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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:42 pm 
Niš
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Can you show us some Dravian currency? How cheap are your cigarettes?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:44 pm 
Lebom
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What are some of the customary cooking styles and dishes of your country? Have you been invaded by McDonalds yet?

Where did you learn to speak and write English so fluently? (I am ashamed of my own ignorance.)


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:52 pm 
Šriftom
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Melend wrote:
Where did you learn to speak and write English so fluently? (I am ashamed of my own ignorance.)


Dewrad learned to speak and write English so fluently in fucking England*.

Dewrad wrote:
His first letter to me, helpfully translated by yours truly, is below. The original is at the end of the post.

It stands to reason the rest of the letters are translations as well, especially since Tedur says in the first letter So much for all the English I know.

*Also fucking in England.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:44 am 
Sumerul
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What is this crematura thing?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:28 am 
Avisaru
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Judging by context, it might be some kind of alcoholic coffee.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:04 pm 
Sanno
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Salmoneus wrote:
Sevly wrote:
So, Teddy, is your name a very common one in Dravia? And whats up with Tedur ~ Tedú? Is that a common way of forming nicks?

Also your flag is typical European boringness, but that's to be expected.


It's actually a really weird flag for its geographical location. It's the only green-blue flag in Europe, and one of only two yellow-green flags in Europe (the other is Lithuania). There are five other yellow-blues, but other than Andorra and that weird postmodernist Bosnia-Herzegovina thing they made up, the other three are all geographically contiguous (romania, moldova and ukraine).

So it's not the flag you'd at all expect.
Breaking faykabe for a moment, there's actually a reason behind the colour choice. Dravia covers what in our timeline are the Hungarian counties of Tolna, Somogy, Baranya and Zala, with a bit of Veszprem and Vas. The county colours in this area are yellow and green or blue and white: I've combined them into what is admittedly a rather ugly mix. I've thought about changing the flag to a blue and white bicolour defaced with the coat of arms, but it turns out that's already used by San Marino. On the other hand, the present flag differs from that of Gabon only in the shade of blue used. Thoughts would be welcome on this.

Quote:
[Not as weird, though, as the idea of a post-communist junta...?]
Tedur, bless his little cotton socks, might not have been entirely clear here: the junta was the final stage of Dravia's communist government. Quoting from Jones' "Concise History of Dravia":

Quote:
After the death of Tito and the resulting rise of instability in the early 1980s, Dravea entered a period of recession and stagnation. Civil unrest was common, and the Dravean Communist Party was riven by internal conflict. One faction of the Party, supported by the burocracy and Dravean intelligencia desired even greater economic liberalisation, believing that the increasingly unreliable support of Yugoslavia meant that Dravea should seek to find its own place in the world economy. The opposing faction, finding a great deal of support in the armed forces, favoured a more hardline Communist attitude and a return to "grass-roots" socialism. Led by Pelaja Murana, the first female Premier of a Communist country, the liberalist came to power in 1987 and began a series of economic reforms, aimed at rehabilitating the country's economy and relaxing restrictions on private enterprise.

In early 1988, a group of conservative high-ranking officers in the Dravean People's Army considered Murana to have gone too far in her reforms and formed el Comitat pe l'emergèncea del stat The State Emergency Committee in response. At their orders, on the 29th of July 1988, Murana (who had been holidaying at Traçana by Lake Pasun) was placed under house arrest. The seat of government, El Palas del Zant, was occupied by the army and the Comitat took control of the government.

Led by Gamalel Nar, Marshal of the People's Army, the Committee enacted a series of measures reversing Murana's reforms, and granting extended powers to Secortat, the State Security Service. Rationing was introduced, compounding the country's already severe economic difficulties. These moves were highly unpopular with the population at large and were met by civil unrest accross the country, which was swiftly and brutally crushed by the Army.

Like Murana, the Comitat's primary concern was rescuing the country from the severe economic depression it had found itself in. However, their methods differed significantly. The Comitat advocated a return to Communist orthodoxy, believing that Molnare's adoption of Yugoslavian autogestion was the root cause of the economic downturn. While Murana advocated further liberalisation of the economy and expanding private enterprise, the Comitat saw this as a threat to the internal stability of the country and the Communist Party's hold on power. Instead, they believed that economic hardship could be overcome by increasing the country's balance of exports. Dravea's output of consumer goods was notoriously bad in quality, so the Comitat preferred to focus instead on heavy industry: it perhaps being no coincidence that their strongest core of support was in areas dominated by the heavy industries, which had been marginalised to a degree by Murana's reforms.


