and, especially when they form a delta, they change the coastline, in a very short time (Think of the delta of the Mississippi, which is advancing very rapidly in the centuries). Thus the Xengi delta cannot have been remaining the same in 3000 years of history. If we take the coastline drawn in maps depicting the Xengiman around 0 z.e., in 3480 the delta would probably have reached the Tanel peninsula. Also the alluvial plains usually are subjected to disastrous floods which change the course of the rivers, so that a city can lose its access to the river itself (a city near my town was founded on the left side of its river, and now after 2000 year it is located on the right side, after some floods in the Middle Ages: as control was lost the river moved, the city did not). Rivers can become tributary to major rivers, or begin to flow directly to the sea in their entire lifetime.

Also interesting is the Skourene sea. Compared with Baltic sea on Earth, it could be formed by the sinking of the ground, pressed by the enormous weight of the ice during an hypothetical ice age in the distant past, as it lies near the South Pole.

Maybe we can think that the iliî, with their advanced technology, in past times developed some kind of machinery which can still dissipate the enormous seismic energy, preventing earthquakes. But this is something like killing Almea, as tectonic activity shows the planet’s vitality and refuels the atmosphere via volcanoes with new gases, thus I don’t think the iliî would have made something against the nature of their planet, even if geological events are so dangerous.

User avatar
Salmoneus
Sanno
Sanno
Posts: 3197
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 5:00 pm
Location: One of the dark places of the world

Re: Almean geology

Post by Salmoneus »

Or he just hasn't mentioned the earthquakes because they don't matter. I mean, if you add up all the earthquakes and volcanoes that have mattered enough on earth to get a serious place in history books, how many have there really been? The odd city here or there has been destroyed, but that's usually more interesting for archaeological reasons, rather than actually affecting history.
Blog: [url]http://vacuouswastrel.wordpress.com/[/url]

But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!

Mornche Geddick
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 370
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:22 pm
Location: UK

Re: Almean geology

Post by Mornche Geddick »

Not necessarily; there's probably a few good stories he could tell about volcanic eruptions and/or earthquakes without adding more than a footnote to the Historical Atlas.

Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Re: Almean geology

Post by Buks »

What I had in my mind it wasn't certainly a complete rewriting of the historical atlas.. I only wanted to underline the relevance of geology and related events. In my opinion Almea is maybe one of the best developed conworld, and why to ignore geological events. Yes, they surely do not affect history at a large scale, but their limited effects could surely mean something.

For example, if Lufào had been struck by a powerful earthquake, Gurdago could take advantage of the sudden weakness of Andào to begin a war. Or even I thought, but it's a too great change in history, and I don't consider it realistic, of a tsunami wave, originated off the coast of Kebri, hitting Verduria city. The city surely would survive, but damages in the harbour and on Soa Nezi would be devastating.

Sure is that on Earth geological events could happen randomly, and nobody knows who would be favoured by casuality, in a context of people who could go war at every moment.

Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Re: Almean geology

Post by Buks »

Maybe only the hydrografic question may be disturbing, as the maps should have to be drawn again in those specific zones. But there are many examples on Earth. Ur in Mesopotamia was founded as a costal city, but now it lies 250 km [155 miles] inland. And Ravenna was chosen as the last capital city of the Roman Empire because of the swamps surrounding the city in 5 century CE, formed by the river Po which debouched in the sea near the city, while now Ravenna is surrounded by fields, and the Po delta lies 60 km [37 miles] north of the city.

zompist
Boardlord
Boardlord
Posts: 3368
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:26 pm
Location: In the den
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by zompist »

These are definitely good things for conworlder to think about. As I'm going over the Atlas anyway, I'll keep it in mind. Probably the most likely place to experience change would be the Xengi delta; it might explain why different cities have been dominant there at different times.

The most likely volcanic areas tend to be out of the way of major civilizations. It'd be nice to use something geologic to get rid of Aites (see the 1750 C map), but I think it's too far from the mountains. Maybe a major flood would help.

