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Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 12:35 am
by kodé
So, I've been playing around with this idea for the last year or so, but because I hate typing things in prose (I do enough of that for school), I've delayed showing this on the zeeb. I also apologize for being laconic below: I'm really not great at generating prose.

Basically, this is a daughterlang of a generic Latin American Spanish dialect. The main change is the loss of coda consonants, which however leave traces on following words belonging to the same stress group. The result is somewhat like Celtic initial consonant mutation: for example, the initial /p/ in the noun /pero/ mutates into [f] or depending on the article in front of it (/pero/ -> [pero], but /el pero/ -> [e bero], /un pero/ -> , /los peros/ -> [lo fero]). Of course, this occurs as a diachronic change word-internally (e.g., /comp4a4/ -> /ko"b4a/, /obispo/ -> /owifo/), but because there are no alternations, this is less interesting. The main synchronic effects of this change are initial mutations of nouns after articles, prepositions, and prenominal adjectives, initial mutations of verbs after preclitics, and allomorphs of these particles (especially articles and verbal clitics) when preceded by another particle. Due to stress or unpredictability (either one could work), there is no mutation between two content words (e.g., verbs and arguments, nouns and postnominal adjectives). I haven't yet completely decided on the specific dialect I'm deriving Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO] from, except that it has seseo, and probably should have coda /s/ -> [h], since that is a requisite step in the mutation process.

The following chart shows the possible mutations. The left column contains possible onset elements, the top row contains possible coda elements, and the boxes show the resulting mutation when the coda precedes the onset within the same stress group. Remember that the coda element never surfaces, and is only "visible" in the mutation of the following onset.

These are the segments contain in each element group:

Code: Select all

#   /#,D,p,k/ (i.e., preceded by a consonant not /s,m,n,l,r/ or by a stress group boundary)
H   /s/
N   /m,n/
L   /l/
R   /r/
V   /V/ (i.e., preceded by a vowel)

    #   H   N   L   R   V
p   p   f   b   b   b   p
t   t   T   d   d   d   t
k   k   x   g   g   g   k
b   b   f   m   b   b   w
d   d   T   n   l   4   0
g   g   x   N   g   g   0
tS  tS  S   dZ  dZ  dZ  tS
f   f   f   b   v   v   v
s   s   s   dz  z   z   z
h   h   h   k   T   S   0
m   m   p   m   m   m   m
n   n   t   n   n   n   n
J   J   tS  J   J   J   J
r   r   S   dr  l   r   r
l   l   T   d   l   r   l
j   j   S   J   j   j   j
w   w   f   m   w   w   w
V   C   s   n   l   4   V
The following examples show how this works synchronically to create mutations in nouns. The left column gives the prenominal particle that triggers the mutation, while the top row gives examples of noun and verb roots that can get mutated.

Code: Select all

Particle                /pero,-a/   /bake4o,-a/  /todo,a/    /do"to,-4a/   /gato,-a/   /se"Jo,-4a/
/un/ 'INDF.MSC.SG'      u bero      u make4o     u dodo      u no"to       u Nato      u dze"Jo
/el/ 'DEF.MSC.SG'       e bero      e bake4o     e dodo      e lo"to       e gato      e ze"Jo
/una/ 'INDF.FEM.SG'     una pera    una wake4a   una toda    una oto-4a    una ata     una zeJo-4a
/la/ 'DEF.FEM.SG'       la pera     la wake4a    la toda     la oto-4a     la ata      la zeJo-4a
/unos/ 'INDF.MSC.PL'    uno fero    uno fake4o   uno Todo    uno Toto-4e   uno xato    uno seJo-4e
/los/ 'DEF.MSC.PL'      lo fero     lo fake4o    lo Todo     lo Toto-4e    lo xato     lo seJo-4e
/unas/ 'INDF.FEM.PL'    una fera    una fake4a   una Toda    una Toto-4a   una xata    una seJo-4a
/las/ 'DEF.FEM.PL'      la fera     la fake4a    la Toda     la Toto-4a    la xata     la seJo-4a
Some general patterns can be observed. First, all plural forms have the identical H-mutation: {uno,lo,la} [fero,-a]/[fake4o,-a]/[seJo4-e,a]. Second, the mutation provides the only distinction between feminine singulars and plurals: {una,la} [pera]/[wake4a]/[zeJo4a] vs. {una,la} [fera]/[fake4a]/[seJo4a].

