Frintha Scripts and Maps
Frintha Scripts and Maps
Since some people have said some kind words regarding the scripts I have created, I decided I would make a thread introducing them, and eventually comparing them. I will present the scripts chronologically in the order that I created them (to the best of my memory).
Donjo Script (c. 1999)
Originally in 1998 I created a language called Mushroomese, which was the language of a country I called the Frintha. I eventually decided I wanted to have a distantly related language, which I named Donjo. At the time I knew next to nothing about comparative linguistics, so the connection between the two languages was basically random similarities and differences with little thought as to how they were specifically related to each other. Mushroomese script was designed specifically for the limited sound system of Mushroomese and would not work well for Donjo, which had (has) a rather noobish inventory of consonants, so I decided it must have been a recent invention, commissioned by a king or some such and created a completely unrelated script for Donjo.
The script was intended to look somewhat primitive, and was also designed to allow a high amount of interaction between rows of text, obscuring the rows and making it look something like an impenetrable mess of squiggles. This is partly why many of the letters are composed of separate, unattached lines. When I turned the script into a font, naturally this interaction was eliminated and the script became quite linear. The script is featural, with some amount of variation.
Goga (Archic) Script (c. 2000-1)
It wasn't long before I decided I wanted to create the historical parent language of Donjo and Mushroomese. I started working on this language probably in around 2000 or 2001. The language had a noobish phonology similar to Donjo, and the script was closely related to the Donjo script, but designed to be more regular and slightly simpler in appearance.
Marag and Hwagak Scripts (c. 2009)
Some time around 2009 I was inspired to create two more languages and scripts to go with them. I had learned a little bit more about comparative linguistics and had been working on figuring out how Donjo and Mushroomese descended specifically from Proto-Frinthan. I determined that Donjo was one of the northern languages, while Mushroomese was a southern language. I then got to work on designing some central languages. The closely related languages Marag and Hwagak were the initial results.
The two scripts are stylistically quite different, but in terms of letter forms they have many similarities. They were designed almost simultaneously (Hwagak being slightly earlier) and were both intended to have branched off from a descendant of the Goga script. They also function similarly, word boundaries being indicated not by spaces but by special final forms of letters that are written at the ends of words, a feature that occurs only in these two scripts and the closely related Hüskaghurb Script.
*This letter is archaic and not generally used.
As you can see here, I later adapted the script to write Krah, a northern language of the neighbouring region.
*The ascender on these letters is truncated when it appears directly to the right of another letter with an ascender or diacritic.
**The second form is used with letters that have an ascender.
(The vowels of Eastern Hwagak presented here are still slightly in flux; Western Hwagak has more traditional vowels that are more similar to Marag).
One of the things I enjoy about designing scripts in this script family is seeing how much I can obscure or eliminate the featural qualities of the original archaic script.
To come: Roojee Script, Ashusk Script, Hüskaghurb Script, Beeba Script, Gondel Script, maybe Tilid Script someday if I ever get around to refining the designs of it.
Donjo Script (c. 1999)
Originally in 1998 I created a language called Mushroomese, which was the language of a country I called the Frintha. I eventually decided I wanted to have a distantly related language, which I named Donjo. At the time I knew next to nothing about comparative linguistics, so the connection between the two languages was basically random similarities and differences with little thought as to how they were specifically related to each other. Mushroomese script was designed specifically for the limited sound system of Mushroomese and would not work well for Donjo, which had (has) a rather noobish inventory of consonants, so I decided it must have been a recent invention, commissioned by a king or some such and created a completely unrelated script for Donjo.
The script was intended to look somewhat primitive, and was also designed to allow a high amount of interaction between rows of text, obscuring the rows and making it look something like an impenetrable mess of squiggles. This is partly why many of the letters are composed of separate, unattached lines. When I turned the script into a font, naturally this interaction was eliminated and the script became quite linear. The script is featural, with some amount of variation.
Goga (Archic) Script (c. 2000-1)
It wasn't long before I decided I wanted to create the historical parent language of Donjo and Mushroomese. I started working on this language probably in around 2000 or 2001. The language had a noobish phonology similar to Donjo, and the script was closely related to the Donjo script, but designed to be more regular and slightly simpler in appearance.
Marag and Hwagak Scripts (c. 2009)
Some time around 2009 I was inspired to create two more languages and scripts to go with them. I had learned a little bit more about comparative linguistics and had been working on figuring out how Donjo and Mushroomese descended specifically from Proto-Frinthan. I determined that Donjo was one of the northern languages, while Mushroomese was a southern language. I then got to work on designing some central languages. The closely related languages Marag and Hwagak were the initial results.
