Romanization challenge thread

Substantial postings about constructed languages and constructed worlds in general. Good place to mention your own or evaluate someone else's. Put quick questions in C&C Quickies instead.
Aybuben
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Aybuben »

/m n/ <m n>
/p b t d k kː g qː ʔ/ <p b t d k kk g qq q>
/ts tsː tʃ tʃː tɬː/ < c cc č čč ć>
/tʼ kʼ kːʼ qːʼ/ <tx kx kkx qqx>
/tsʼ tsːʼ tʃʼ tʃːʼ tɬːʼ/ <cx ccx čx ččx ćx>
/s sː ʃ ʃː ɬ ɬː x xː X Xː ʜ/ <s ss š šš ś śś x xx xh xxh hh>
/v z ʒ ʁ ʢ ɦ/ <v z ž rr gg h>
/r l j/ <r l j>
/a e i o u/ <a e i o u>


Noś maćxiś vixxana, xxalda śuqqxśuqqxun
Xxurda kver čxvan unev, bida veccxun dun
Xxurugi batxaśun ceve unago
Co śaral raggalda ggodov kkolev dun

Śar čvaxxhuleb bugo čabxhil kkxalaqqan
Śin kkanacxuleb bugo gančazda txasan
Txaramarradiseb qqxval baleb bugo
Qqxo śikxilan ditsa sorrab raććxalda


noɬ matɬːʼiɬ vixːana, xːalda ɬuqːʼɬuqːʼun
xːurda kver tʃʼvan unev, bida vetsːʼun dun
xːurugi batʼaɬun tseve unag
tso ɬaral raʢalda ʢodov kːolev dun

ɬar tʃvaXːuleb bugo tʃabXil kːʼalaqːan
ɬin kʼantsʼuleb bugo gantʃʼazda tʼasan
tʼaramaʁadiseb qːʼval baleb bugo
qːʼo ɬikʼilan ditsa soʁab ratɬːʼalda
Last edited by Aybuben on Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Vesbuiurtohnfushamägvä. Vpüpiłätsyäc?

Aybuben
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Aybuben »

/m n/ <m n>
/p b t d k kː g qː ʔ/ <p b t d k kk g qq q>
/ts tsː tʃ tʃː tɬː/ <ts tss tx txx tsl>
/tʼ kʼ kːʼ qːʼ/ <tc kc kkc qqc>
/tsʼ tsːʼ tʃʼ tʃːʼ tɬːʼ/ <tsc tssc txc txxc tslc>
/s sː ʃ ʃː ɬ ɬː x xː X Xː ʜ/ <s ss x xx sl ssl kh kkh qh qqh hh>
/v z ʒ ʁ ʢ ɦ/ <v z zz ŗ ģ h
/r l j/ <r l j>
/a e i o u/ <a e i o u>


Nosl matsslcisl vikkhana, kkhalda sluqqcsluqqcun
Kkhurda kver txcvan unev, bida vetsscun dun
Kkhurugi batcaslun tseve unag
Tso slaral raģalda ģodov kkolev dun

Slar txvaqqhuleb bugo txabqhil kkcalaqqan
Slin kcantsculeb bugo gantxcazda tcasan
Tcaramaŗadiseb qqcval baleb bugo
Qqco slikcilan ditsa soŗab ratsslcalda



noɬ matɬːʼiɬ vixːana, xːalda ɬuqːʼɬuqːʼun
xːurda kver tʃʼvan unev, bida vetsːʼun dun
xːurugi batʼaɬun tseve unag
tso ɬaral raʢalda ʢodov kːolev dun

ɬar tʃvaXːuleb bugo tʃabXil kːʼalaqːan
ɬin kʼantsʼuleb bugo gantʃʼazda tʼasan
tʼaramaʁadiseb qːʼval baleb bugo
qːʼo ɬikʼilan ditsa soʁab ratɬːʼalda
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Nortaneous
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Nortaneous »

I'm fucking with Miar again

/pʰ tʰ tsʰ t͡ɬʰ ʈ͡ʂʰ tɕʰ kʰ qʰ/ <f th s lh çh čh x xh>
/b d̪ d dz dl ɟ/ <b dh d j dl gh>
/pʼ tʼ t͡sʼ t͡ɬʼ ʈ͡ʂʼ cʼ kʼ qʼ ʔ/ <p t c l r ç č k q 1>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m n ň ņ ny ng>
/r̪ r ɽ j w h/ <r ƶ z y v h>

Əň1nyaňeqsuk, tə1nadyazənt. Xingodomävrim? Xüyohhädomrim. Dbärxhmyazzan1 myər.

