Conlangery Podcast (Latest Ep: #94: Face and Politeness)

[finlay]

How can you go a whole episode without mentioning Belgium?

[Ollock]

How can you go a whole episode without mentioning Belgium?

I'm sorry? I'm not familiar with Flemish or Waloon French, that's why. I think I had a Belgian linguistics professor, if it helps.

[Bob Johnson]

How can you go a whole episode without mentioning [censored]?

My word, mind your language, please.

[finlay]

Do you want to explain it or shall I?

[Bob Johnson]

Adams (1978) reports the following:

In today’s modern Galaxy there is, of course, very little still held to be unspeakable. Many words and expressions which only a matter of decades ago were considered so distastefully explicit that were they merely to be breathed in public, the perpetrator would be shunned, barred from polite society, and, in extreme cases, shot through the lungs, are now thought to be very healthy and proper, and their use in everyday speech is seen as evidence of a well-adjusted, relaxed, and totally unf [bleep!] ked-up personality. So, for instance, when in a recent national speech, the financial minister of the Royal World Estate of Qualvista actually dared to say that due to one thing and another, and the fact that no one had made any food for awhile and the king seemed to have died, and that most of the population had been on holiday now for over three years, the economy had now arrived at what he called, “One whole juju-flop situation,” everyone was so pleased he felt able to come out and say it, that they quite failed to notice that their five-thousand-year-old civilisation had just collapsed overnight. But though even words like “juju-flop,” “swut,” and “turlingdrome” are now perfectly acceptable in common usage, there is one word that is still beyond the pale. The concept it embodies is so revolting that the publication or broadcast of the word is utterly forbidden in all parts of the galaxy except one - where they don’t know what it means. That word is “Belgium” and it is only ever used by loose-tongued people like Zaphod Beeblebrox in situations of dire provocation.

Adams, Douglas N. (1978). The Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy (Fit the Tenth). Radio.

[Jipí]

You forgot to mark that this is a multi-line quotation by indenting it, setting the line spacing to single and reducing the font to 10pt. 10 points from Gryffindor.

[Eyowa]

I have been trying to even out the volume since we started the show. So far all I have managed is horrible clipping for Will and Bianca while I'm still much quieter. I have no idea how to fix this problem with my current setup. Maybe if I get a mixer and a real mike and set up two computers I can figure it out, but I still have no money. Trying to fix that problem as well.

Are you using Windows or Mac? If the latter, you could try Soundflower, which is free and which I use all the time for audio-capturing. Basically it reroutes the audio output from one application to another, bypassing the speakers and mic. I'm pretty sure there's a way it can mix mic input and application input, too. It's a bit of a hassle to get working properly, though, just because you have to manage the audio output/input/monitor levels on everything.

If you're on Windows, I know Audacity lets you capture audio directly from the soundcard output. You might even be able to use one instance of it to record from the mic and one to record from Skype, although I haven't tried this.

I love the podcast, BTW. Keep up the awesome work!

[Ollock]

Adams (1978) reports the following:

In today’s modern Galaxy there is, of course, very little still held to be unspeakable. Many words and expressions which only a matter of decades ago were considered so distastefully explicit that were they merely to be breathed in public, the perpetrator would be shunned, barred from polite society, and, in extreme cases, shot through the lungs, are now thought to be very healthy and proper, and their use in everyday speech is seen as evidence of a well-adjusted, relaxed, and totally unf [bleep!] ked-up personality. So, for instance, when in a recent national speech, the financial minister of the Royal World Estate of Qualvista actually dared to say that due to one thing and another, and the fact that no one had made any food for awhile and the king seemed to have died, and that most of the population had been on holiday now for over three years, the economy had now arrived at what he called, “One whole juju-flop situation,” everyone was so pleased he felt able to come out and say it, that they quite failed to notice that their five-thousand-year-old civilisation had just collapsed overnight. But though even words like “juju-flop,” “swut,” and “turlingdrome” are now perfectly acceptable in common usage, there is one word that is still beyond the pale. The concept it embodies is so revolting that the publication or broadcast of the word is utterly forbidden in all parts of the galaxy except one - where they don’t know what it means. That word is “Belgium” and it is only ever used by loose-tongued people like Zaphod Beeblebrox in situations of dire provocation.