It is a reaction against this Junta, the Comitat which led to the subsequent Civil War and overthrow of Communism.

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(NB Dewrad is behaving like an adult - a petty, sarcastic and uncharitable adult, admittedly, but none the less note the infinitely higher quality of flame)


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:55 pm 
Sanno
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Dewrad wrote:
Breaking faykabe for a moment, there's actually a reason behind the colour choice. Dravia covers what in our timeline are the Hungarian counties of Tolna, Somogy, Baranya and Zala, with a bit of Veszprem and Vas. The county colours in this area are yellow and green or blue and white: I've combined them into what is admittedly a rather ugly mix. I've thought about changing the flag to a blue and white bicolour defaced with the coat of arms, but it turns out that's already used by San Marino. On the other hand, the present flag differs from that of Gabon only in the shade of blue used. Thoughts would be welcome on this.

Well, the problem with blue and white is that it looks dangerously close to the Pan-Slavic Tricolour - slav nationalists encouraged slavic countries to adopt flags of white, blue and red (hence Czech Republic, Slovakia, Slovenia, Croatia, Serbia and Russia, plus Poland has 2/3). If Dravea is keen on not being Slavic, they may have intentionally stayed away from blue and white.
Personally, from those four colours, I'd probably have gone with green, white and yellow - i.e. substituting in yellow for the red of Italy, Hungary and Bulgaria (given, I assume, Hungarian dominion in the past, the Hungarians might have liked to give them a Hungarian-style flag, which would not necessarily have been rejected afterwards). But it's not like your flag is impossible or anything.
[Actually, what I would do (if I were following my current whim, at least) would be to have Hungary give the region a horizontal yellow-white-and-green flag, which the Draveans then turned 90 degrees into a green-white-yellow vertical tricolour (i.e. to show their liberty by adopting the french design).]
[[But having said that, looking at those regions, it does seem as though blue is the dominant colour]]

I wouldn't worry too much about the Gabonese flag. Flags can be very similar, or even identical. Ireland and Cote d'Ivoire are just inverted. Malta and Indonesia both have the old flag of Hesse (though apparently they've adopted different sizes), which is the same as Poland upside-down. A more precise parallel: Chad and Romania have the same flag, except with very slightly different shades of blue in one stripe.
Quote:
Quote:
[Not as weird, though, as the idea of a post-communist junta...?]
Tedur, bless his little cotton socks, might not have been entirely clear here: the junta was the final stage of Dravia's communist government.

Oh, right, that does make more sense.
Although I'll note that technically the first female communist premier was Savka Dabčević-Kučar, and that if she doesn't count (because Croatia was a constituent republic, not fully independent), then Milka Planinc of Federal Yugoslavia should!

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:45 pm 
Šriftom
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the jews are the most powerful people on earth, do you not agree?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:59 pm 
Sumerul
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Dewrad wrote:
Breaking faykabe for a moment


i've never seen that word spoonerised like that before
stealin it.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:02 am 
Avisaru
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What is the etymology of Tedur?

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Adúljôžal ônal kol ví éža únah kex yaxlr gmlĥ hôga jô ônal kru ansu frú.
Ansu frú ônal savel zaš gmlĥ a vek Adúljôžal vé jaga čaþ kex.
Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh. Ônal zeh.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:32 am 
Sanno
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Sevly wrote:
So, Teddy, is your name a very common one in Dravia? And whats up with Tedur ~ Tedú? Is that a common way of forming nicks?


Tedur Covaç wrote:
No and yes respectively.


Tedur is, by his own admission, not a linguist. So if I intercede on his behalf here:

Dravian nickname formation is, as far as I can determine, a fairly regular pattern. You take the first syllable of the name and follow it with a stressed vowel: -ó or -ú for men, -í for women. So when I've skyped with Tedur he's called me Danó [dǝˈno] from Danèl [dǝˈnɛɫ]. Sometimes it's not the first syllable but the normal stressed syllable: the diminutive form of Alesandro [ǝleˈsaŋdru] is Sandrú [sǝŋˈdru] (although I have heard Alú and Lesó).

Matrix: Tedur has no idea, he just says he's just named after Tedur Sojanèsc, a famous wrestler from the 70s. On consulting an onomasticon, however, it turns out that it's a reflex of Greek Θεόδωρος, or "Theodore".

