Post your conlang's phonology

[finlay]

Note that IPA gamma is ɣ which is a distinct character from Greek gamma.

[Christopher Schröder]

I see... but why?

[finlay]

I dunno. They look different though. It's slightly jarring.

[Umega]

IPA gamma has loop at the bottom and modern gamma just goes in a straight line

[finlay]

you don't say. the question, however, was 'why'.

[roninbodhisattva]

Wikipedia simply calls it a 'variant' of Greek gamma. It might be as simple as something like there was this variant of gamma floating around out there and they just decided to go with it. *shrugs*

Or it might be far more reasoned.

[Christopher Schröder]

It may be to distinguish it from other characters such as y and ʏ, which γ resembles, especially if handwritten. The handwritten part is possibly disproved by the use of ɑ and a as separate symbols, when the former is generally the handwritten version of the latter (the character map lists it as "small alpha", but, in that vein, it would have been simpler to use the more distinct α)...

[----]

I read (I think on Wikipedia) that the IPA gamma was derived from <x>. It makes sense but I'm not sure of the accuracy of that.

[finlay]

It may be to distinguish it from other characters such as y and ʏ, which γ resembles, especially if handwritten. The handwritten part is possibly disproved by the use of ɑ and a as separate symbols, when the former is generally the handwritten version of the latter (the character map lists it as "small alpha", but, in that vein, it would have been simpler to use the more distinct α)...

It also begs the question of why they had to then include ɤ.

[Christopher Schröder]

From what is that derived, anyway?

[finlay]

Isn't it derived from ɣ? I don't actually know... maybe look it up...

Wikipedia implies that it's derived from ɣ, and used to be called baby gamma. The modern one is technically "ram's horns", which is basically just giving it a rounded top to help distinguish it from gamma – but a lot of fonts don't distinguish it in this way...

[Christopher Schröder]

Apparently, it is an alteration of gamma, but why it's used for a vowel, I cannot fathom.

[ná'oolkiłí]

Yeah, from ɣ. Supposedly because [ɣ˕] = [ɰ] and [ɰ˕] ≈ [ɤ]. I actually really like the letter (called ram's horns, iirc).

[finlay]

Apparently, it is an alteration of gamma, but why it's used for a vowel, I cannot fathom.

They're quite similar phonetically and pronounced in the back of the mouth. I think that's basically it.

[8Deer]

This is my conlang's vowel system.

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i ĩ
u ũ 
a ɑ̃

Each vowel has a nasal counterpart, but the nasal counterpart of /a/ is /ɑ̃/, instead of /ã/. I think French does something similar. I'm a noob, so I want to know if this is plausible.

[Umega]

yes
why are are you using only vowels

[----]

He's not using only vowels, and he never even implied that he was.
And yeah that's totally plausible, when vowels nasalize they often lose a lot of distinction from each other, so something like that could easily happen

[Umega]

He's not using only vowels, and he never even implied that he was.
And yeah that's totally plausible, when vowels nasalize they often lose a lot of distinction from each other, so something like that could easily happen

didn't see the thing.........but anyway what kindof conlang are you going for

[finlay]

This is my conlang's vowel system.

Code: Select all

i ĩ
u ũ 
a ɑ̃

Each vowel has a nasal counterpart, but the nasal counterpart of /a/ is /ɑ̃/, instead of /ã/. I think French does something similar. I'm a noob, so I want to know if this is plausible.

i'd call it /ã/ but [ɑ̃]. just because it's easier to type. (linguists do this all the time)

Just as plausible, if you're going off the example of French, is to lower the close vowels to say mid... so you'd get [i u a ẽ õ ɑ̃] as your six vowels. This could be a quick and dirty way to convert to a five or six vowel system: lower these vowels and lose the nasalisation outright. You don't have to do this, of course, but bear it in mind if you want to create dialects or daughterlangs for your conlang.

Also, to most questions of plausibility, the answer is generally a lazy "yeah". There's very little that's truly implausible, especially if it's just one consonant or vowel that may seem "out of place" like this. And at the end of the day, you don't have to follow plausibility judgements. As a general rule, assuming you're not setting out to make your phonology like Klingon or something, there's generally a natlang or 5 out there that have done weirder shit.