Adams, Douglas N. (1978). The Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy (Fit the Tenth). Radio.

Ah, well, the fact is I've only read those books once.

I have been trying to even out the volume since we started the show. So far all I have managed is horrible clipping for Will and Bianca while I'm still much quieter. I have no idea how to fix this problem with my current setup. Maybe if I get a mixer and a real mike and set up two computers I can figure it out, but I still have no money. Trying to fix that problem as well.

Are you using Windows or Mac? If the latter, you could try Soundflower, which is free and which I use all the time for audio-capturing. Basically it reroutes the audio output from one application to another, bypassing the speakers and mic. I'm pretty sure there's a way it can mix mic input and application input, too. It's a bit of a hassle to get working properly, though, just because you have to manage the audio output/input/monitor levels on everything.

If you're on Windows, I know Audacity lets you capture audio directly from the soundcard output. You might even be able to use one instance of it to record from the mic and one to record from Skype, although I haven't tried this.

I love the podcast, BTW. Keep up the awesome work!

I am on Windows using Audacity. Multiple instances of it won't work -- the preferences are global, and what's more many of the boards I saw said that multiple instances tend to cause crashes. I'm hoping in the future that I can set up a second computer (I have a spare Linux box) to capture my own audio and record Skype on the main Windows box, but currently I don't have space to do that.

[Ossicone]

Well we didn't get Belgium in but I think managed to sneak in 'smeg.'

[finlay]

Ironically, when you work out what smeg means it's really quite disgusting.

Also, yes, buggery and sodomy are the same thing, but bugger isn't a strong swear here, more sort of low-to-mid level swear. Like you maybe wouldn't say it around your grandma but you wouldn't generally get strong repercussions for saying it elsewhere. A bit stronger than "bloody", which is very mild (although again quite disgusting when you think about it). Still very satisfying to shout out in a fit of rage. It's pretty much divorced from the original meaning, basically, like you were saying.

[Ollock]

Ironically, when you work out what smeg means it's really quite disgusting.

Also, yes, buggery and sodomy are the same thing, but bugger isn't a strong swear here, more sort of low-to-mid level swear. Like you maybe wouldn't say it around your grandma but you wouldn't generally get strong repercussions for saying it elsewhere. A bit stronger than "bloody", which is very mild (although again quite disgusting when you think about it). Still very satisfying to shout out in a fit of rage. It's pretty much divorced from the original meaning, basically, like you were saying.

Interestingly, shortly after recording, I was reading A Clash of Kings when one character (I think it was Theon Greyjoy) thinking of Cersei Lannister, had the thought "May the Others bugger her with a sword!" Of course, knowing the actual meaning of "bugger" brought a very vivid and disturbing image to my mind.

[finlay]

To be fair, I can't think of an alternative meaning to "bugger" as a verb. Was the writer actually, like, British, or was he using it affectedly?

[Ollock]

To be fair, I can't think of an alternative meaning to "bugger" as a verb. Was the writer actually, like, British, or was he using it affectedly?

The author is George R.R. Martin. He's American, but large parts of his world are drawn from British history, so he may be a bit of an Anglophile (I think he uses American spellings, at least).

[finlay]

Ah, right. He should then be taught that "bugger" as a verb only refers to sodomy, it's just that as a swear-word it's just within the bounds of acceptability to use around children, but only as long as you don't tell them what it means. You can call something a bugger or exclaim "bugger!" when annoyed, but to bugger means to ram something up someone's arse. Of course, he may have been going for that, especially when the something is a sword. I don't really know the context.

[Ollock]

Ah, right. He should then be taught that "bugger" as a verb only refers to sodomy, it's just that as a swear-word it's just within the bounds of acceptability to use around children, but only as long as you don't tell them what it means. You can call something a bugger or exclaim "bugger!" when annoyed, but to bugger means to ram something up someone's arse. Of course, he may have been going for that, especially when the something is a sword. I don't really know the context.

Considering the makes very liberal use of the words "fuck", "shit", and "cunt" throughout his book series, I don't think this concerns him too much.