The two scripts are stylistically quite different, but in terms of letter forms they have many similarities. They were designed almost simultaneously (Hwagak being slightly earlier) and were both intended to have branched off from a descendant of the Goga script. They also function similarly, word boundaries being indicated not by spaces but by special final forms of letters that are written at the ends of words, a feature that occurs only in these two scripts and the closely related Hüskaghurb Script.
*This letter is archaic and not generally used.
As you can see here, I later adapted the script to write Krah, a northern language of the neighbouring region.
*The ascender on these letters is truncated when it appears directly to the right of another letter with an ascender or diacritic.
**The second form is used with letters that have an ascender.
(The vowels of Eastern Hwagak presented here are still slightly in flux; Western Hwagak has more traditional vowels that are more similar to Marag).
One of the things I enjoy about designing scripts in this script family is seeing how much I can obscure or eliminate the featural qualities of the original archaic script.
To come: Roojee Script, Ashusk Script, Hüskaghurb Script, Beeba Script, Gondel Script, maybe Tilid Script someday if I ever get around to refining the designs of it.
Last edited by clawgrip on Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Frintha Script Family
There's not much to say about them mechanically, since they all kind of work the same way. Not unrealistic, just... blah.
But aesthetically, these are amazing. 5/5. I would love to see larger samples of these; they are a joy to look at.
But aesthetically, these are amazing. 5/5. I would love to see larger samples of these; they are a joy to look at.
[quote="Nortaneous"]Is South Africa better off now than it was a few decades ago?[/quote]
- communistplot
- Avisaru
- Posts: 494
- Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:49 am
- Location: La Ciudad de Nueva York
- Contact:
Re: Frintha Script Family
Let me just say, I've got a raging boner for your scripts. How d'ya do it?
The Artist Formerly Known as Caleone
My Conlangs (WIP):
Pasic - Proto-Northeastern Bay - Asséta - Àpzó
My Conlangs (WIP):
Pasic - Proto-Northeastern Bay - Asséta - Àpzó
Re: Frintha Script Family
Thanks guys.
Brandrinn, it's true, since I created the originals so long ago. The languages behind them are kind of the same way, nothing special. But I've been working on this stuff for so long that I like them regardless.
Brandrinn, it's true, since I created the originals so long ago. The languages behind them are kind of the same way, nothing special. But I've been working on this stuff for so long that I like them regardless.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Caleone: Inspiration comes from various places. Sometimes my motivation is simply some concept or idea. The concepts that produced the Hwagak script were a script with final-form letters, and with no straight lines combined with extreme embellishments. The ascenders and descenders of Hwagak as seen in the image are actually only about 2/3 the length they were when I originally designed the script; I had to tone them down a bit because lines of text would end up so ridiculously far apart. The concept for Marag script was to make a script that was related to Hwagak, but was more bold and angular without being sharp. Ashusk was designed primarily with the idea of rotating the original script 45 degrees and then disallowing curves and vertical lines.
Sometimes my inspiration is completely random. The Huskaghurb script (to be shown later) was invented one day when I was just fiddling around with Marag on paper and ended up squashing it down and stretching it out, creating an impractically wide script. Nevertheless, I liked it, so I formalized it and made a font (which I'm not entirely happy with, but that's another story). Gondel was another script designed as I was messing around on paper with a previously developed script.
Beeba script, on the other hand, was designed with the specific intent of creating a script for a preexisting language. I just sat down with the original script and started modifying it in various ways until something concrete emerged.
Sometimes my inspiration is completely random. The Huskaghurb script (to be shown later) was invented one day when I was just fiddling around with Marag on paper and ended up squashing it down and stretching it out, creating an impractically wide script. Nevertheless, I liked it, so I formalized it and made a font (which I'm not entirely happy with, but that's another story). Gondel was another script designed as I was messing around on paper with a previously developed script.
Beeba script, on the other hand, was designed with the specific intent of creating a script for a preexisting language. I just sat down with the original script and started modifying it in various ways until something concrete emerged.
Last edited by clawgrip on Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Next is the Roojee script (c. 2009-10). I have no specific recollection of the design process, but it seems I was going for something clean and simple. I also seem to have carried this simplicity through both form and function, since, despite being a central script, it lacks the characteristic final forms seen in Marag, Hwagak, and Huskaghurb, and instead uses spaces to separate words.
*In Nid, a northern language related to Krah, the vowel lengthener as been appropriated for use as a nasal vowel marker.