Adjective Recoil wrote:
When I asked about Dravian media, I was thinking about movies, TV shows, games... I would think it's difficult to get the latest Star Trek movie in Dravian.


Tedur Covaç wrote:
I'm confused. This could be Dan's fault: his Dravian isn't as good as he thinks it is and sometimes what he sends me is almost unreadable (I wonder if the schmuck will actually translate this?) [yes, I will, and I will also add that I feel that "schmuck" is an inspired translation of çáiser - Dew] Are you asking whether we are some kind of backward hellhole which has difficulty in obtaining recent films? If so, no, we aren't! We are very up to date, and sometimes we even have films released on DVD before you do in the West! Of course, nobody thinks that these bootleg pirate copies hawked by market traders are the genuine article. They're also about the only time one sees foreign films dubbed: normally in the cinema and on TV they're subtitled, but because the picture quality is so poor and the subtitles on the bootleg copies can't be read so a bunch of amateurs get together and rerecord the dialogue in Dravian. The result is normally excreable: I remember once watching one of the Fast and Furious movies where every single character was voiced by one man with a thick Tralatènca accent.

We also have TV over here, did you know? It's amazing. Almost 100 different channels and fuck all to watch. All the towns and most of the countryside has cable TV now, which is a fairly recent thing. We only got TV in the 50's, apparently, and of course it was all state-controlled by Rádio-Televiseun Dravènca. When I was a kid there were only two channels: RTD1 and RTD2. The second one was more cultural stuff and films, while the first had news, sports and really bad telenovèle. At first, these were home-grown (I think the authorities were scared of showing us the decadent capitalist societies of Colombia and Mexico) but these days they're imported and dubbed. Then about ten years ago the government lifted its monopoly and allowed advertising on RTD1 and RTD2. There was an explosion of TV channels. Some of the ones we get are localised versions of pan-European channels, like Canal+, some are really weird niche channels like Canal degl Rodaglei Arvonèsquei, a channel for dairy farmers out in the Aravona.

Some famous TV shows in Dravia? None. Most of them are remakes of foreign shows anyway, like O fègl, na fègla. I only ever turn it on for the sport and late-night softcore porn.

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Salmoneus wrote:
(NB Dewrad is behaving like an adult - a petty, sarcastic and uncharitable adult, admittedly, but none the less note the infinitely higher quality of flame)


Last edited by Dewrad on Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:34 am 
Sanno
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Astraios wrote:
Do you know any gays I can sleep with when I visit?

Tedur Covaç wrote:
Personally, no, although I do have suspicions about one of the waiters that works at L'Elefant. I do walk past a caman* used mainly by gay men every day though. And, failing all that, it's been a long time since I've had any myself. You could always [I am not translating that. -Dew]


*A caman is a Turkish bath. They're still very common in Dravia.

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Salmoneus wrote:
(NB Dewrad is behaving like an adult - a petty, sarcastic and uncharitable adult, admittedly, but none the less note the infinitely higher quality of flame)


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 12:45 pm 
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I'm already booking tickets.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:56 pm 
Smeric
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Who would be least trustworthy: a Jew, an American, a Russian, or a Gypsy?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 6:51 pm 
Smeric
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Well?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:44 pm 
Avisaru
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You already have two characters named Sojanèsc/Sojanèsca... Yet Sojane is the capital city, nè c'est pas? I find it very unbelievable that you have such a common name derived from people living in the capital. Note that bloodlines - and thus surnames - usually move rural>city and then die out in the urban environment to be replaced with new ones... you have a lot of Frenchmen named after obscure little villages and very few named after Paris. Sometimes in a colonial context you see people named (de) France and (de) Paris etc. but these are usually colonials who made their names up anyway. Or were given them on a whim. I very much doubt Dravia had a colonial empire. You see this not only in France but in pretty much every country of Europe, and especially in the East (barring situations like Vilnius and Krakow that have been cultural millieus for forever (and people named after those cities usually tend to be Jews, not being anti-semitic, just descriptive)) because our capitals tend to have been villages of a few thousands until very recently (say a century and a half ago). So there are very few Serbians named Beogradski, Croats named Zagrebski, Macedonians named Skopski, Slovaks named Bratislavski (hahahaha) etc. Hungarians have Buday but Buda was a huge HUGE city in medieval times... you paint the Dravians as a rural, noncosmopolitan folk and I doubt Sojane has left much of an impression on history. It's true a lot of Romanians bear the name Bucurescu but keep in mind Bucuresti is the plural of Bucurescu, which seems to have been a large clan so and so many years ago. They're not named after the city, quite the opposite. I doubt this is true for Sojane whatever your etymology of it is. "People of the Soj clan"? Kek.

