Verdurian Mathematical Operators

Pthagnar · Post by **Pthagnar** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:16 pm

I've been peering at these for some time and trying to see how they're derived. Equality is some sort of pi... Multiplication is a spoon, subtraction is a fish and addition is a little Ch. Division is a caret. Why of course, it's all so simple! Or is it?

Post by **zompist** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:43 pm

Pthag wrote:I've been peering at these for some time and trying to see how they're derived. Equality is some sort of pi... Multiplication is a spoon, subtraction is a fish and addition is a little Ch. Division is a caret. Why of course, it's all so simple! Or is it?

Addition is a little "er". Substraction is a small s, I think-- frankly I've forgotten. The other two-- hmm. Keep guessing.

JT_the_Ninja · Post by **JT_the_Ninja** » Sat Jul 10, 2004 1:03 am

That's the one thing that must just sorta develop in a conscript. You have to let the symbols flow naturally from words to signs.

Xephyr · Post by **Xephyr** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 8:19 am

That begs the question: how did our <+, -, ?, ?> develop? But perhaps that does not belong in this forum...

Soap · Post by **Soap** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 9:26 am

well, the divided-by sign looks obvious enough: it's a dividing line. And the equals sign came out of some mathematician back in like 1600 who said "nothing could be more equal than two lines".

Mecislau · Post by **Mecislau** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 10:40 am

Mercator wrote:well, the divided-by sign looks obvious enough: it's a dividing line. And the equals sign came out of some mathematician back in like 1600 who said "nothing could be more equal than two lines".

Actually, mabye not: http://www.roma.unisa.edu.au/07305/symbols.htm

EDIT: That page seems to cut off mid-sentence... The stuff on = is missing.

Jar Jar Binks · Post by **Jar Jar Binks** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 1:48 pm

I remember the name of the book that "=" came from-- I think it was called "The Whetstone of Witte". The writer said he would use two parallel lines as an abbreviation for "is equalle to" because "no two other Things can be moare equalle". I can't remember the writer's name, though. (There was a facsimile of a page from that book in some book I once read, I can't remember what book it was.)

Åge Kruger · Post by **Åge Kruger** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 2:54 pm

It was covered in Adam Hart-Davis' Local Heroes.

Jaaaaaa · Post by **Jaaaaaa** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 4:46 pm

Jar Jar Binks wrote:I remember the name of the book that "=" came from-- I think it was called "The Whetstone of Witte". The writer said he would use two parallel lines as an abbreviation for "is equalle to" because "no two other Things can be moare equalle". I can't remember the writer's name, though. (There was a facsimile of a page from that book in some book I once read, I can't remember what book it was.)

Correcte. I can't remember the guy's name either, though. Robert something?

DF · Post by DF » Tue Jul 13, 2004 7:04 pm

Jaaaaaa wrote:Correcte.

Incorrecte.

Jaaaaaa · Post by **Jaaaaaa** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 7:05 pm

Amulek wrote:
Jaaaaaa wrote:Correcte.
Incorrecte.

Really? I remember reading about that in my math book. The facts were the same- Whetstone of Witte and everything.

Soap · Post by **Soap** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 9:19 pm

Maknas wrote:
Mercator wrote:well, the divided-by sign looks obvious enough: it's a dividing line. And the equals sign came out of some mathematician back in like 1600 who said "nothing could be more equal than two lines".
Actually, mabye not: http://www.roma.unisa.edu.au/07305/symbols.htm

EDIT: That page seems to cut off mid-sentence... The stuff on = is missing.

Yeah, they probably got an incomplete transfer during FTP and then never checked the page afterward. I wonder how long it's been like that?

Lucaya · Post by **Lucaya** » Mon Jul 19, 2004 7:27 pm

On a related topic, just how far along is Verduria mathematically? I assume they have at least geometry and algebra, but do they have calculus? Do they have limits? Can they differentiate or integrate? How about discrete math?

Post by **zompist** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 1:06 am

Lucaya wrote:On a related topic, just how far along is Verduria mathematically? I assume they have at least geometry and algebra, but do they have calculus? Do they have limits? Can they differentiate or integrate? How about discrete math?

I don't know, the question hasn't really come up... calculus was a very important step in our development of physics (and also disposed of some tricky philosophical problems). But it seems very possible that competence in celestial mechanics could come without it.

Liunra · Post by **Liunra** » Thu Dec 30, 2004 7:19 pm

Ooh, this is my first post.

Hmm, this is rather an old thread. I just have to post this though, because I find it funny that I read this only yesterday.
Anyhow though, on the origin of plus and minus signs. It's funny, because they have origins and stuffs about the alphabet and keyboards and symbols such as these in a book I got only yesterday. But anyhow. According to the book, the plus and minus signs were invented by Italian shipping clerks. When a load of cargo was a little over the specified weight, they wrote a P with a line over it (the P was for pi?, which is more in Italian). Eventually the line dropped to the middle of the P, and the curve of the p shrank and then disappeared, which leaves a plus sign. And then for minus signs, if the load of crago was a little less than the specified weight, they wrote an M (for meno, less) with a line over it, but then the M became lowercase and eventually disappeared altogether, leaving the minus sign.
And according to the book you're right about the equals sign, it was introduced in the 16th century by Robert Recorde in The Whetstone of Witte.
Hmm, that was very very long.

Oh, the book is Quirky QWERTY, by the way. Tis very interesting.

Jar Jar Binks · Post by **Jar Jar Binks** » Thu Dec 30, 2004 8:01 pm

vec · Post by **vec** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 7:34 am

Liunra wrote:Ooh, this is my first post.
Hmm, this is rather an old thread. I just have to post this though, because I find it funny that I read this only yesterday.
Anyhow though, on the origin of plus and minus signs. It's funny, because they have origins and stuffs about the alphabet and keyboards and symbols such as these in a book I got only yesterday. But anyhow. According to the book, the plus and minus signs were invented by Italian shipping clerks. When a load of cargo was a little over the specified weight, they wrote a P with a line over it (the P was for pi?, which is more in Italian). Eventually the line dropped to the middle of the P, and the curve of the p shrank and then disappeared, which leaves a plus sign. And then for minus signs, if the load of crago was a little less than the specified weight, they wrote an M (for meno, less) with a line over it, but then the M became lowercase and eventually disappeared altogether, leaving the minus sign.
And according to the book you're right about the equals sign, it was introduced in the 16th century by Robert Recorde in The Whetstone of Witte.
Hmm, that was very very long. Oh, the book is Quirky QWERTY, by the way. Tis very interesting.

Welcome. ?ttu ser?os.

Jar Jar Binks · Post by **Jar Jar Binks** » Sun Jan 02, 2005 5:34 pm

Herra Ratatoskr · Post by **Herra Ratatoskr** » Sun Jan 02, 2005 5:38 pm

Hi Liunra! Here's a slightly belated welcome to the Board.

zompist bboard

Verdurian Mathematical Operators

Verdurian Mathematical Operators

Re: Verdurian Mathematical Operators