*In Nid, a northern language related to Krah, the vowel lengthener as been appropriated for use as a nasal vowel marker.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Hüskaghurb Script (c. 2010)
This is another sort of minimalist script. As I mentioned, I created this one just by messing around with Marag script. It is essentially a compressed and stretched version of Marag with a few alterations. I am not 100% happy with the font I made of it. I think the variations in line thickness are not quite reflective of what I feel like it should be, so I will probably remake it one day. Nevertheless, it's not terrible, so I don't mind showing it. I also designed a slightly less impractical, un-widened version of this script that's a little more space-efficient, but I haven't made a font of it.
The language is very similar to Marag, but with some slightly older verb conjugations and some weird stuff going on with the vowels.
This is another sort of minimalist script. As I mentioned, I created this one just by messing around with Marag script. It is essentially a compressed and stretched version of Marag with a few alterations. I am not 100% happy with the font I made of it. I think the variations in line thickness are not quite reflective of what I feel like it should be, so I will probably remake it one day. Nevertheless, it's not terrible, so I don't mind showing it. I also designed a slightly less impractical, un-widened version of this script that's a little more space-efficient, but I haven't made a font of it.
The language is very similar to Marag, but with some slightly older verb conjugations and some weird stuff going on with the vowels.
Re: Frintha Script Family
You are an artist. How much fiddling around does it usually take to get a script you're satisfied with?
After ordering a pint of his favorite ale, Robert was perplexed when the barmaid replied that the fishmonger was next door. The Great English Vowel Shift had begun.
Re: Frintha Script Family
These are so cool! Keep up the good work
Low Pr. kalbeken < Lith. kalbėti
Lith. sūris = cheese, Fr. souris = mouse... o_O
Lith. sūris = cheese, Fr. souris = mouse... o_O
Re: Frintha Script Family
Ashusk Script (c. 2011)
The design concept for this script was an angular script with no curves and no vertical lines. For the most part, the letters of the original script have been rotated 45 degrees. Any regular handwriting in this script would almost certainly result in a curved variant, but I have not as of yet designed anything like that.
This script is used for both the Ashusk and Qooyou languages, but some letters have different values depending on the language being written. Any time a letter is given two values, the first value represents Ashusk orthography, and the second represents Qooyou orthography. A few letters are unique to one or the other language and are marked as such.
The choice between the two forms of <a> is purely aesthetic.
The design concept for this script was an angular script with no curves and no vertical lines. For the most part, the letters of the original script have been rotated 45 degrees. Any regular handwriting in this script would almost certainly result in a curved variant, but I have not as of yet designed anything like that.
This script is used for both the Ashusk and Qooyou languages, but some letters have different values depending on the language being written. Any time a letter is given two values, the first value represents Ashusk orthography, and the second represents Qooyou orthography. A few letters are unique to one or the other language and are marked as such.
The choice between the two forms of <a> is purely aesthetic.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Rekettye wrote:These are so cool! Keep up the good work
Thank you!Kuro no Mori wrote:You are an artist. How much fiddling around does it usually take to get a script you're satisfied with?
It really depends on the script. The Beeba script (to come) was designed specifically for a preexisting language, and I was not really happy with the results until I turned it into a font. Gondel script (to come), on the other hand, was a sort of variation on some Beeba letters that sort of came about pretty quickly. I actually invented the Gondel language (much like I did with Huskaghurb) in order to find a place to use the script.
- Nortaneous
- Sumerul
- Posts: 4544
- Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:52 am
- Location: the Imperial Corridor
Re: Frintha Script Family
badass.
that said, pure alphabets *are* a bit boring. maybe pull some old eastern european-style not-quite-alphabet-but-not-quite-syllabary-either sort of thing, especially if you've got a lang with vowel harmony, or do what my roman handwriting (which by this point i've consciously modified enough that it's probably a conscript) does and have unintuitive digraphs everywhere and abbreviations for common words.
eh, there are advantages to that. typesetting, for one. i've given up trying to even figure out how to typeset my ngmwragh script, since i'm pretty sure i'd have to do diacritic placement manually.brandrinn wrote:There's not much to say about them mechanically, since they all kind of work the same way. Not unrealistic, just... blah.
that said, pure alphabets *are* a bit boring. maybe pull some old eastern european-style not-quite-alphabet-but-not-quite-syllabary-either sort of thing, especially if you've got a lang with vowel harmony, or do what my roman handwriting (which by this point i've consciously modified enough that it's probably a conscript) does and have unintuitive digraphs everywhere and abbreviations for common words.
Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.