I don't like the carons, especially since /n/ is not uncommon and fuck Turkmen orthography, but this is still an improvement; it's looking more and more like an actual language.
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nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
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Vuvuzela
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Vuvuzela »

My attempt at Miar (since you posted it here, I assume you don't have a problem with other people trying)
Also, I'm assuming you have some kind of thing where the aspirates appear as fricatives a lot of the time, so I'll try to represent that.
/pʰ tʰ tsʰ t͡ɬʰ ʈ͡ʂʰ tɕʰ kʰ qʰ/ <f th s lh sh sz x g>
/b d̪ d dz dl ɟ/ <b d ḍ z l j>
/pʼ tʼ t͡sʼ t͡ɬʼ ʈ͡ʂʼ cʼ kʼ qʼ ʔ/<p t c tl ch cz k q '>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m n ṇ nh ny ng>
/r̪ r ɽ j w h/ <r ṛ rh y v h>
/i y ɨ ɪ ʏ ʊ e ɜ ɔ ɛ ɑ/<i u ĭ î û w e ă o ê a>
Ăṇ'nyaṇeqswk, tă'naḍyarhănt. Gingoḍomêvrim? Guyohhêḍomrim. Ḍbêrxmyarrhan' myăr.
Too many /d/'s!

----
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by ---- »

I'm not Nortaneous so ultimately my opinion on it doesn't matter, but I actually think that looks quite elegant.

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Nortaneous
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Nortaneous »

Vuvuzela wrote:Also, I'm assuming you have some kind of thing where the aspirates appear as fricatives a lot of the time, so I'll try to represent that.
Correct.

The main problem is that I'm not sure what kind of look I want to go for: the old orthography followed IPA pretty heavily and looked like something out of New Guinea, whereas this is more Caucasian or Turkic.

Also <ə ä> are /ɛ ɨ/ there, /ɨ/ merges with /a/ in most dialects so Êṇ'nyaṇeqswk, tê'naḍyarhênt. Gingoḍomĭvrim? Guyohhĭḍomrim. Ḍbêrxmyarrhan' myêr.

and the old orthography, for reference: Ɛnʔñañeqsʰuk, tɛʔṉadyaṛɛnt. Kʰiŋodomɨwṟim? Kʰüyohhɨdomṟim. Dbɨṟqʰmyaẓẓanʔ myɛr. (the retroflex flap is a plosive when geminated, so <ṛ> vs. <ẓẓ>)
Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
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Vuvuzela
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Vuvuzela »

Dahalo, which under this system would be <'Dahaalo>
/m n ɲ/<m n ny>
/p t̪ t̠ k kʷ ʡ ʔ/<p t rt k kw ' q>
/b d̪ d̠ g gʷ/<b d rd g gw>
/ᵐp ⁿt̪ ⁿt̠ ᵑk ᵑkʷ/<mp nt rnt nk nkw>
/ᵐb ⁿd̪ ⁿd̠ ⁿd̠ ᵑg ᵑgʷ/<mb nd rnd ng ngw>
/p' t̪' t̠' k' kʷ' /<p' t' rt' k' k'w>
/ɓ ɗ/<'b 'd>
/ts tʃ/<ts tx>
/dz dzʷ dʒ/<z zw j>
/ⁿts ᶮtʃ/<nts ntx
/ⁿdz ᶮdʒ/<nz nj>
/tɬʼ tʃ' cʎ̥˔'/<tl' tx' tl'y>
/f ɬ ɬʷ s ʃ ʎ̥˔ ʜ h/<f hl hlw s x hly h' h>
/l r j w/<l r y w>
/ᵑǀ ᵑǀʷ ᵑ̊ǀˀ ᵑ̊ǀˀʷ/<nc ncw c cw>
/a e i o u/ <a e i o u>
Long vowels are indicated by doubling, as are consonental gemminates.
Pitch accent is indicated by an acute on the first vowel symbol of the accented syllable.
I could not find any good sample sentences, but I think a few words might suffice, just to give us a feel for the orthography:
Mpanye "rat"
H'énta "flies"
Cóone "breast"
Ju'enna "douse, quell"
Qaa''ona "cry"
Hárt'ida mono "very close"