I did spend a little time on large-scale tectonics; if you look at the map of Ereláe you can see that Moreo Ascai and Lascita lie on a mid-ocean ridge which is separating Ereláe from Lebiscuri.

su_liam
Sanci
Sanci
Posts: 64
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:27 pm

Re: Almean geology

Post by su_liam »

zompist wrote:The most likely volcanic areas tend to be out of the way of major civilizations. It'd be nice to use something geologic to get rid of Aites (see the 1750 C map), but I think it's too far from the mountains. Maybe a major flood would help.
Maybe somewhere upstream a big volcano with an alpine glacier is getting ready to blow its top and melt it some ice.
My little attempt at a blog dedicated to worldbuilding Astrographer.
World-building/Non-linguistic Resources

Bristel
Smeric
Smeric
Posts: 1258
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:07 pm
Location: Miracle, Inc. Headquarters
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by Bristel »

su_liam wrote:
zompist wrote:The most likely volcanic areas tend to be out of the way of major civilizations. It'd be nice to use something geologic to get rid of Aites (see the 1750 C map), but I think it's too far from the mountains. Maybe a major flood would help.
Maybe somewhere upstream a big volcano with an alpine glacier is getting ready to blow its top and melt it some ice.
A lahar-based disaster would be an excellent thing to write about in the annals of the history of Almea.

There are modern lahars in Earth history which have certainly been large enough to warrant some kind of note... especially Armero lahar in 1985...

Also, there is evidence that lahars devastated large areas around the Puget Sound beneath Mount Rainier in Washington state in the past, so lahars are a big geological worry for people in the area, beyond volcanic eruptions, earthquakes and tsunamis...
[bɹ̠ˤʷɪs.təɫ]
Nōn quālibet inīquā cupiditāte illectus hoc agō
Yo te pongo en tu lugar...
Taisc mach Daró

Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Re: Almean geology

Post by Buks »

I took a look on the situation of Aites. The river Serea, on whose banks the city rises, seems to be shorter than the other Eretald rivers. Shorter rivers are usually more unstable than longer ones. During the Cadhinorian times the river was probably put under strict control, then when the troubles of the Dark Years began, this control was lost; after the city had suffered these trouble and saw its population reduced, a major flood could occur, whatever it could be its cause. The flood, as well as inundating the city, could have changed the course of the river, leaving the city some miles from the new river path. This could have urged its population to move and to settle another village or town still lying on the banks of the river, like Muduca or Zeirdan on the sea.

An earthquake can occur also at a certain distance from the mountains, it depends on the type of the nearby fault. In the case of a subduction, earthquakes can strike at many kilometres from the fault line (but not too much far).

Luckily for the Almeans, the volcanic areas seem to be far from their cities, but some of them surely know the effects of the volcanic eruptions. :)

I saw the map and those islands are perfectly placed for an ocean ridge! I tried to draw a sketch on the map of Eastern Erelàe of the likely tectonic plates. If you want I can send it.

I hope I've been helpful to you, my intention was (and is) to suggest new ways to create the history of this beautiful conworld! :D

User avatar
linguofreak
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:39 pm
Location: Somewhere
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by linguofreak »

One thing here is that Almea may in fact *not* be very geologically active: It's small, and tectonic activity on small worlds dies down quicker than on large ones, all else being equal. Other factors, such as the age and density of the planet, can tweak this, but, in general, you can expect Almea to be less tectonically active than Earth, how much less being a function of the aforementioned other factors.

Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Re: Almean geology

Post by Buks »

Yes, it's true that Almea is smaller than Earth.. the only we don't know is the age of Almea (is it 4.5 billion years old like our planet, younger or older?).. We cannot know.. It's sure that can be less geologically active.. Nevertheless it has features that show sure signs of activity (and the same presence of the oceans should induce the tectonic activity).. if Almea were Earth, I'd say: Let's see what nature wants to tell about.. here it could be the future history.

Neek
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 355
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2002 12:13 pm
Location: im itësin
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by Neek »

Geology and history aside, look at the linguistic evidence. Of all of Zompist's languages, only Verdurian has a word for earthquake, parnahireo. I doubt this is an artistic aside to point out that there is no tectonic activity on the planet, but rather an indication that he hasn't paid much attention to the significance of it as of yet. Pointing it out to him might incline him to find some details or information on it that's not otherwise available, posted, or made up.