Re: Frintha Script Family
The closest I have to that kind of thing in this family of scripts is the Gondel script, which I will introduce later. It has mandatory ligatures for any and all combinations of (liquid)+(nasal)+(geminate)+(stop)+(liquid), resulting in the existence of such ponderous letters as 'lbby' and 'nddw'. The script does not indicate or acknowledge word boundaries, so the ligatures will span word boundaries. It is hell creating a font for this...although the letters are usually fairly regularly formed, it's not quite regular enough that I can automate it...I really have to make each character separately.
I have another family of scripts that I may someday introduce as well. Two of them are quite plainly and obviously based on Indic scripts (this was before I was trying to make the conworld a little more realistic; one of them is unabashedly based on Southeast Asian scripts), so what I did was create a Brahmi-like proto-script that is nevertheless purposely different from Brahmi. I have designed two other sort of Southeast Asian scriptsI can create other scripts from the proto-script that are not so obviously Indic in appearance, and just handwave the other two.
I have another family of scripts that I may someday introduce as well. Two of them are quite plainly and obviously based on Indic scripts (this was before I was trying to make the conworld a little more realistic; one of them is unabashedly based on Southeast Asian scripts), so what I did was create a Brahmi-like proto-script that is nevertheless purposely different from Brahmi. I have designed two other sort of Southeast Asian scriptsI can create other scripts from the proto-script that are not so obviously Indic in appearance, and just handwave the other two.
- WeepingElf
- Smeric
- Posts: 1630
- Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 5:00 pm
- Location: Braunschweig, Germany
- Contact:
Re: Frintha Script Family
These scripts just ROCK AND ROLL!!!
...brought to you by the Weeping Elf
Tha cvastam émi cvastam santham amal phelsa. -- Friedrich Schiller
ESTAR-3SG:P human-OBJ only human-OBJ true-OBJ REL-LOC play-3SG:A
Tha cvastam émi cvastam santham amal phelsa. -- Friedrich Schiller
ESTAR-3SG:P human-OBJ only human-OBJ true-OBJ REL-LOC play-3SG:A
Re: Frintha Script Family
Here is the babel text in Marag:brandrinn wrote:I would love to see larger samples of these; they are a joy to look at.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Unintuitive digraphs, as in having two arbitrary non-standard letters for a sound (I assume you're talking about Roman handwritting in English)? Or do you mean unusual spontaneous ligatures? I have those (I spell el in Spanish in a different fashion than I spell <e> and <l> separately, for instance).Nortaneous wrote:that said, pure alphabets *are* a bit boring. maybe pull some old eastern european-style not-quite-alphabet-but-not-quite-syllabary-either sort of thing, especially if you've got a lang with vowel harmony, or do what my roman handwriting (which by this point i've consciously modified enough that it's probably a conscript) does and have unintuitive digraphs everywhere and abbreviations for common words.
Re: Frintha Script Family
What do your two versions of 'el' look like?
Re: Frintha Script Family
When I spell el, I spell both letters continuously and the <l> has a loop. My normal <l> looks just like capital I, that is, <l>, and I normally don't write letters continuously.clawgrip wrote:What do your two versions of 'el' look like?
My handwritting is very bad; most letters are ambiguous: a/e/o, v/r, g/s, f/t, ct/d, some final letter shapes can be only vaguely detected, and I also use tons of abbreviations: e-macron for "-mente", o-strike for "-ción" (I'm picking that up this year), ... I need to write really fast now, luckily my handwritting cannot get any worse.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Beeba Script (2011)
I was already working on the Beeba language, and decided it needed its own script, so I specifically set to work creating one for this language. I worked for a while making modifications to the proto-script, but was not really satisfied. Even once I had come up with a basically finalized script, I still didn't like it. But I was inspired to give it Roman-inspired serifs, and when I made it into a font, I was happier, and the clean look of the script has since grown on me. Handwritten Beeba still looks bad though.
*The second form of <y> is the older, more traditional form, and is more common in Southern Beeba. Northern Beeba more often uses the simplified left form.
The aspirated forms are derived from subscript ligatures with <h>.
I haven't fully decided if I will keep the extremely narrow spaces, but I'm thinking I will.
I was already working on the Beeba language, and decided it needed its own script, so I specifically set to work creating one for this language. I worked for a while making modifications to the proto-script, but was not really satisfied. Even once I had come up with a basically finalized script, I still didn't like it. But I was inspired to give it Roman-inspired serifs, and when I made it into a font, I was happier, and the clean look of the script has since grown on me. Handwritten Beeba still looks bad though.
*The second form of <y> is the older, more traditional form, and is more common in Southern Beeba. Northern Beeba more often uses the simplified left form.