[Přemysl]

When I read that line years ago I took it to basically mean "may the undead boogiemen anally rape her with a sword", which seems to me like a rather inventive curse.

Speaking of which, no mention of some of the interesting Arabic curses? Or are those not real and just some orientalist fantasy of Arabic culture?

I'm glad blasphemy was given a little air time. But having grown up with the sacre it would have been nice to see a few more examples. Something interesting from my own experiences is the word sapristi. It is a minced oath regarding the sacred host. My understanding is that in Quebec it is considered archaic. In the dialect I learned and grew up with, which can be archaic, it is still strong enough not to be used in front of children.

This podcast has made me to start redesign Majiusgaru's swears. So many of them were about sex but an aboriginal people they really aren't that hung up on sex. So I'll reduce that in number, increase some stupidity comments, and maybe add a few blasphemes while I'm at it.

[Ollock]

When I read that line years ago I took it to basically mean "may the undead boogiemen anally rape her with a sword", which seems to me like a rather inventive curse.

Speaking of which, no mention of some of the interesting Arabic curses? Or are those not real and just some orientalist fantasy of Arabic culture?

I learned a couple Arabic swear words from Saudi friends, but totally forgot to mention it. That said, I'm not sure if I really say them properly.

I'm glad blasphemy was given a little air time. But having grown up with the sacre it would have been nice to see a few more examples. Something interesting from my own experiences is the word sapristi. It is a minced oath regarding the sacred host. My understanding is that in Quebec it is considered archaic. In the dialect I learned and grew up with, which can be archaic, it is still strong enough not to be used in front of children.

I see. Yeah, I think unfortunately none of us are too familiar with blasphemies, or rather it doesn't affect us much. I don't think any of us are actively religious, and the languages I know best are Chinese -- which doesn't have a strong religious background to it -- and Spanish -- which despite being spoken by predominantly Catholic cultures doesn't seem to be too big on blasphemy taboos.

This podcast has made me to start redesign Majiusgaru's swears. So many of them were about sex but an aboriginal people they really aren't that hung up on sex. So I'll reduce that in number, increase some stupidity comments, and maybe add a few blasphemes while I'm at it.

Glad we're having an effect. Post a thread on it soon, please.

[Ollock]

New Episode: Conlangery #14: Verb Framing and Postural Verbs

[Přemysl]

This is an interesting topic I hadn't given a tremendous of thought.

I was using anatomic metaphor for location like Tzotzil. That means LOC 3S-face object means on the front of an object, LOC 3S-skin object means on its surface, LOC 3S-head object means on top, etc. But, I hadn't thought about postural or movement verbs and what they encode. I only had nemi "go", re the locative, and reisau "sit". Means of travel was done through the instrumental, so "I sit on the head of the table by means of the fireman" would mean I was put on the table by the fireman.

Now I am thinking of having a series of movement and postural verbs based on volition, posture, and path. By path I mean things like going in a straight line versus swerving or tumbling. Involuntary bouncing by means of the front of a car is bad. Of course now I have to actually go make these words.

[Ollock]

Felt a little generous today, so I'm posting this early: Conlangery #15: Getting out of Creative Ruts

I may be posting even earlier than this in the future. I am preparing to take a job that will require me to get up very early in the morning, and where I may not always be able to do stuff online at noon on Mondays, so be aware that the posting time could change.

[Bob Johnson]

Oh dear. I seem to be hooked.

[Ollock]

Just a heads up, I removed an audio link for Tmaśareʔ. At least one podcatcher downloaded it instead of the proper audio file. That sample can be found on the Tmaśareʔ page.

[Ossicone]

Oh dear. I seem to be hooked.

Our secret plan to infiltrate the minds of the conlangers of the world is working!

[Ollock]

Oh dear. I seem to be hooked.

Our secret plan to infiltrate the minds of the conlangers of the world is working!

What was the second step of that plan again? A couple thousand zombie followers doesn't seem so useful.

[Ossicone]

We had a few options:
a. Make them learn our conlangs.
b. Take over the world.
c. Make them give me money.
d. All the above.