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Pinetree
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Pinetree »

My new phonology (as seen in the phonology thread) needs a romanisation.

Consonants:
/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/
/p b t d k g/
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/
/f v s z ɣ χ/
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/

Vowels:
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/

Sample Text:
tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?

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Nortaneous
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Nortaneous »

surely some of those must be allophonic, or at least have restricted environments?

the obvious one is
/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/ <m~n>
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/ <pw bw tw dw kw gw>
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/ <ph bh th dh kh gh>
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/ <phw bhw thw dhw khw ghw>
/f v s z ɣ χ/ <f v s z ğ x>
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/ <fw vw sw zw wh xw>
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/ <fh vh sh zh>
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/ <fhw vhw shw zhw>
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/ <l lw lh lhw w>
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <i ü ï u e ö y ë o ä a>

tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?
Twa fpmu tshï ä kshekö? Khïiaiphwïi pfa xklu üuxtni stsy pfaüfkë. Pwo tshwëtnïta ksä psouïfpli txüplekhë kfhwë tsy. Tnxexpxwy spsifkwüto ä au thö ï?

but i notice that at least in the sample secondary articulations only occur directly before vowels so

/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/ <m~n>
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/ <p b t d k g> + acute on following vowel
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/ <p b t d k g> + grave on following vowel
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/ <p b t d k g> + circumflex on following vowel
/f v s z ɣ χ/ <f v s z r h>
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/ <f v s z r h> + acute
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/ <f v s z> + grave
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/ <f v s z> + circumflex
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/ <l l+ac l+gr l+cir w>

That makes handling the vowels difficult. You could presumably do digraphs or figure out which diacritics work with what but I'm going to be cheap as shit and rip off Uzbek

Vowels:
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <iь uь i u eь oь y e o aь a>

tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?
Tá fpmu tsì aь ksèьkoь? Kìiьaьiьpîiь pfa hklu uьuhtni stsy pfauьfke. Pó tsêtnita ksaь psouifpliь thuьpleьkè kfê tsy. Tnreьhphé spsiьfkúьto aь au tòь i?
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nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.

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Pinetree
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Pinetree »

Nortaneous wrote:surely some of those must be allophonic, or at least have restricted environments?

the obvious one is
/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/ <m~n>
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/ <pw bw tw dw kw gw>
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/ <ph bh th dh kh gh>
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/ <phw bhw thw dhw khw ghw>
/f v s z ɣ χ/ <f v s z ğ x>
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/ <fw vw sw zw wh xw>
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/ <fh vh sh zh>
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/ <fhw vhw shw zhw>
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/ <l lw lh lhw w>
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <i ü ï u e ö y ë o ä a>

tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?
Twa fpmu tshï ä kshekö? Khïiaiphwïi pfa xklu üuxtni stsy pfaüfkë. Pwo tshwëtnïta ksä psouïfpli txüplekhë kfhwë tsy. Tnxexpxwy spsifkwüto ä au thö ï?

but i notice that at least in the sample secondary articulations only occur directly before vowels so

/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/ <m~n>
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/ <p b t d k g> + acute on following vowel
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/ <p b t d k g> + grave on following vowel
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/ <p b t d k g> + circumflex on following vowel
/f v s z ɣ χ/ <f v s z r h>
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/ <f v s z r h> + acute
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/ <f v s z> + grave
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/ <f v s z> + circumflex
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/ <l l+ac l+gr l+cir w>

That makes handling the vowels difficult. You could presumably do digraphs or figure out which diacritics work with what but I'm going to be cheap as shit and rip off Uzbek