The following chart shows what each mutation is derived from:

Code: Select all

p   {#,V}p, Hm
b   {N,L,R}p, {#,L,R}b, Nf
t   {#,V}t, Hn
d   {N,L,R}t, #d, N{l,r}
k   {#,V}k, Nh
g   {N,L,R}k, {#,L,R}g
dz  Ns
tS  {#,V}tS, HJ
dZ  {N,L,R}tS
f   H{p,b,w}, {#,H}f
T   H{t,d,l}, Lh
s   {#,H}s, HV
S   H{tS,r,j}, Rh
x   H{k,g}
h   {#,H}h
v   {L,R,V}f
z   {L,R,V}s
m   N{b,w}, {#,N,L,R,V}m
n   N{d,V}, {#,N,L,R,V}n
J   N{j}, {#,N,L,R,V}J
N   Ng
l   L{d,r,V}, {#,L,V}l
4   R{d,V}
r   Rl, {#,R,V}r
j   {#,L,R,V}j
w   Vb, {#,L,R,V}w
0   V{d,g,h}
I'm debating how opaque the orthography should be, e.g., should /uN, loH pero/ -> [u bero, lo fero] be spelled <u mpero, lo phero> or <u bero, lo fero>? The former is more Celtified, and thus cooler-looking, but the latter has the nice effect of making it look super confusing (e.g., <b> conflates /{N,L,R}p, {#,L,R}b, Nf/, instead of expressing them as <np>, <b>, <nf>, etc.). Until I decide, I'll just using boring/ugly X-SAMPA...

I've played around with word derivation, verbs, etc., but as I said above, I have a hard time transferring all this from my head to your screens. In the meantime, general comments/questions, help with the orthography, or specific information from those more knowledgeable about Spanish dialectology or Celtic mutations are welcome.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 1:00 am
by kusuri
kodé wrote:and thus cooler-looking
The choice is obvious.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 2:13 am
by con quesa
Quite neat, Kode! I'm curious what happens with the limited set of adjectives in Spanish that can fall between the article and the noun, like la buena fortuna - does the lenition happen on the adjective, leaving the noun unchanged? Does this syntactic construction even survive?

Also, what happens with non-coda consonant clusters like in peligro - are these simplified as well?

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 8:24 am
by Yaali Annar
If you're following celtic language tho, shouldn't it be <u bpero> ?
I think <mp> for /b/ isn't as intuitive as <bp>

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 12:19 am
by tezcatlip0ca
Get out of my mind kodé!

I was a few hours ago explaining to a friend how Celtic mutations work, because she asked me why there are so many h's in Irish, and I just got carried away. So I came up with this (and these are the actual words and pronunciations I used for the explanation).
perro [ˈpero], su [ˈbero], un [ˈm̥ero], lo' [ˈferɔ]
tierra [ˈtjera], la [ˈdjera], en [ˈn̥jera], la' [ˈθjera]
casa [ˈkaza], mi [ˈgaza], en [ˈŋ̥aza], la' [ˈxaza]
verdad [beɾˈða], la [weɾˈða], en [meɾˈða], la' [feɾˈðaɛ]
doctor [ðɔxˈtɔ], su [ɔxˈtɔ], un [nɔxˈtɔ], lo' [ɔxˈtɔɾɛ]
gato [ˈɣato], mi [ˈato], un [ˈŋato], lo' [ˈxatɔ]
And yes, now I realize that gato should have been [ˈgado], but I guess that would have been too confusing.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:35 am
by Pole, the
tezcatlip0ca wrote:en [meɾˈða]
*cough* *cough* *cough*

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:47 am
by Thry
Yaali Annar wrote:If you're following celtic language tho, shouldn't it be <u bpero> ?
I think <mp> for /b/ isn't as intuitive as <bp>
Αλλά μπορεί να είναι. <allá mporeí na eínai>
[a."la bo."4i na "i.ne]
But it can be. [Modern Greek]

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:55 am
by Thry
Pole wrote:
tezcatlip0ca wrote:en [meɾˈða]
*cough* *cough* *cough*
Bizarrely that doesn't even sound weird. OMG where are we heading to...

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 1:06 pm
by ObsequiousNewt
/me facepalms

And people were just telling me on IRC that this is not how Celtic-style mutations work, and that I was doing it wrong. Fhor bPete's tsake...

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 4:40 pm
by Izambri
tezcatlip0ca wrote:en [meɾˈða]
Emmerdats

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 4:57 pm
by Thry
Fins al coll.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:59 am
by kodé
con quesa wrote:Quite neat, Kode! I'm curious what happens with the limited set of adjectives in Spanish that can fall between the article and the noun, like la buena fortuna - does the lenition happen on the adjective, leaving the noun unchanged? Does this syntactic construction even survive?