Another criticism. You seem to have some misconceptions about Eastern Europe. The first, that redubbed blackmarket DVDs and other 90s kinda shit is still prevalent here, which it really isn't, we've modernized massively; the average Eastern European listens to more rap than folk and any phenomenon you'd find memetically popular in New York or Paris will be so in Prague and Chisinau, in the original English too! The era of isolation of the east is over. Now, I say we've modernized, of course we're still poor as fuck. And lots of suicides, other concomitant baggage reflecting the culture shift, etc. but the impression I get from you is that you think all the "Ivan Drago" stereotypes are still active. Secondly, you seem to think French-style villages and towns are how Eastern Europe works, with your guy being born in some few-thousands-strong winemaking town that's active and fun and they make wine even today, how quaint & pretty ... all the villages are empty. Only old people live there. It was a bit different in the 90s, though, I have friends who grew up in villages that had other children, and young adults (!) so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

My third and final question. How did these pseudo-French, who don't even sound particularly Eastern Romance, get to the middle of the pannonian plain without getting assimilated/exterminated/enslaved like all the other ethnicities who've tried it? Balaton to Budapest used to speak Slavic, there were Avars in the grasslands, probably some of the old Romano-Illyrian stock hanging around and yet when Arpad came all these people in the lowlands got Magyarized. Took a few hundred years, yeah, but still. The only people under Hungarian dominion who successfully resisted this were highland shepherds like the Slovaks and Vlachs, even successive waves of German colonists got assimilated early on (the ones we see in the ethnographic maps of ~1880 arrived there much later, most in the 16th century but with the overlordship and umbrage of the Austrian state behind them). Then whence your Dravians. Either they came as refugees from France or are some population of Romance shephards moved West - which isn't too unrealistic - but there's not much for herders to do in farmland unless the farmers get killed, which the Hungarian crown would not support, and anyway Dravian doesn't sound anything like Romanian/Aromanian/Megleno-Romanian/Istro-Romanian. And if they're French, it would take a massive number of them moving there to form a self-sustaining community. Some Byzantine emperor settled 30,000 Slavs in Anatolia and they assimilated, while 60,000 Kurds were moved to Mashhad and managed to survive as an ethnos to the present. Let's say 50,000 is more or less the minimum, how did they get to southern Hungary? What did the Hungarian crown/existing Hungarian peasantry there have to say about it? Tons of problems with that theory. Lastly you could say they're remnants of the native Romance population but that's impossible as I showed above.

PS: Eastern Europeans, especially bydlo ones like your specimen, get drunk for the first time before 10-11 y.o... "How could this be" you ask in a shocked tone from an enlightened Occidental viewing platform high in the clouds above North America, watching the world through red-white-and-blue tinted telescreens. Well, mate, the East is as it is. Mores and customs are very different here. I find occidental writers do too much projection when they portray foreign cultures; it's very close minded to believe all people act the same and have the same belief systems/general life milestones and ages when those occur etc. etc. I suppose they do so as a consequence of egalitarianism.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:56 pm 
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I can't believe Dewrad managed to find a non-racist Eastern European.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:32 pm 
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patiku wrote:
I can't believe Dewrad managed to find a non-racist Eastern European.


You did expect to find magic there, so what makes the odd non-racist so unexpected?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:26 am 
Smeric
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Can someone tell me if Eddy's post is worth reading? I still have him foed.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:06 am 
Sanno
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Actually, 'Paris' is the 123rd most common surname in the whole of France. In terms of frequency, it would be the equivalent of being called Macdonald or Johnston or Carr or Hart in the UK - more common than Williamson or Barker or Lawson or the like. That makes it the sort of name it's really not unusual to encounter multiple holders of.

