Ablaut and Pitch Accent

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PVER•PVERVM•AMAT
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Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by PVER•PVERVM•AMAT »

Would it be plausible to have a language in which: a pitch accent exists, two tense exist and the marked tense is marked by ablaut of the accented syllable/mora? If so, how could this derive diachronically?

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by ObsequiousNewt »

It doesn't have to derive from something. Our (earliest) reconstruction of PIE started with something similar to that.


Ο ορανς τα ανα̨ριθομον ϝερρον εͱεν ανθροποτροφον.
Το̨ ανθροπς αυ̨τ εκψον επ αθο̨ οραναμο̨ϝον.
Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν.

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by PVER•PVERVM•AMAT »

Thank you very much. Now, I have another question: in a pitch accent language, could something similar to blank verse exist, but with pitch instead of stress?

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by Jipí »

Sure. I was gonna mention Greek, but that uses syllable weight, not pitch, as the basis for its meters.

I don't know what you've read about ablaut so far, but if you haven't already looked it up, read on its development from PIE on (ē/ō ~ e/o ~ Ø > millenia of sound change > a whole bunch of series) to not get stupid and unreasonable results. Wikipedia should be helpful there.
Last edited by Jipí on Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by ObsequiousNewt »

Jipí wrote:Sure, look at Greek.

I don't know what you've read about ablaut so far, but if you haven't already looked it up, read on its development from PIE on (ē/ō ~ e/o ~ Ø > millenia of sound change > a whole bunch of series) to not get stupid and unreasonable results. Wikipedia should be helpful there.
What I've read about Greek (not very much) seems to suggest that meter was based on length, not tone.


Ο ορανς τα ανα̨ριθομον ϝερρον εͱεν ανθροποτροφον.
Το̨ ανθροπς αυ̨τ εκψον επ αθο̨ οραναμο̨ϝον.
Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν. Θαιν.

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by Jipí »

ObsequiousNewt wrote:What I've read about Greek (not very much) seems to suggest that meter was based on length, not tone.
Yes, sorry, I corrected myself in a ninja edit already.

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by PVER•PVERVM•AMAT »

All right. Do you know any good books on PIE ablaut?

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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by Dewrad »

I'm not sure there are any books devoted solely to just that topic, but any decent handbook should cover the basics reasonably.
Some useful Dravian links: Grammar - Lexicon - Ask a Dravian
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Re: Ablaut and Pitch Accent

Post by Drydic »

ObsequiousNewt wrote:It doesn't have to derive from something. Our (earliest) reconstruction of PIE started with something similar to that.
Well it does, but that something isn't always recoverable.
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