The aspirated forms are derived from subscript ligatures with <h>.
I haven't fully decided if I will keep the extremely narrow spaces, but I'm thinking I will.
- Nortaneous
- Sumerul
- Posts: 4544
- Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:52 am
- Location: the Imperial Corridor
Re: Frintha Script Family
er, right, ligatures. my <ng> is a yogh, <ing> is yogh-bar, <in> is three smallcaps L-like things with a bar, <im> is four of them with a bar, etc. there's also one for <th>, but i'm not sure how to describe it.Ean wrote:Unintuitive digraphs, as in having two arbitrary non-standard letters for a sound (I assume you're talking about Roman handwritting in English)? Or do you mean unusual spontaneous ligatures? I have those (I spell el in Spanish in a different fashion than I spell <e> and <l> separately, for instance).Nortaneous wrote:that said, pure alphabets *are* a bit boring. maybe pull some old eastern european-style not-quite-alphabet-but-not-quite-syllabary-either sort of thing, especially if you've got a lang with vowel harmony, or do what my roman handwriting (which by this point i've consciously modified enough that it's probably a conscript) does and have unintuitive digraphs everywhere and abbreviations for common words.
and then <the> is <th> + low bar, <that> is <th> + high bar, <they> is <th> + slash, <is> is u-bar (although that's just a ligature), <of> is phi, <if> is phi-bar, <what> is <wh>-bar, <which> is <whh>-bar, and there are more that i can't remember right now.
Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Interesting; these all come from deformations, right?
When I write in English, which is not that common, I spell "the" as thorn and "that" as thorn-t; but that counts as abbreviation.
When I write in English, which is not that common, I spell "the" as thorn and "that" as thorn-t; but that counts as abbreviation.
Re: Frintha Script Family
You have quite a few alphabets...what prompted the logo/ideography for Himmaswa?
Re: Frintha Script Family
I would imagine that many people who like making conscripts like to try to make scripts of different types...alphabets, featural scripts, abugidas, etc., so eventually they think "wouldn't it be cool if I had a logographic script!" But the sheer size of the task makes it incredibly difficult. I originally made about 30 or so characters in an attempt to create a script for the analytic language I was creating (Himmaswa), but kind of lost inspiration for both the script and the language. Every now and then I considered reviving them, but never got very far until recently, when I revamped the language and came up with a clearer picture of how the characters are built. With my new inspiration I created hundreds of characters within the span of a few months. I credit my increased knowledge of Chinese characters that I have been acquiring for the past 10 years while living in Japan as giving me the knowledge I need to effectively create it. This means that consequently my script is constructed almost identically to Chinese characters, but oh well. I don't mind using the same framework as long as the actual content is all my own creation. Now I use the fluency and lexicon threads as an impetus to create new characters. I haven't done a count recently, but at this point I think there are over 650 characters.
One of the hardest parts about the logistics of creating a logographic script is keeping track of the characters. But I keep track of them by locating a CJK character with a similar meaning and storing it in that space in the font, and just keep a dictionary that uses the font. I also have a character based dictionary where I can look up characters based on the radicals. This is useful to make sure I don't accidentally create the same character twice (this happened once).
One of the hardest parts about the logistics of creating a logographic script is keeping track of the characters. But I keep track of them by locating a CJK character with a similar meaning and storing it in that space in the font, and just keep a dictionary that uses the font. I also have a character based dictionary where I can look up characters based on the radicals. This is useful to make sure I don't accidentally create the same character twice (this happened once).
Last edited by clawgrip on Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Frintha Script Family
Just a suggestion, but you could make a space character with a width of 0, that way the ligatures won't form and you won't have a space between wordsclawgrip wrote:The closest I have to that kind of thing in this family of scripts is the Gondel script, which I will introduce later. It has mandatory ligatures for any and all combinations of (liquid)+(nasal)+(geminate)+(stop)+(liquid), resulting in the existence of such ponderous letters as 'lbby' and 'nddw'. The script does not indicate or acknowledge word boundaries, so the ligatures will span word boundaries. It is hell creating a font for this...although the letters are usually fairly regularly formed, it's not quite regular enough that I can automate it...I really have to make each character separately.
I have another family of scripts that I may someday introduce as well. Two of them are quite plainly and obviously based on Indic scripts (this was before I was trying to make the conworld a little more realistic; one of them is unabashedly based on Southeast Asian scripts), so what I did was create a Brahmi-like proto-script that is nevertheless purposely different from Brahmi. I have designed two other sort of Southeast Asian scriptsI can create other scripts from the proto-script that are not so obviously Indic in appearance, and just handwave the other two.