Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
So, here's a bunch of fairly pointless sentences to show some syntax of a new isolating lang I'm working on. Your challenge is to work out what all of the words are. You could either gloss every sentence (pffft!) or just write a word list with a gloss for each word. Please use spoiler tags in case others want to do this after you. Also, don't get too hung up on the "ins" and "ats" ... they're basically just meant to be locatives but it's awkward in English. Just meant to be a bit of silly fun but I'm also curious to see if you can do it and how some things are glossed.
Na i mba.
= I am a house.
Na i de mba.
= I am the house.
Lyu nga i mba.
= I am in a house.
Lyu nga i de mba.
= I am in the house.
Lyu ya mba i na.
= A house is at me.
Lyu zyi mba i na.
= The house is at me.
Na i mo ya mba.
= I eat a house.
Na i mo zyi mba.
= I eat the house.
Mba i mo nga.
= A house eats me.
De mba i mo nga.
= The house eats me.
Mo nga i mba.
= What eats me is a house.
Mo nga i de mba.
= What eats me is the house.
Lyu ya mo nga i de mba.
= What eats me is in the house.
Lyu zyi mba i de mo nga.
= The house is in what eats me.
Edit: Swapping lu and lyu.
Na i mba.
= I am a house.
Na i de mba.
= I am the house.
Lyu nga i mba.
= I am in a house.
Lyu nga i de mba.
= I am in the house.
Lyu ya mba i na.
= A house is at me.
Lyu zyi mba i na.
= The house is at me.
Na i mo ya mba.
= I eat a house.
Na i mo zyi mba.
= I eat the house.
Mba i mo nga.
= A house eats me.
De mba i mo nga.
= The house eats me.
Mo nga i mba.
= What eats me is a house.
Mo nga i de mba.
= What eats me is the house.
Lyu ya mo nga i de mba.
= What eats me is in the house.
Lyu zyi mba i de mo nga.
= The house is in what eats me.
Edit: Swapping lu and lyu.
Last edited by Imralu on Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
I like this kind of challenges, I'd like to see more conlangs presented this way.
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Yeah, me too. This should be a thing. I might add more sentences soon,Benturi wrote:I like this kind of challenges, I'd like to see more conlangs presented this way.
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Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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Trying to keep a low syllable count has been a constant in my conlangs too, even though I don't dislike natlangs or conlangs with long morphemes at all. When I started learning about other people's conlangs (I mean, besides famous ones like Esperanto or Tolkien's), I always wondered why they created such long words. But I tend (now less than before, but still) to use complex phonologies and syllable structures. My conlang Yir, for example, has 36 ~ 37 consonants and 9 or 18 vowels (depending on whether one analyses long vowels or sequences of V+schwa), allows few consonants as coda but complex onsets, most roots are monosyllabic and some common grammatical suffixes are single consonants (-t, -s, -k, -x), and has very little redundancy (Yir is agglutinative, so it could be described as having short morphemes and long words). But Yir is one of my oldest langs, and the more recent ones have more redundancy and longer morphemes.I mean, I guess I run the risk of not having enough redundancy in my langs because I tend to try to make them as short as as overloaded with information in as few syllables as possible, and I also try to do this with a relatively simple phonology and syllable structure.
Btw I assumed that native English speakers are not interested in "keeping the syllable count low" in their conlangs since that's what their own native language does.
EDIT:
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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That's a weird generalisation. It's my favourite thing about English. It's generally pretty nice and compact. What's your native language, by the way?Btw I assumed that native English speakers are not interested in "keeping the syllable count low" in their conlangs since that's what their own native language does.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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OK, it was just an impression, you know, that many conlangers try to make their (first) langs as different as possible from their own native language...That's a weird generalisation.Btw I assumed that native English speakers are not interested in "keeping the syllable count low" in their conlangs since that's what their own native language does.
It's Spanish.What's your native language, by the way?
Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
I thought most conlangers make their first languages very similar to their own as they usually do not understand linguistics that well.
ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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Right! But he did say try.mèþru wrote:I thought most conlangers make their first languages very similar to their own as they usually do not understand linguistics that well.
In any case, my conlanging goal tends to be towards something I like, and this trumps naturalism for me. There are features of English that I like and features that I don't like. Conciseness (concision?) is something that I like.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
MOAR!
OK, here's some more. It's not terribly systematic and to work out what everything is, I'll probably have to provide more sentences so feel free to ask "how would you say ..." or "would XYZ mean ..." kind of questions.
Hi e mba.
[ˈhi emˈba]
= This/that is a house.
Hina i gwa.
[ˈhinaj ˈgwa]
= This (here by me) is a fish.
Na i ze mu.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu]
= I don't know.
Na i ze mu zyu ha na i mu.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu ʒu ha ˌnaj ˈmu]
= I don't know if I know.
Na i ze mu zyu na i mu mya.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu ʒu ˌnaj ˈmu mja]
= I don't know what/who I know.
Na i bo mu zyu wa i ma.
[ˈnaj bo ˈmu ʒu ˌwaj ˈma]
= I want to know who/what you are.
He ze ngu nga.
[he ze ˈŋu ŋa]
= Don't kill me!
Ze ngu i zyenda.
[ze ˈŋuj ˈʒenda]
= What doesn't kill (you) makes (you) stronger.
De i ngu zyi u lyu i mba nga u dya i nggo.
[ˌdej ŋu ʒiw ˌʎujmˈba ŋaw ˌdʒajŋˈgo]
= He killed/kills/will kill it in my house with a stick.
De i dwi ngu zyi u dya i mizyo zyi.
[ˌdej dwi ŋu ʒiw ˌdʒaj ˈmiʒo ʒi]
= She killed/kills/will kill it using her mind.
Lyu wo i ma?
[ˈʎu woj ˈma]
= Where are you?
Wa i zi mo zyi u lyu i ma?
[ˈwaj zi ˈmo ʒiw ˌʎuj ˈma]
= Where did you eat it?
Ma i lyu zyu wa i zi mo zyi?
[ˌmaj ˈʎu ʒu ˈwaj zi ˈmo ʒi]
= Where did you eat it? (alternative)
De i zi ngu zyi gwi u (de i) mo (zyi).
[ˈdej zi ˈŋu ʒi ˈgwiw (ˌdej) ˈmo (ʒi)]
= He killed the fish by eating (it). (The "de i" and the "zyi" in brackets are independently optional and don't have to occur together.)
Edit: Changed gwenda to zyenda, part of an arbitrary reform just because I like [ʒ] so much.
Edit: Swapping lu and lyu.
OK, here's some more. It's not terribly systematic and to work out what everything is, I'll probably have to provide more sentences so feel free to ask "how would you say ..." or "would XYZ mean ..." kind of questions.
Hi e mba.
[ˈhi emˈba]
= This/that is a house.
Hina i gwa.
[ˈhinaj ˈgwa]
= This (here by me) is a fish.
Na i ze mu.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu]
= I don't know.
Na i ze mu zyu ha na i mu.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu ʒu ha ˌnaj ˈmu]
= I don't know if I know.
Na i ze mu zyu na i mu mya.
[ˈnaj ze ˈmu ʒu ˌnaj ˈmu mja]
= I don't know what/who I know.
Na i bo mu zyu wa i ma.
[ˈnaj bo ˈmu ʒu ˌwaj ˈma]
= I want to know who/what you are.
He ze ngu nga.
[he ze ˈŋu ŋa]
= Don't kill me!
Ze ngu i zyenda.
[ze ˈŋuj ˈʒenda]
= What doesn't kill (you) makes (you) stronger.
De i ngu zyi u lyu i mba nga u dya i nggo.
[ˌdej ŋu ʒiw ˌʎujmˈba ŋaw ˌdʒajŋˈgo]
= He killed/kills/will kill it in my house with a stick.