Vowels:
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <iь uь i u eь oь y e o aь a>

tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?
Tá fpmu tsì aь ksèьkoь? Kìiьaьiьpîiь pfa hklu uьuhtni stsy pfauьfke. Pó tsêtnita ksaь psouifpliь thuьpleьkè kfê tsy. Tnreьhphé spsiьfkúьto aь au tòь i?
Thanks. Both seem cool in their own right. However, regarding the vowels, when I wrote this i placed more importance on the rounding (in diphthongs, rounding must agree, so no diphthongs like [ui] or [ay]) than I did on the position in the mouth, so I would have used the diaeresis/soft-sign on the rounded variants than on the front variants:

/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <i ï u ü e ë y o ö a ä>
OR
/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <i iь u uь e eь y o oь a aь

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Haplogy »

Miar

/pʰ tʰ t͡sʰ t͡ɬʰ ʈ͡ʂʰ tɕʰ kʰ qʰ/ <p t s tl ch c k q>
/b d̪ d d͡z d͡ɮ ɟ/ <b dh d z dl g>
/pʼ tʼ t͡sʼ t͡ɬʼ ʈ͡ʂʼ cʼ kʼ qʼ ʔ/ <p' t' s' tl' ch' c' k' q' x>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m nh n ñh ñ ŋ>
/r̪ r ɽ j w h/ <rh r rl j w xh>

/i y ɨ ɪ ʏ ʊ e ɜ ɔ ɛ ɑ/ <i u y î û o e ŷ ô ê a>

Ŷnxnjaeq'sok', tŷxnhadjarlŷnht. Kiŋôdômêwrhim? Kujôxhxhêdômrhim. Dbêrhqmjarhrlanhx mjŷrh.
/ɜnʔnjɑeqʼsʊkʼ, tɜʔn̪ɑdjɑɽɜn̪t. kʰiŋɔdɔmɛwr̪im? kʰyjɔhhɛdɔmr̪im. dbɛr̪qʰmjɑr̪ɽɑn̪ʔ mjɜr̪./


Dahalo

/m n ɲ/
/p t̪ t̠ k kʷ ʡ ʔ/ <p t th k kw q '>
/b d̪ d̠ g gʷ/ <b d dh g gw>
/ᵐp ⁿt̪ ⁿt̠ ᵑk ᵑkʷ/ <mp nt nth nk nkw>
/ᵐb ⁿd̪ ⁿd̠ ᵑg ᵑgʷ/ <mb nd ndh ng ngw>
/p' t̪' t̠' k' kʷ'/ <p' t' th' k' kw'>
/ɓ ɗ/ <'b'd>
/ts tʃ/ <tz ts>
/dz dzʷ dʒ/ <dz dzw ds>
/ⁿts ᶮtʃ/ <ntz nts>
/ⁿdz ᶮdʒ/ <ndz nds>
/tɬʼ tʃ' cʎ̥˔'/ <tl' ts' tlj'>
/f ɬ ɬʷ s ʃ ʎ̥˔ ʜ h/ <f l lw z s lj x h>
/l r j w/ <ł r j w>
/ᵑǀ ᵑǀʷ ᵑ̊ǀˀ ᵑ̊ǀˀʷ/ <c cw c' cw'>

/a e i o u/ <a i e o u>


Hubris Incalculablese

/m~n~ŋ~ɴ/ <m~n>
/p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
/pʷ bʷ tʷ dʷ kʷ gʷ/ <pˇ bˇ tˇ dˇ kˇ gˇ>
/pˠ bˠ tˠ dˠ kˠ gˠ/ <p˙ b˙ t˙ d˙ k˙ g˙>
/pˠʷ bˠʷ tˠʷ dˠʷ kˠʷ gˠʷ/ <pˆ bˆ tˆ dˆ kˆ gˆ>
/f v s z ɣ χ/ <f w s z x h>
/fʷ vʷ sʷ zʷ ɣʷ~wˠ χʷ/ <fˇ vˇ sˇ zˇ xˇ hˇ>
/fˠ vˠ sˠ zˠ/ <f˙ v˙ s˙ z˙ x˙ h˙>
/fˠʷ vˠʷ sˠʷ zˠʷ/ <fˆ vˆ sˆ zˆ xˆ hˆ>
/l~ɹ lʷ~ɹʷ lˠ~ɹˠ lʷˠ~ɹʷˠ w/ <l lˇ l˙ lˆ ˇ>

