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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:06 pm 
Sanci
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*switch*

yay no more boxes


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:10 pm 
Smeric
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I always avoided it because it's so much work to type. I have to get Character Map and individually paste each character into the post. X-SAMPA allows me to indicate any phoneme without having to paste obscure characters or even use alt-codes (though I have no difficulty with those). And as others have said, it doesn't always work, and in that case renders whatever you put unreadable.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:16 pm 
Sumerul
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Eddy wrote:
I always avoided it because it's so much work to type. I have to get Character Map and individually paste each character into the post. X-SAMPA allows me to indicate any phoneme without having to paste obscure characters or even use alt-codes (though I have no difficulty with those). And as others have said, it doesn't always work, and in that case renders whatever you put unreadable.

You really ought to use an X-SAMPA or CXS to IPA converter, such as the one I usually use.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:20 pm 
Sanci
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There are occasions when I just want to write down some phonetic notation quickly and easily, and for that I may use X-SAMPA. Otherwise for my own notes, at least for things I've settled on and polished, I use exclusively IPA. I still use X-SAMPA on the board for compatibility, though. Aside from the board having issues with Unicode, some users also may not be able to use it reliably.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:21 pm 
Smeric
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Or, just get your hands on the IPA Keyboard; I use it when I can't remember the XSAMPA for some feature, like dentalization or whatever.

http://weston.ruter.net/projects/ipa-ch ... /keyboard/


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:01 pm 
Lebom
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Jar Jar Binks wrote:
I remember some years ago someone here posted a scan of bona fide handwritten X-SAMPA. I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.
I use the one that's easiest for me to read and write. To type and on a computer that is undoubtedly X-Sampa, but if I was ever doing anything formal, I'd learn to type the IPA. Writing (although I never really transcribe on paper), I'd use IPA for the same reason. That said, I don't really see anything wrong with written X-Sampa, if it's all you know, why not? I would find it awkward, but obviously he didn't!

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:19 pm 
Avisaru
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I've always found IPA easier to read and given its compactness it was generally easier to write as well, at least by hand. OTOH I found X-SAMPA quite difficult to read and "clunky". So, I started writing pretty much only in IPA. Eventually though you kind of get used to reading X-SAMPA with the number of times it turns up and input-wise it's a hell of a lot easier if you're particularly lazy so I've gradually started using X-SAMPA more and more.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2010 8:31 pm 
Sumerul
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X-SAMPA is harder to read, but easier to write.

edit: bookmarked the thing Torco linked to, since the conlanger.com one probably couldn't do things like t͡sʲ̴̪ʰŋ̩̊k͡xʷʰe̯ɨĩ̯ʠpʼɴ̥͡ǁǒ̘ː. Of course, it can't handle ` properly, but it looks like nothing can.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 1:03 am 
Smeric
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Nortaneous wrote:
edit: bookmarked the thing Torco linked to, since the conlanger.com one probably couldn't do things like t͡sʲ̴̪ʰŋ̩̊k͡xʷʰe̯ɨĩ̯ʠpʼɴ̥͡ǁǒ̘ː. Of course, it can't handle ` properly, but it looks like nothing can.


I couldn't handle IPA without it, copy-pasting is just too much work


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:34 am 
Lebom
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To be honest, I think a lot more people use IPA online than did a few years ago. I am routinely surprised to see posts using IPA where, when I first joined the board, I would have expected to see X-SAMPA. I still use X-SAMPA by default online (although not usually elsewhere, unless I'm in a hurry and not bothered about presentation), because I automatically assume IPA won't work. I'm not sure that's true anymore, but it's the mindset I've got myself into all the same.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:08 am 
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aɪ pi eɪ ɪz not sɪgnɪfəkəntli mɔ dɪfəkʊɫt tu taɪp ɑʊt ðən ɛks sampə pɹəvaɪdɪd ju hav ə gʊd ɪmpʊt mɛθəd

and ðə bɔd kən oviəsli handəl ɪt ɔ aɪ wʊdənt bi eɪbəɫ tə du ðɪs


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:57 am 
Sumerul
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aː pʰɨi̯ eɪ̯ meɪ̯ naʔ bɨi̯ ðæʔ sɪgnɪfɪkɪ̃ʔlɪi̯ harɽɵ˞ ɳ̩ ɛks seə̯mpə ɾə tʰʌi̯p æɵ̯ʔ wɪð ə gʊd ɪnpʊʔ mɛθəd bʌʔ sʌm ʌv ʌs ɵ˞ tʰʏʊ̯ leɪ̯zi ɾə ɪnstɔɫ ðə deə̯m θɪŋz

in other news, I really don't like writing transcriptions that are even this broad

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:32 am 
Lebom
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Are there freely available IPA input methods for Windows anyway, that are easy to setup and edit?