User avatar
linguofreak
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:39 pm
Location: Somewhere
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by linguofreak »

Neek wrote:Geology and history aside, look at the linguistic evidence. Of all of Zompist's languages, only Verdurian has a word for earthquake, parnahireo. I doubt this is an artistic aside to point out that there is no tectonic activity on the planet, but rather an indication that he hasn't paid much attention to the significance of it as of yet. Pointing it out to him might incline him to find some details or information on it that's not otherwise available, posted, or made up.
That's pretty much what he himself has already said in this thread. That said, Almea is small enough that he won't want to go overboard with it either.

Oerjan2
Niš
Niš
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 3:29 pm

Re: Almean geology

Post by Oerjan2 »

Buks wrote:The relatively low altitude of the mountains in northern Qaraumia seems to indicate that the Qarau plate (easternmost coast of Ereláe) is something like the Pacific plate on Earth, which is colliding with the North American plate along the S. Andreas fault, sliding one alongside the other.
Another interpretation is that the Qaraumian mountains are old enough that the plates whose common boundary created them has long since fused together. Look e.g. at the mountains of the northern Scandinavian peninsula on Earth (Sweden/Norway) - they're fairly tall (up to 2100 meters), enough so to cause fairly serious difficulties for humans which suggests that they'd be a very formidable barrier indeed to uesti, but the seismic activity in the area is very low; for most of the range, the nearest plate boundary is the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. Or look at the mountains of Great Britain; lower still, and even further away from the plate boundaries.
Also interesting is the Skourene sea. Compared with Baltic sea on Earth, it could be formed by the sinking of the ground, pressed by the enormous weight of the ice during an hypothetical ice age in the distant past, as it lies near the South Pole.
Hm. How far south does the Skourene Sea reach - or more importantly, how far south do the peninsulas that border it reach? Continent-depressing ice doesn't form very easily in the open sea, and there's no land mass south of the Skourene Sea where the glaciers can start. Scandinavia OTOH reaches approx. 71°N, while the Baltic (or rather the Bottnian Gulf) doesn't even reach the Polar Circle - IOW, there's quite a lot of land north of the Baltic where the ice can form.

...BTW, what's the axial tilt of Almea? I can't find any mention of it in the Almeopedia...

Regards,

Oerjan

Mashmakhan
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: Not here anymore. Goodbye, ZBB.

Re: Almean geology

Post by Mashmakhan »

If Almea is anything like my conworld, the reason why geologic activity - and the historical and linguistic evidence for it - might be largely missing is because, when it happens, it happens all at once. At any other time there would probably be so little tectonic activity whatsoever that no one would ever notice it.

Think about it: Shortly after developing a decent lexicon count for words like "volcano" and "quake," the people who spoke these words would be dead shortly after.

User avatar
Radius Solis
Smeric
Smeric
Posts: 1248
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2004 5:40 pm
Location: Si'ahl
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by Radius Solis »

By that logic, Mashmakhan, I've been dead for ten years.

CaesarVincens
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 204
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 7:26 pm

Re: Almean geology

Post by CaesarVincens »

Mashmakhan wrote:If Almea is anything like my conworld, the reason why geologic activity - and the historical and linguistic evidence for it - might be largely missing is because, when it happens, it happens all at once. At any other time there would probably be so little tectonic activity whatsoever that no one would ever notice it.

Think about it: Shortly after developing a decent lexicon count for words like "volcano" and "quake," the people who spoke these words would be dead shortly after.
I'm sorry, but that is worse reasoning than a strong Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Over the course of some 6,000 years, someone somewhere will have witnessed a volcano if there are any to witness and live to tell about it. And more so for earthquakes.

Earthquakes only kill people directly if they knock down buildings or cause land- or mud-slides. And there are going to be survivors of all but the most catastrophic volcanic events. Surely, the Romans were able to invent the word Volcano describing Mt. Etna.

Mashmakhan
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: Not here anymore. Goodbye, ZBB.