Also, what happens with non-coda consonant clusters like in peligro - are these simplified as well?
I'm having both the adjective and the noun undergo mutation: /la bwena fo4tuna/ -> [la wena voduna], /las bwenas fo4tunas/ -> [la fwena foduna]. The adjectives undergo the mutation triggered by article/preposition, and the nouns undergo the mutation trigger by the adjective: either its own final consonant, or its gender/plural ending.

Non-coda consonant clusters (i.e., complex onsets) are allowed, but can be reduced if they are in the right environment. For instance, the /g/ in <peligro> undergoes V-mutation, and elides, leaving /peli4o/. I'm not sure what to do in the case of rare /CsC/ clusters, like /obstruy-/, or /instruy-/...
Yaali Annar wrote:If you're following celtic language tho, shouldn't it be <u bpero> ?
I think <mp> for /b/ isn't as intuitive as <bp>
I though I'd use a nasal because the is from the nasal mutation /Np/: /uN pero/ -> , /uN boratSo/ -> <u mborracho>.
tezcatlip0ca wrote:Get out of my mind kodé!

I was a few hours ago explaining to a friend how Celtic mutations work, because she asked me why there are so many h's in Irish, and I just got carried away. So I came up with this (and these are the actual words and pronunciations I used for the explanation).
perro [ˈpero], su [ˈbero], un [ˈm̥ero], lo' [ˈferɔ]
tierra [ˈtjera], la [ˈdjera], en [ˈn̥jera], la' [ˈθjera]
casa [ˈkaza], mi [ˈgaza], en [ˈŋ̥aza], la' [ˈxaza]
verdad [beɾˈða], la [weɾˈða], en [meɾˈða], la' [feɾˈðaɛ]
doctor [ðɔxˈtɔ], su [ɔxˈtɔ], un [nɔxˈtɔ], lo' [ɔxˈtɔɾɛ]
gato [ˈɣato], mi [ˈato], un [ˈŋato], lo' [ˈxatɔ]
And yes, now I realize that gato should have been [ˈgado], but I guess that would have been too confusing.

Ha, nice! I guess it's a pretty logical extension of what's going on in some Spanish dialects, especially with /sC/ clusters.

Thry wrote:
Pole wrote:
tezcatlip0ca wrote:en [meɾˈða]

*cough* *cough* *cough*

Bizarrely that doesn't even sound weird. OMG where are we heading to...

We are merely seeing the future... (in Efañó <en verdád> becomes [e me"4a] <e mverá>, with simplification of the [4D] cluster). Also lol mierda.

ObsequiousNewt wrote:/me facepalms

And people were just telling me on IRC that this is not how Celtic-style mutations work, and that I was doing it wrong. Fhor bPete's tsake...

Well, I can't claim to know Celtic mutations in any depth, but this kind of phenomenon (feature-assimilation/sandhi across word boundaries) is super-abundant cross-linguistically.



Verbs will come... eventually. The coda-dropping that accompanies mutations wreaks havoc on the inflectional endings, but it makes cliticization more interesting.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:15 pm
by Ser
Thry wrote:
Pole wrote:
tezcatlip0ca wrote:en [meɾˈða]
*cough* *cough* *cough*
Bizarrely that doesn't even sound weird. OMG where are we heading to...
Indeed. tezcatlip0ca's nasal mutations for stops at least (en [ˈŋ̥aza], en [meɾˈða], un [ˈŋato]), feel so natural that I think they might be already occurring in real-world Spanish......... The other ones not so much. (Well, of course I sometimes drop the word-initial /d g/ in environments like su doctor and mi gato, but that's not surprising.)

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:19 pm
by Thry
True, lenition sometimes extends beyond fricativization into ellision altogether in some dialects and words. In those cases I'd keep the consonants (though I can see where you're going having heard Cubans pronounce Cuba as ['ku.(w)a]), but I do drop some myself too: Qué ices? Enga.

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 11:22 pm
by TaylorS
This is really cool.

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:01 am
by Chengjiang
I'll probably say more about this later, but for now I'd just like to say that this is delightful and you should continue.

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:01 am
by kodé
Thanks for the encouragement, all! I should keep working on this more...