[roninbodhisattva]

Something I just threw together while driving, based on Thai:

Consonants:

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m    n    ɲ    ŋ  
p    t    c    k    ʔ
pʰ   tʰ   cʰ   kʰ
b    d         g
f    s         x    h
     r    j    w 
     l

Initial clusters:

Code: Select all

pr   tr   kr   kw
pl   kl  
pʰr  tʰr  kʰr  kʰw
pʰl  kʰl
     sr        xw 
     sl 
ml   ŋl        ŋw 
ʔb   ʔd   ʔg   ʔw
               ʔj

Final consonants:

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m   n       ŋ
p   t       k   ʔ
        j   w

Vowels:

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i  ɨ  ɯ  u 
e  ə  ɤ  o
ɛ     a  ɔ

ii  ɯɯ  uu 
ee  ɤɤ  oo
ɛɛ  aa  ɔɔ

ia  ɯa  ua

Syllable structure is (C(C)V(V)(C). I might include /r/ as a coda consonant too (maybe only after low vowels), and there is probably going to be a restriction on how final /j w/ cooccur with vowels.

[Nortaneous]

here's that naming lang

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p  t  ts      k   ʔ         p  t  z    k  '
mb nd ndz     ŋg            mb nt nz   nk
ʰp ʰt ʰts     ʰk            hp ht hz   hk
v  s      ʃ       h         v  s     c     h
mv        ntʃ               mv       nc
ʰv ʰs     ʰʃ                hv hs    hc
   ǀ  ǁ   ǃ                    x  q  d
   ǀʰ ǁʰ  ǃʰ                   hx hq hd
   ǀ  ǁ   ǃ                    nx nq nd
m  n          ŋ             m  n       ng
   l      j   (w)              l     y w
   ɾ  r                        r  rr
   
i y u   i wi u
e ø o   e we o
  a       a

Two tones: high and low.
Syllable structure is CV, but word-final consonants are allowed and sequences of plosives/fricatives and /j w/ can occur. However, /j/ can't occur before front vowels and /w/ can't occur before any vowel but /a/.
/v/ is usually realized voiced, but the other plain consonants are realized as voiceless in high-toned syllables and voiced in low-toned syllables. Voicing is common word-initially even in high-toned syllables.
Front rounded vowels could also be analyzed as sequences of /w/ + front vowel. /wa/ is sometimes realized [ɔ].
The contrast between /ɾ r/ is neutralized in word-final position.

[roninbodhisattva]

Something inspired by Numic:

Vowels:

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i    ɨ    u
    ə ɵ
     a

Consonants:

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p    t       k    q 
     ts   
     s                 h 
m    n       
     l   j   w

Roots are of the shape (C)V(C)CV. Bound morphemes may sometimes consist of only a single consonant or sometimes begin with a consonant cluster (lexical suffix -mpi 'leg'). The schwa /ə/ is not found in roots. Root medial clusters are the following:

- Geminate /p t k q s/
- Nasal + /p t k q ts m n/
- /h/ + /p t k q ts l/
- Various obstruent + obstruent clusters

Word medial single stops are lenited: /p t k q/ > [β ð ɣ ʁ]. Nasal + stop/affricate clusters are realized as such [mb nd ng ɴɢ n(d)z]. Morphemes may end in a vowel, a geminating feature (written =), an underspecified nasal N or an /h/.

[Skomakar'n]

Something unfinished, the language of which I have not even started on yet. Not all sounds here are actually going to be phonemic. Some will be allophones in certain conditions, and some aren't even sounds in their own right, but suggestions of clusters that I want. I'm just listing everything that I've thought of. Some sounds will only be allowed in certain positions, some will only appear as allophones in clusters and so on, but like I said, I'm just listing everything that's on my mind. I'm imagining a very voiceless, aspirated and nasal language, with a couple of syllabic consonants.

I'm just writing from memory right now, since the list is on my computer, and I'm on the iPad now, so I might be missing something, or writing something that isn't even on that list, but here I go anyway.

Vowels: /aː aːˤ ãː ɐ æː æːˤ æ̃ː ɛ ɔː ɔːˤ ɔ̃ː ɔ iː ĩː ɪ ɯ/
Consonants: /p pʰ b bʰ t tʰ k kʰ ɣ h ç q x s s̬ ʃ̬ tʃʰ j l ɬ ʎ ɸ w ʍ m m̥ n n̥ ŋ ŋ̥ ɲ ɲ̥ ʔ/
Syllabic consonants: /s̩ l̩ ɬ̩ n̩ n̥̩ m̩ m̥̩/
Clusters: /ɬtʰ m̥pʰ n̥tʰ ŋ̥kʰ stʰ/

I'm using /s̬ ʃ̬/ instead of /z ʒ/; the realisations are a little less voiced than those of the latter ones.