Re: Almean geology

Post by Mashmakhan »

You guys are thinking of an Earth-like world with plate tectonics, no? A few volcanoes aren't going to kill all life on the planet. Even super-volcanoes like the one in Yellowstone didn't obliderate(sp?) life from the face of the planet. What I am talking about is something a bit closer to Venusian geology, where everything just goes off all at once. My planet has a very thick crust which is partially the result of a build-up of decayed lead, so the planet doesn't completely renew itself every time or everything on it definately would be dead.

Anyway, and as I was saying, IF Almea was anything like my planet, there probably wouldn't be any significant numbers of words for geologic activity until it was too late. If you know what I mean...unless it was exactly like my planet. Then I would be nervous.

User avatar
Drydic
Smeric
Smeric
Posts: 1652
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 12:23 pm
Location: I am a prisoner in my own mind.
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by Drydic »

And since Almea is supposed to be an earthlike planet, why would you assume it has anything venusian (shouldn't that be venerian?) in its geology?
Image Image
Common Zein Scratchpad & other Stuffs! OMG AN ACTUAL CONPOST WTFBBQ

Formerly known as Drydic.

Mashmakhan
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: Not here anymore. Goodbye, ZBB.

Re: Almean geology

Post by Mashmakhan »

Disregarding the big IF in both previous posts.....

My mistake, then. I should have noticed "Earthlike" in Almea's description and concidered it before placing my comment. I will think better next time.

Buks
Niš
Niš
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 am
Location: Italy

Re: Almean geology

Post by Buks »

It is sure that people may know volcanoes and earthquakes and survive them.. and give them a name!

Linguistically I think the name for volcanoes are interesting, as it came from the Italian island of Vulcano (the same name of the geological structure in Italian), which Romans took as a stereotype of this kind of mountains which erupt fire and thus they applied the same name at every similar mount. In turn the name of the island came from a Roman god of fire, Vulcanus (whose etymology is still uncertain), which the ancient Roman believed to live under that island, and his activity as a blacksmith for the gods was the source of eruptions and earthquakes.

I found an evidence that Almea has volcanoes and earthquakes (or had) in the Count of Years, as it is told that in the wars of Giants and Ogres, the latter ones did use them against the first ones, and that a volcano was in the place of today Nasuael Swamps.

User avatar
Drydic
Smeric
Smeric
Posts: 1652
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2002 12:23 pm
Location: I am a prisoner in my own mind.
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by Drydic »

Buks wrote:I found an evidence that Almea has volcanoes and earthquakes (or had) in the Count of Years, as it is told that in the wars of Giants and Ogres, the latter ones did use them against the first ones, and that a volcano was in the place of today Nasuael Swamps.
Hmm...looking at the map of Eretald, putting a volcano in Nasuael Swamp would be a bit problematic, but not impossible if the landscape (as it seems, of course the map* doesn't show everything) could be changed slightly. It'd have to be an extremely old volcano tho. Older than the Rhânor Range as things stand now to be sure. I'd imagine Zomp doesn't want to have the swamp ringed in by a giant crater (could be wrong tho). With some exposition on the features of that exact composition of that area, it could happen. Or it could always be moved, or maybe the Cuzeians misinterpreted what they heard.

*from http://www.zompist.com/drill4.htm
Image Image
Common Zein Scratchpad & other Stuffs! OMG AN ACTUAL CONPOST WTFBBQ

Formerly known as Drydic.

zompist
Boardlord
Boardlord
Posts: 3368
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:26 pm
Location: In the den
Contact:

Re: Almean geology

Post by zompist »

It's not intended as geology... volcanos don't generally become swamps. But it's true that it's evidence that the Cuzeians had experience with volcanos.

User avatar
Pthagnar
Avisaru
Avisaru
Posts: 702
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2002 12:45 pm
Location: Hole of Aspiration

Re: Almean geology

Post by Pthagnar »

wat

Mashmakhan
Lebom
Lebom
Posts: 136
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: Not here anymore. Goodbye, ZBB.

Re: Almean geology

Post by Mashmakhan »

zompist wrote:It's not intended as geology... volcanos don't generally become swamps.
I know you typed somewhere that you don't exactly want to provide a scientific explanation for everything on Almea but there may be a way you could explain this phenomenon.

See atoll formation:
Image

If your volcano occurs on land, maybe you could find a way for it to collapse in much the same manner and become a swamp...just an idea.

Post Reply