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:45 pm
by Chengjiang
alt wrote:
kodé wrote:and thus cooler-looking
The choice is obvious.
I'm with alt. Use the semi-transparent, Gaelic-inspired orthography. Especially if this is intended to be the actual orthography used by speakers of the language; it strikes me as much more likely to happen than the opaque orthography.
kodé wrote:I'm not sure what to do in the case of rare /CsC/ clusters, like /obstruy-/, or /instruy-/...
This might be a bit boring if you want something complex to happen to these clusters, but it's reasonably naturalistic/probable.* I'd have all C > 0 before sC, so all such clusters just become sC(C), and then apply the diachronics to the resulting cluster that you would have to an original sC(C) cluster, with [s] > [h], H-mutation, and so on and so forth. (E.g. /bstr/ > [str] > [htr] > [Tr].) Alternatively, you could have the [s] > [h] end entirely before the deletion of the first C, so you end up with coda [s] in these clusters and protection of the following consonants from mutation.

You could delete the /s/ instead if you prefer, although I like the first version more and can think of more natlang parallels to it.

*It's also probably what I'd do.

Re: Mutant Spanish [Efa"JO]

Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:55 pm
by kodé
Chengjiang wrote:
alt wrote:
kodé wrote:and thus cooler-looking
The choice is obvious.
I'm with alt. Use the semi-transparent, Gaelic-inspired orthography. Especially if this is intended to be the actual orthography used by speakers of the language; it strikes me as much more likely to happen than the opaque orthography.
I'll go with it, then!
Chengjiang wrote:
kodé wrote:I'm not sure what to do in the case of rare /CsC/ clusters, like /obstruy-/, or /instruy-/...
This might be a bit boring if you want something complex to happen to these clusters, but it's reasonably naturalistic/probable.* I'd have all C > 0 before sC, so all such clusters just become sC(C), and then apply the diachronics to the resulting cluster that you would have to an original sC(C) cluster, with [s] > [h], H-mutation, and so on and so forth. (E.g. /bstr/ > [str] > [htr] > [Tr].) Alternatively, you could have the [s] > [h] end entirely before the deletion of the first C, so you end up with coda [s] in these clusters and protection of the following consonants from mutation.

You could delete the /s/ instead if you prefer, although I like the first version more and can think of more natlang parallels to it.

*It's also probably what I'd do.
Yeah, that probably the best option.

Here's an example text, from the front page on Wikipedia today:
huiquipéya wrote:Su casco antiguo es el más extenso de España y uno de los tres más grandes de toda Europa junto a los de Venecia y Génova, con 3,94 kilómetros cuadrados, siendo su casco histórico uno de los más grandes de España (nótese la diferencia entre casco antiguo, que solo incluye la zona histórica anterior a la Revolución Industrial, y casco histórico, que abarca estadios posteriores). Su patrimonio histórico y monumental y sus diversos espacios escénicos y culturales la convierten en una ciudad receptora de turismo nacional e internacional, convirtiéndola en la tercera capital más visitada de España, tras Barcelona y Madrid. Entre sus monumentos más representativos se encuentran la Catedral (que incluye la Giralda), el Alcázar, el Archivo de Indias y la Torre del Oro, siendo los tres primeros declarados Patrimonio de la Humanidad por la Unesco de forma conjunta en 1987.
fañó fonétiko wrote:[su"kaxo "diwo "e e"ma "Tedzwe "faJa i unwe lo"Tre ma "xrane: "toa eu"ropa "xudo: loTe Be"nesja i "Enoa, ko 3,94 ki"lometro xwa"rau "sjeno su"kaxo "Toriko "unwe lo"pa "xrane: "faJa "noteze lajve"redzja dre "kaxo "diwo ke "solo "gluye la"zona "Torika de"ryo: larewolu"syo ninu"Trya y "kaxo "Torika ke "waka "Tayo foTe"ryore supatri"monjo "Toriko i monume"da i suTi"wezo "fasyo "seniko i kudu"rale lako"mjede enunazyu"a reze"toray tu"ripo nasjo"na i denasyo"na comi"tjenola edate"zera kapi"ta ma fizi"ta:y "faJa tra faze"lona i ma"ri dre zuponu"medo ma Seprezeda"tiwo se"gwedra lakate"ra ke "gluye lay"rala ela"gasa elar"kiwe "inja i la"torre: "loro "sjeno lo"Tre fri"mero Tekla"rau patri"monjo: lawmani"a poraw"nexwe "voma ko"tuda e 1987
fañó chrihuiéno wrote:Su cácho díhuo é e má thézzue Fáña i unue lo thré má chránee tóa Európa chúdoo lo the Bhenésia i Énoa, ko 3,94 quilómetro chuaráu, siéno su cácho thórico unue lo mhá chránee Fáña (nóteze la iverézzia dre cácho dhuo, que sólo glúye la zsóna thórica derió la Rehuolusió nInuthriá, i cácho thórica, que huáca tháyo photherióre). Su património thórico i monumedá i su dhihuézo fásio sénico i cudurále la comiéde e nuna zsyuá rezetórai turípo nasioná i denasioná comitiénola e nla tezéra capitá má bhizitáai Fáña tra Bhazelóna i Marí dre zu mhonumédo ma rheprezadatíhuo se guédra la Caterá (que glúye la Irála) e lAgása, e lArquíhue Ínia i la Tórree lÓro, siéno lo thré phriméro dheclaráu Patrimónioo la Umaniá po ra Unéchue vfóma cotúda e 1987.