A few of the sounds were added right now. I'll have to update my file. The only word I have thought of so far, is the female name <Nhste> /ˈn̥̩stʰɯ/, which I used in a little story a long time ago.

[Grimalkin]

Here's my very rudimentary sketch of Old Fuotonh, the ancestor of my most recent conlang, Fuotonh (formerly Fuoshi). There is no clear-cut boundary between Old, Middle and Modern Fuotonh of course, but the variety of Old Fuotonh I'm describing is the reconstructed ancestor of all Fuotonh languages and dialects that was spoken around 2,500 years ago. Unlike many Proto-languages, Old Fuotonh is supposed to be fairly simple, possibly to the extent of being a snorefest, but it's only supposed to be a proto-language and not much else.

Phoneme inventory:

Consonants:

/pʰ p b tʰ t d kʰ k g/ <ph p b th t d kh k g>
/tsʰ ts dz tɬ/ <tsh ts dz tl>
/s h/ <s h>
/m n ŋ/ <m n ŋ>
/r l w j/ <r l w y>

[ʔ] is an allophone of /h/ found in coda position.
/l/ has a velarised allophone [ɫ], which is found in any position other than syllable-initially. Hence, lu is phonetically [lu] but khlu is [kʰɫu]

Vowels:

/a e i o u ə/ <a e i o u ə>

All vowels except /ə/ could be either long or short – vowel length was phonemic. In the orthography, long vowels are indicated by a macron.

All vowels could also be pharyngealised, although there are no instances of a pharyngealised vowel being followed by a glottal stop. In the orthography, pharyngealisation is marked by doubling the vowel.

Old Fuotonh is generally not believed to have had any diphthongs, although the vowel sequences /uə/ and /iə/ do occur.

Phonotactics

Despite possessing a formidable array of consonant clusters, the phonotactics of Old Fuotonh are actually much stricter than they might first appear.

Syllable structure is (C)(C)(C)V(C)(C).

An onset contains up to three consonants.

All single consonants are allowed as an onset.

Two-place onsets allowed in Old Fuotonh are:

- an obstruent, nasal or affricate (except /tɬ/) followed by /r/, /l/, /w/, or /j/
- /s/ followed by either /p/, /t/ or /k/
- a nasal followed by a homorganic voiceless unaspirated plosive (e.g. /mp/)
- a geminate plosive
- any combination of two voiced plosives.

Permitted three-place onsets are:

- an obstruent, nasal or affricate followed by one of /rj/, /lj/, /rw/, /lw/
- a nasal followed by a homorganic voiceless unaspirated plosive followed by /r/, /l/, /w/ or /j/

A nucleus must be one of the six vowels.

A coda contains up to two consonants.

A simple coda can be any consonant except /tɬ/

Complex codas allowed in Old Fuotonh are:

- any single consonant followed by /s/ or /h/
- any geminate plosive

A considerable number of Old Fuotonh roots appear to break the above phonotactic constraints. An example includes tslegg-s (wide). It is thought that the offending consonants were originally affixes which were not part of the syllable, and, in the Romanised orthography, they are usually separated from the syllable with a hyphen.

Stress and prosody
Little is known about the Old Fuotonh stress system, as nearly all roots were monosyllabic and stress probably only operated at phrase and sentencelevel. It is generally accepted that Old Fuotonh was not tonal, unlike all of its descendants.

[Dothraki_physicist]

Here is the phonemic inventory for Madokh, the ancestral language of the Madokh family of languages (which is about the size of the Indo-European family):

plosives: /p t k b d g/ <p t k b d g>
nasals: /m n ŋ/ <m n ng>
alveolar tap: /ɾ/ <r>
fricative: /s z ʃ ʒ x h/ <s z sh zh kh h>
approximate: /w/ <w>
affricate: /ts/ <ts>

vowels: /i e a u o/ <i e a u o> (each vowel is considered a separate syllable, so almost any diphthong can result)

Syllable pattern: (C)V(m,n)(C)