/i y ɯ u e ø ǝ ɤ o a ɒ/ <ı ıv u uv e ev y o ov a av>

Tǎv fpmuv tsu̇ a ksėkev? Ku̇ıaıpûı pfav hkluv ıvuvhtnı stsy pfavıvfko. Pǒv tsôtnutav ksa psovuvufplı thıvplekȯ kfô tsy. Tnxehphy̌ spsıfkǐvtov a avuv tėv u?
/tʷɒ fpmu tsˠɯ a ksˠekø? kˠɯi̯ai̯pˠʷɯi̯ pfɒ χklu yu̯χtni stsǝ pfɒy̯fkɤ. pʷo tsˠʷɤtnɯtɒ ksa psou̯ɯfpli tχyplekˠɤ kfˠʷɤ tsǝ. tnɣeχpχʷǝ spsifkʷyto a ɒu̯ tˠø ɯ?/
Knowledge is power, and power corrupts. So study hard and be evil!

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by 2+3 clusivity »

Miar

/pʰ tʰ t͡sʰ t͡ɬʰ ʈ͡ʂʰ tɕʰ kʰ qʰ/ <p t ts tl ch c k q>
/b d̪ d d͡z d͡ɮ ɟ/ <b dh d dz dl z>
/pʼ tʼ t͡sʼ t͡ɬʼ ʈ͡ʂʼ cʼ kʼ qʼ ʔ/ <p' t' ts' tl' ch' c' k' q' '>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m nh n c̃h c̃ g̃>
/r̪ r ɽ j w h/ <rh r l j w x>

/i y ɨ ɪ ʏ ʊ e ɜ ɔ ɛ ɑ/ <i y u ih yh uh e eh a ev av>

<evn'nyaveq'suhk', ts'nhavdyavlsnht. kig̃adamevwrhim? kyjaxxevdamrhim. dbevrhqmjarhlavnh' mjsrh.>
/ɜnʔnjɑeqʼsʊkʼ, tɜʔn̪ɑdjɑɽɜn̪t. kʰiŋɔdɔmɛwr̪im? kʰyjɔhhɛdɔmr̪im. dbɛr̪qʰmjɑr̪ɽɑn̪ʔ mjɜr̪./

ikh.

Also:
phonology13.PNG
phonology13.PNG (10.12 KiB) Viewed 5973 times
i, a, u vowel system. CV phonotactics.
linguoboy wrote:So that's what it looks like when the master satirist is moistened by his own moutarde.

Wattmann
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Wattmann »

<w v j>
<m n nr>
<l r>
<l' r'>
<mb nd ndr>
<p t tr k>
<b d dr g>
<nc ncr>
<c s cr sr x h>
<c' s' cr' sr' x' h'>
<a i u>

Sweet and simple, no diacritics :)
Warning: Recovering bilingual, attempting trilinguaility. Knowledge of French left behind in childhood. Currently repairing bilinguality. Repair stalled. Above content may be a touch off.

Ambrisio
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Ambrisio »

Proto-Ginösic already has a romanization and I am too lazy to make up a phonology, so here's one from a natlang:

Stops: /p~b t̪~d̪ ʈ~ɖ c~s k~ɡ/
Nasals: /m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/
Approximants: /ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/
Tap: /ɾ/
"Rhotic": /R/
The rhotic phoneme is /ɾ/ when single and /tr/ when geminated. The stops other than /c/ are voiced, unless they are word-initial or geminate, in which case they are unvoiced. /c/ follows a different allophonic rule: /c/ is /ɟ/ when following a nasal, /c/ when geminate, and /s/ otherwise.