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:04 am
by Thry
Oh my god... that's pretty cool actually. The way it resonates with my L1 is so weird! I get most of it without translation, not all, though.

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:48 pm
by kodé
Thry wrote:Oh my god... that's pretty cool actually. The way it resonates with my L1 is so weird! I get most of it without translation, not all, though.
Whoa :O I guess I've accomplished my mission.

While I'm at it, here are some grapheme/phone correspondence charts:

Code: Select all

Grapheme(s)  Phone(s)
a            a
aa           a:
ai           ai
au           au
b            b
bh           f
mb           m
c/qu         k
ch           x
nc/nqu       g
d            d
dh           T
nd           n
ld           l
rd           4
e            e
ee           e:
ei           ei
eu           eu
f            f
vf           v
nf           b
g/gu         g
gh           x
ng           N
hu           w
fhu          f
nhu          m
i            i
iV           jV
j            h
nj           k
l            l
lh           T
nl           d
m            m
mh           p
n            n
nh           t
ñ            J
ñh           tS
o            o
oi           oi
oo           o:
p            p
ph           f
mp           b
r            4
rh           S
nr           d4
rr           r
s            s
ns           dz
zs           z
t            t
th           T
nt           d
u            u
uV           wV
v            v
x            tS
xh           S
ñx           dZ
y            j
hi           S
ñy           J
z            z
zz           dz

Code: Select all

Phone   Grapheme
p       p, mh
b       b, mp, nf
t       t, nh
d       d, nt, nl
d4      nr
k       c, qu, nj
g       g, gu, nc, nqu
dz      ns, zz
tS      x, ñh
dZ      ñx
f       f, ph, bh, fhu
T       th, dh, lh
s       s
S       hi, rh, xh
x       ch, gh
h       j
v       vf
z       zs
m       m, mb, nhu
n       n, nd
J       ñ, ñy
N       ng, ngu
l       l, ld
4       r, rd
r       rr
j       y
w       hu

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:57 pm
by Chengjiang
I noticed [β] as the value of <bh> in <Bhenésia> in the sample passage. Was that a mistake?

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:23 am
by kodé
Chengjiang wrote:I noticed [β] as the value of <bh> in <Bhenésia> in the sample passage. Was that a mistake?
Yes, it was. :oops: It should be [w], and <Huenésia>. I'm torn over whether to write this as <hub>, similar to <mb> and <vf>, with the changed value before the underlying value. Same thing with the elided /d g/ after a vowel-final proclitic; how should I write this, other than just dropping the <d g>?

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:24 pm
by Chengjiang
kodé wrote:Yes, it was. :oops: It should be [w], and <Huenésia>. I'm torn over whether to write this as <hub>, similar to <mb> and <vf>, with the changed value before the underlying value. Same thing with the elided /d g/ after a vowel-final proclitic; how should I write this, other than just dropping the <d g>?
Why not take a third option and write [w 0 0] from elided /b d g/ <bh dh gh>, in pseudo-Irish fashion?

Re: Mutant Spanish (Efañó)

Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:08 pm
by kodé
Chengjiang wrote:
kodé wrote:Yes, it was. :oops: It should be [w], and <Huenésia>. I'm torn over whether to write this as <hub>, similar to <mb> and <vf>, with the changed value before the underlying value. Same thing with the elided /d g/ after a vowel-final proclitic; how should I write this, other than just dropping the <d g>?
Why not take a third option and write [w 0 0] from elided /b d g/ <bh dh gh>, in pseudo-Irish fashion?
I had wanted to do that, but I've been using <bh dh gh> for [f T x] from H+/b d g/. I could probably write the voiceless fricatives as <phb thd chg> or <bph dth gch> or even <bbh ddh ggh>, and use <bh dh gh> for the elided [w 0 0] instead. Which of the three options for voiceless fricatives makes more sense? I'm trying not to stray too far away from present-day Spanish orthography, but enough so that it fits the language.