Regarding Dravean - Dew knows a lot more about eastern romance than you do, I'm sure.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:51 am 
Šriftom
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Rusanov wrote:
Your concountry does not exactly conform with my expectations, therefore it is utterly impossible

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:47 am 
Avisaru
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Of course westerners inherently know more shit than anyone else, including locals, on any subject and I'm remiss to think otherwise /s

Feel free to be wrong.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:46 am 
Avisaru
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R.Rusanov wrote:
My third and final question. How did these pseudo-French, who don't even sound particularly Eastern Romance, get to the middle of the pannonian plain without getting assimilated/exterminated/enslaved like all the other ethnicities who've tried it? Balaton to Budapest used to speak Slavic, there were Avars in the grasslands, probably some of the old Romano-Illyrian stock hanging around and yet when Arpad came all these people in the lowlands got Magyarized. Took a few hundred years, yeah, but still. The only people under Hungarian dominion who successfully resisted this were highland shepherds like the Slovaks and Vlachs, even successive waves of German colonists got assimilated early on (the ones we see in the ethnographic maps of ~1880 arrived there much later, most in the 16th century but with the overlordship and umbrage of the Austrian state behind them). Then whence your Dravians. Either they came as refugees from France or are some population of Romance shephards moved West - which isn't too unrealistic - but there's not much for herders to do in farmland unless the farmers get killed, which the Hungarian crown would not support, and anyway Dravian doesn't sound anything like Romanian/Aromanian/Megleno-Romanian/Istro-Romanian. And if they're French, it would take a massive number of them moving there to form a self-sustaining community. Some Byzantine emperor settled 30,000 Slavs in Anatolia and they assimilated, while 60,000 Kurds were moved to Mashhad and managed to survive as an ethnos to the present. Let's say 50,000 is more or less the minimum, how did they get to southern Hungary? What did the Hungarian crown/existing Hungarian peasantry there have to say about it? Tons of problems with that theory. Lastly you could say they're remnants of the native Romance population but that's impossible as I showed above.


First, quit saying pseudo-french, it makes you sound like an idiot. Secondly, if I remember correctly Dravean is suppose to be descended from Dalmatian or related romance language. It is suppose to lack the palatalization of the velars like Dalmatia did. So if it doesn't sound like Romanian and so on, then well good because it isn't suppose to. I don't know why you obsess over this idea that it is french.

Quote:
PS: Eastern Europeans, especially bydlo ones like your specimen, get drunk for the first time before 10-11 y.o... "How could this be" you ask in a shocked tone from an enlightened Occidental viewing platform high in the clouds above North America, watching the world through red-white-and-blue tinted telescreens. Well, mate, the East is as it is. Mores and customs are very different here. I find occidental writers do too much projection when they portray foreign cultures; it's very close minded to believe all people act the same and have the same belief systems/general life milestones and ages when those occur etc. etc. I suppose they do so as a consequence of egalitarianism.


And this is where it becomes obvious how full of shit you are. Dewrad isn't american in any sense of the word. He is welsh and I assume you have been here long enough to see the video of him doing the yard of ale, so this mistake is really unforgivable. I haven't had to many interactions with you or read your posts that much, but all this general idiocy and xenophobia doesn't come off as a surprise when your avatar has the symbol it has in it.*

*yes I know it is just a pagan symbol, but paganism in eastern europe is heavily infiltrated with racists and fascists. Also the fact you put that symbol over Romania and Hungary and I think Albania shows a bit more of what type of trash you really are.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:27 pm 
Avisaru
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On another subject, excuse me if I missed it, but I would be interested to know whether your penpal votes, and if he does, whom he votes for and why.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:34 pm 
Sanno
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R.Rusanov wrote:
Of course westerners inherently know more shit than anyone else, including locals, on any subject and I'm remiss to think otherwise /s

Feel free to be wrong.

You say that I have some misconceptions about Eastern Europe. You, however, have some misconceptions about me. For the past fifteen or so years I worked in hotels, bars and restaurants, both front and back of house. Not in North America, but here in southern England. An interesting thing about the industry here is how dominated it is by immigrants from former Eastern bloc countries. I have known, drunk with and worked with these people for years, some of them I count as close friends who I see on a fairly regular basis. Tedur Covaç is, essentially, a composite character based on some of the Eastern Europeans I've known. For example, his recollection of his childhood owes a lot to conversations I've had with a close friend of mine: he's about my age, a chef, and comes from Katowice in Poland. Tedur's description of Vailana is based on how my old commis chef, a Hungarian from Villány, describes his home town (for what it's worth, the current demographics of Villány show the majority of the population being in the 18-59 age bracket: it's not just the elderly there.) So yeah, while I'm hardly a local, I'm not entirely uninformed. Also, Dravia is fictional, and a touch satirical at that; I'm well aware that Central Europe produces more than gay porn and uranium, but emphasising the latter is funnier.