Vowels: /ɐ e i ɔ u aː eː iː ɔː uː aj aːj aw ej ɔj uj/

Word-initially, /e/ and /ɔ/ are realized as /je/ and /wɔ/. The same is true of the long vowels.

I would like a Romanization and a Cyrillization.

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by 2+3 clusivity »

Stops: /p~b t̪~d̪ ʈ~ɖ c~s k~ɡ/ <p th t s k>
Nasals: /m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m nh n nd nj ng>
Approximants: /ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/ < v l x z j>
Tap: /ɾ/ <r>
"Rhotic": /R/ <d>
/ɐ e i ɔ u aː eː iː ɔː uː aj aːj aw ej ɔj uj/ <a e i o u aa ee ii oo uu ay aay aw ey oy uy>

what language is this Australian or Dravidian? You could pretty much use the Tamil script.
linguoboy wrote:So that's what it looks like when the master satirist is moistened by his own moutarde.

Ambrisio
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Ambrisio »

2+3 clusivity wrote:Stops: /p~b t̪~d̪ ʈ~ɖ c~s k~ɡ/ <p th t s k>
Nasals: /m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m nh n nd nj ng>
Approximants: /ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/ < v l x z j>
Tap: /ɾ/ <r>
"Rhotic": /R/ <d>
/ɐ e i ɔ u aː eː iː ɔː uː aj aːj aw ej ɔj uj/ <a e i o u aa ee ii oo uu ay aay aw ey oy uy>

what language is this Australian or Dravidian? You could pretty much use the Tamil script.
/x/ for /ɭ/? and how to distinguish /nR/ from /ɳ/?

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Haplogy »

/β̞ ɻ j/ <v r j>
/m n ɳ/ <m n rd>
/l ɭ ↓ɬ ↓ɬ˞/ <l rl l' rl'>
/ⁿb ⁿd ⁿɖ/ <mb nd rnd>
/p t ʈ k/ <p t rt k>
/b d ɖ g/ <b d rd g>
/ⁿd͡z ⁿɖ͡ʐ/ <nz rnz>
/t͡s s ʈ͡ʂ ʂ x h/ <c s rc rs x h>
/↓t͡s ↓s ↓ʈ͡ʂ ↓ʂ ↓x ↓h/ <c' s' rc' rs' x' h'>
/i u a/ <i u a>

/p t̪ ʈ c k/ <p t rt c k>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m nh n rn gj g>
/ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/ <v l rl r j>
/ɾ R/ <d x>
/ɐ e i ɔ u/ <a e i o u>
/aː eː iː ɔː uː/ <á é í ó ú>
/aj aːj aw ej ɔj uj/ <ai ái au ei oi ui>

/p t̪ ʈ c k/ <п тъ т ть к>
/m n̪ n ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <м нъ ң н нь ӈ>
/ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/ <в лъ л р ь>
/ɾ R/ <д ц>
/ɐ e i ɔ u/ <а э и о у>
/aː eː iː ɔː uː/ <я е ы ѡ ю>
/aj aːj aw ej ɔj uj/ <ай яй аў эй ой уй>
I'm pretty sure that this looks horrible.

Any example texts?
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Pole, the
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Pole, the »

Phonology in need.

Consonants:
/n ŋ/
/p t tʃ k/
/b d dʒ ɡ/
/f s ɬ ʃ x h/
/v z l ʒ ɣ ɦ/
(You can also use /w r l j ɰ/ instead of /v z l ʒ ɣ/.)

Vowels:
/i y u/
/ɪ ʏ u/
/ɛ ɔ/
/a/

Syllables:
(C)V, also (C)V(C) word finally

If the last syllable is closed, the stress is ultimate. Otherwise it can be either ultimate or penultimate (distinctive!).
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by communistplot »

As per above:

Consonants:
/n ŋ/ <n ň>
/p t tʃ k/ <p t c k>
/b d dʒ ɡ/ <b d j g>
/f s ɬ ʃ x h/ <f s ł ś x h>
/v z l ʒ ɣ ɦ/ <v z l ź ğ ħ>
(You can also use /w r l j ɰ/ instead of /v z l ʒ ɣ/.)