De i dwi ngu zyi u dya i mizyo zyi.
[ˌdej dwi ŋu ʒiw ˌdʒaj ˈmiʒo ʒi]
= She killed/kills/will kill it using her mind.
Lyu wo i ma?
[ˈʎu woj ˈma]
= Where are you?
Wa i zi mo zyi u lyu i ma?
[ˈwaj zi ˈmo ʒiw ˌʎuj ˈma]
= Where did you eat it?
Ma i lyu zyu wa i zi mo zyi?
[ˌmaj ˈʎu ʒu ˈwaj zi ˈmo ʒi]
= Where did you eat it? (alternative)
De i zi ngu zyi gwi u (de i) mo (zyi).
[ˈdej zi ˈŋu ʒi ˈgwiw (ˌdej) ˈmo (ʒi)]
= He killed the fish by eating (it). (The "de i" and the "zyi" in brackets are independently optional and don't have to occur together.)
Edit: Changed gwenda to zyenda, part of an arbitrary reform just because I like [ʒ] so much.
Edit: Swapping lu and lyu.
Last edited by Imralu on Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:43 am, edited 3 times in total.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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MY MUSIC
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
More sentences, good! I'll have a closer look at them this evening, for now this is what I can identify:
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
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= It is know that I am strong.
Na i zyu na i gi zyonda u ba i wa.
= I don't think I'm as smart as you. / I think I'm less smart than you.
Mye na i mu zyu na i zinye (ba) nda u gi e wa.
= But I know I'm still stronger than you.
The ba can be dropped in this sentence ....
Na i zyu wa i (ba) nda u gi e na u (wa i) hu.
= I think you'll be stronger than me when you're a man.
(The wa i in brackets can be dropped. The sentence would then technically be syntactically ambiguous but people can cope.)
Lo mo i zye zyu wa i (ba) nda u gi e na.
= Eating will make you stronger than me.
Ha wa i bo (ba) nda u gi e na?
= Do you want to be stronger than me?
Ha wa i bo nda do wa i he mo ya bandya gwi.
= If you want to be strong, you should eat lots of fish.
U hu ye nda do wa i mwe ngge ya eda u me na.
= When you are a strong man, you can hunt cassowaries with me.
(The final phrase could be u me na, u me nga or maybe even u me i na or u na i me but the final two would have a slightly different sense, as if I were tagging along with you rather than you with me. U me na would probably be more common than u me nga but both are grammatically correct.)
Wana i mwe mo ya eda ye ne ngge wona.
= We can eat the cassowaries that we hunt.
The ya could also be dropped from the last two sentences. From a lot of sentences, actually, but maybe that's something a bit more advanced.
I homo! Yu wa i hu i he byu.
= Yum! I'm looking forward to you being a man.
I swear "homo" was entirely unintentional. It actually made me laugh out loud.
EDIT: With the silliness around "homo" I forgot to mention that the last phrase is probably hard because of the funny way they say "look forward to".
EDIT: Changed gwe to zye as part of a language reform just because I like post-alveolar voiced fricatives.
Last edited by Imralu on Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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MY MUSIC
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
"homo" is going in the quote thread.
ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!
kårroť
kårroť
Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Damn! You beat me to it. (On the other hand, once you post that, oh, I have so much more to post already...).
Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Dammit, you guys! That whole sentence looks terrifying without the context. "Can't wait till you're legal! *lick's lips" OMFG!
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
I interpreted it as a sex transformation. I need to dig up my pessimistic side from whatever cave it is hiding in and force it to exercise more.
ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!
kårroť
kårroť
Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
I think I interpreted it as something like planning to meet up with someone you've only ever known as an online user or something, and then getting excited about hooking up with them in person.
Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Someone you only know online becomes a man when you meet them?
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Glossing challenge for Wena, an isolating language
Well, becomes an actual man in the flesh before your eyes, as opposed to some screenname on a computer, if that makes any sense.