I think that covers the bulk of accusations leveled at me in your first two paragraphs? Salmoneus has already discussed the issue of Sojanèsc as a surname. (Also, I happen to like it, and Sojane has historically always been a small town. The etymology is of Imperial vintage, fwiw: Sopianae.)

As for the final paragraph, there is more to address. You think that Dravian isn't very Eastern Romance, that it is mere pseudo-French. Well, that is your opinion and you are entitled to it. On the other hand, you clearly know fuck all about Eastern Romance so I find it difficult to give your opinion the time of day. I could always explain further if you'd like? Briefly, however, Vortex is quite right in remembering that Dravian's closest relative is (Vegliot) Dalmatian. It also has a lot in common with North-Eastern Italian varieties, particularly Venetian. Varieties of Romanian occur at the opposite geographical end of this dialect continuum: expecting Dravian to sound particularly like Romanian is much like expecting Andalusian Spanish to have a strong resemblence to Walloon.

Now, how did the Dravians get to "the middle of the Pannonian plain"? Well, for a start, they didn't. They aren't in the middle of the Pannonian plain, but in the hill-country of Transdanubia. The Dravians themselves claim to be autochthonous, pointing to a glorious unbroken history going all the way back to the province of Roman Pannonia and the time of the Caesars: as the Romanians claim to be the descendants of Trajan's legionaries, so the Dravians claim they have been there all the way through: an island of pure Romanitas in a sea of Slavonic and Magyar barbarians. On the other hand, they would: since the 19th century the varying ethnicities of central and eastern Europe have been playing out the "we were here first" game with various bloody and distasteful results. Dravia hasn't escaped that particularly unpleasant aspect of post-Habsburg nationalism. Like most Eastern and Central Europeans, the truth of their origins makes them uncomfortable.

However, their claims to have been in the general area since the fall of the Empire does contain a grain of truth. Romanised populations survived the influx of the Goths, Lombards and Slavs: at one time Dravian (or rather "Proto-Dravian") was spoken in communities much further to the west of modern Dravia: remnant populations in what is now northern Slovenia attest to this. However, as a rule they retreated from the fertile lowland areas to the hills, ceding the valleys and plains to the incoming Slavic-speaking populations. That there was a great deal of admixture is clear: Slavic loan-words penetrate even the oldest strata of the Dravian lexicon (interestingly, Dravian has separate words for maternal and paternal grandparents: the latter are loans from Slavic, while the former are native Romance). In the early Middle Ages, the area was characterised by transhumant Romance-speakers in the hills and sedentary Slavic-speakers in the valleys and plains, all ruled over by a warrior elite of Avar extraction. Following the Avar defeat by Charlemagne, the area was organised as a border principality with a Slavic-speaking elite (again, this is shown in the Dravian lexicon: vocabulary relating to law, nobility and so on is often from Slavic sources). Through a few twists of fate, this Slavic-ruled principality survived the initial Magyar invasion and only became part of the Kingdom of Hungary in the 1100s somewhen, much along the same lines as Croatia-Slavonia. Magyarisation was relatively light, with little in-migration by ethnic Hungarians: mainly nobles and landowners.

Then the Ottomans invaded and conquered what is now southern Dravia. The area was part of the military frontier for several centuries and much of the native nobility and the settled population was killed, deported or fled. When the area was reconquered, the Romance-speakers simply moved down from the hills, as it were. New settlers joined them from the German-speaking areas of the empire, and a number of Serbs were resettled. Again, not many Hungarians (there weren't really enough to go round): Hungarian linguistic influence on Dravian varieties has historically been negligible in the southern heartlands: the lands to the north of lake Balaton (Latèsca in Dravian) which remained part of Royal Hungary had far more Magyar influence.

(Also, Tedur is not impressed at being called a bydlo. He's not even Polish, for a start. He comes from a very nice respectable family: his father was a school teacher. He suspects you're Serbian, but that's only because he's rabidly Serbophobic. That's not actually a very common prejudice in Dravia. I suspect it's rooted in women troubles, as he refuses to discuss it.)

_________________
Some useful Dravian links: Grammar - Lexicon - Ask a Dravian


Salmoneus wrote:
(NB Dewrad is behaving like an adult - a petty, sarcastic and uncharitable adult, admittedly, but none the less note the infinitely higher quality of flame)


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