Vowels:
/i y u/ <i y u>
/ɪ ʏ u/ <ï ÿ ü>
/ɛ ɔ/ <e o>
/a/ <a>


Annnnnnd sample:

Cyźba suvoğluňÿt mimbe harar.
[tʃyʒ.ba | su.vɔ.ɣlu.ŋʏt | mim.bɛ | ha.rar]
The Artist Formerly Known as Caleone

My Conlangs (WIP):

Pasic - Proto-Northeastern Bay - Asséta - Àpzó

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Haplogy »

/n ŋ/ <n ng>
/p t tʃ k/ <p t tj k>
/b d dʒ ɡ/ <b d dj g>
/f s ɬ ʃ x h/ <f s lh sj kh h>
/v z l ʒ ɣ ɦ/ <v z l zj gh hh>

/i y u/ <i y u>
/ɪ ʏ ʊ/ <î ŷ û>
/ɛ ɔ/ <e o>
/a/ <a>
The vowel is doubled to indicate penultimate stress.

Awkwords yields:
Sjufŷtygi ngadj fyledj sji hûûvy nang sjang dubûnud foto ghe.
/ʃufʏtyˈgi ŋad͡ʒ fyˈlɛd͡ʒ ʃi ˈhʊvy naŋ ʃaŋ dubʊˈnud fɔˈtɔ ɣɛ/
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by sangi39 »

Pole's phoneme inventory:

/n ŋ/ <n ň>
/p t tʃ k/ <p t č k>
/b d dʒ ɡ/ <b d ž g>
/f s ɬ ʃ x h/ <f s ś š x h>
/v z l ʒ ɣ ɦ/~/w r l j ɰ ɦ/ <v z l j w r>

(to me, plain <c>, especially in an orthography using haceks, represents /ts/ instead of /tʃ/, hence that choice. The use of <r> for /ɦ/ is also fairly odd, but I seem to remember some dialects of Portuguese pronounce <r> that way. Obviously that's the result of sound change but here it saved on using "too many" diacritics and using <z> for /z~r/ freed up <r>. Other than that I think it's fairly ok)

Unstressed and final-stressed vowels are written as follows:

/i y u/ <i ü u>
/ɪ ʏ ʊ/ <e ö o>
/ɛ ɔ/ <è ò>
/a/ <a>

...while penultimate stressed vowels are written with:

/i y u/ <í ű ú>
/ɪ ʏ ʊ/ <é ő ó>
/ɛ ɔ/ <ě ǒ>
/a/ <á>

(admittedly, using <e ö o é ő ó> might seem odd, but aesthetically I like it more :) )

Using Esmelthien's Awkwords sample we get:

Šufötügi ňaž fülèž ši hővü naň šaň dubonud fòtò wè
/ʃufʏtyˈgi ŋad͡ʒ fyˈlɛd͡ʒ ʃi ˈhʊvy naŋ ʃaŋ dubʊˈnud fɔˈtɔ ɣɛ/


And Ambrosio's natlang:

Stops: /p~b t̪~d̪ ʈ~ɖ c~s k~ɡ/ <p t ṭ c k> <п т ҭ с к>
Nasals: /m n̪ (n) ɳ ɲ ŋ/ <m n (n) ṇ ñ g> <м н (н) ң њ ҥ>
Approximants: /ʋ l ɭ ɻ j/ <v l ḷ ṛ y> <в л ӆ ҏ й>
Tap: /ɾ/ <d> <д>
"Rhotic": /R/ <r> <р>

Vowels: /ɐ e i ɔ u aː eː iː ɔː uː aj (aːj) aw (ej ɔj uj)/ <a e i o u aa ee ii oo uu ai (aai) au (ei oi ui)> <а е и о у аа ее ии оо уу аи (ааи) ау (еи ои уи)>

Having searched for possible ways to represent /ɻ/, this does appear to be Tamil. Phonemes in brackets are those not found on either Wikipedia or Omniglot, where the following text originates:

Manitap piṛaviyinar cakalarum cutantiramaakavee piṛakkinṛanar; avarkaḷ matippilum urimaikaḷilum camamaanavarkaḷ. Avarkaḷ niyaayattaiyum manacaaṭciyaiyum iyaṛpaṇpaakap peṛṛavarkaḷ.

Манитап пиҏвийинар сакаларум сутантирамаакавее пиҏаккинҏанар; аваҏкаӆ матиппилум уримаикаӆилум самамаанаваркаӆ. Аваркаӆ нийаайаттаийум манасааҭсийаийум ийаҏпаңпаакар пеҏҏаваркаӆ.


The descenders in the Cyrillic version represent voiceless resonants in Kildin Sami, but it doesn't seem like Cyrillic is used to write any language with retroflex consonants, so I repurposed them in line with the underdot in the romanisation.

I also considered using the iotated vowels of Cyrillic, but /j/ only seems to turn up word-initially and between vowels, so those letters could potentially lead to words that looked like they were even more vowel-heavy than the average Tamil word, e.g. niyaayattaiyum > нийаайаттаийум > ныяаяттайюм and piṛaviyinar > пиҏвийинар > пыҏвыинар. As a result I chose <а е и о у> to represent the vowels, <в й> to represent the onset approximants and <у и> to represent the off-glides, again following the pattern seen in the romanisation.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Ambrisio »

For a conlang phonology, here's Proto-Ginösic.

Consonants: /p b t t' d k k' g q qʼ ɢ ʔ/ <p b t tt d k kk g ḳ ḳḳ ġ q>
/s z χ ʁ h/ <s z ḥ ʒ h>
/m n ŋ/ <m n ng>
/l r/ <l r> (the /r/ could be a trill or approximant)
The vowels are: /ɒ ɛ i~e o u ɤ~ə æ/ <a e i o u õ ä> These vowels my form diphthongs or be doubled.

The phonotactics are (C)(A/L)V(V)(C)(s), where C = consonant, V = vowel, A = l or r, L = i or u. VV could be a double vowel or a diphthong.

I have already created a romanization. Maybe you could Cyrillize it or come up with a different romanization.

While we are on the subject of differently written natlangs, here's Estonian in Greek:

<π ππ β τ ττ δ κ κκ γ> <p pp b t tt d k kk g>
<μ ν νγ> <m n ng>
<‛φ φ σ ζ ‛> <f/hv v s ds h>
<ξ ψ> <ks ps>
<λ ρ ι> <l r j>
<α ε/η ι ω ου ο ᾳ ῳ υ> <a e i o u õ ä ö ü> Acute accents represent long vowels.

E is η at the end of a word, ε otherwise.
U is υ at the end of a word, ου otherwise.
Õu is όυ, while uu is ού.
H is χ before a stop.

8Deer
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by 8Deer »

Proto-Ginösic

Consonants:
/p b t t' d k k' g q qʼ ɢ ʔ/ <p b t t' d k k' g q q' ġ '>
/s z χ ʁ h/ <s z x ǧ h>
/m n ŋ/ <m n ng>
/l r/ <l r>

Vowels:
/ɒ ɛ i~e o u ɤ~ə æ/ <å e i o u ö a> (depending on which is more common, maybe /ɒ æ/ <a ä> would be better...)

Also, if you don't mind digraphs, /ɢ ʁ/ <gh rh> works too.

Aybuben
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Aybuben »

Proto-Ginösic

Consonants:
/p b t t' d k k' g q qʼ ɢ ʔ/ <п б т ть д к кь г қ қь ғ ъ>
/s z χ ʁ h/ <с з х ж һ>
/m n ŋ/ <м н ң>
/l r/ <л р>

Vowels:
/ɒ ɛ i~e o u ɤ~ə æ/ <а е и о у ө э>
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Re: Romanization challenge thread

Post by Haplogy »

Proto-Ginösic

/p b t t' d k k' g q qʼ ɢ ʔ/ <p b t tx d k kx g q qx gq x>
/s z X ʁ h/ <s z qh rh h>
/m n ŋ/ <m n ng>
/l r/ <l r>
/ɒ ɛ i~e o u ɤ~ə æ/ <å e i o u ů a>
<'> may be used to break digraphs, if necessary.
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