Like, I'm using m17n for UIM on Ubuntu. All you need to do to make an input method for that is editing a plain text file, because m17n works with Lisp. I still haven't figured out why AltGr breaks things, so that I can't use X-Sampa's \ but have to resort to /. `~{} are not possible either as diacritics, sadly, so that I'm using other characters as replacements (that I always have to look up :| ). Or at least I don't know how to work around that.

aɪ ts̠ɹaɪ tʰə jʉːz aɪ pʰiː‿ˈɛɪ ɔn ðə bɔːd ˈmɔɹ‿ɔfn̩ naʊ ˈðæɾaɪm ˈeɪbɫ̩ tʰʉʊ ˈæktʰɪveɪɾɪd‿n̩ tʰaɪpət mɔɹ‿ˈiːzəɫi

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giˈtaɹ.plɛɪ̯ɚ‿n dɪs.ˈgaɪz • Der Sprachbaukasten
And! Ayeri Reference Grammar (upd. 28 Sep 2010)


Last edited by Guitarplayer II on Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:40 am 
Sumerul
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http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/goglobal/bb964665.aspx

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:09 am 
Lebom
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For Windows I use this one, which was made using the tool Nortaneous just linked. The source file is in there, so it might save you some time if it's almost what you want, but you just want to tweak it a little.

I tend to use IPA now that I have an easy input method, but in discussion I usually use whatever transcription method the person I'm replying to is using. Unicode support is better than it used to be, true, but there are still plenty of reasons someone might not be using IPA. For one, they might be using a work, school, or library computer where they're not even allowed to install fonts and/or keyboard layouts.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:19 pm 
Sanci
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Speaking of all this, is there a way (in Chromium specifically) to override the font selection, peferably just on the board without affecting every other site? The default fonts used are fine until you start mixing them with fonts that actually contain all of the characters used around here.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:32 pm 
Avisaru
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I'm sure there's a Firefox extension to do what you want. (But Firefox generally does the right thing with font substitutions anyway.) :P And perhaps a Chrome one as well.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:39 pm 
Sanci
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Zhen Lin wrote:
(But Firefox generally does the right thing with font substitutions anyway.)


I have never read a more blatant falsehood.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:14 pm 
Smeric
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WurdBendur wrote:
Speaking of all this, is there a way (in Chromium specifically) to override the font selection, peferably just on the board without affecting every other site? The default fonts used are fine until you start mixing them with fonts that actually contain all of the characters used around here.


Why do you use Chromium, when Chrome's available for Linux directly from the google repos ? I can only think of commitment to Open Source, but them opensource enthusiasts tend to love the Fox.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:37 am 
Avisaru
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WurdBendur wrote:
Zhen Lin wrote:
(But Firefox generally does the right thing with font substitutions anyway.)


I have never read a more blatant falsehood.


It is especially true on Linux, but there I can set up fontconfig to do the right thing as well for all the apps that use it. Less true on other operating systems, yes. (I wish I could figure out how to configure font substitution in Windows.)

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:18 am 
Lebom
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there are still many browsers which don't have the right fonts for IPA, e.g. The phone I'm on now. X-Sampa is more accessible.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:42 pm 
Sanci
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I dont have the cash for MS Word for this new comp of mine -- so currently I use Notepad ..:P

And notepad doesn't do IPA ... :( Also X-Sampa is much easier to write

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:22 pm 
Lebom
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doctrellor wrote:
And notepad doesn't do IPA ... :(

It can, though of course you have to bring your own entry method, like a keyboard layout. Then when you save the file, change the encoding to UTF-8 in the dropdown box.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:52 pm 
Sanci
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Ah, no shit -- cool. Thx for the tip .>:)

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:56 pm 
Lebom
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I usually use X-Sampa here because in the past, IPA almost always showed up as boxes or question marks. As someone with academic linguistic training though, I use IPA everywhere else, because I'm more used to it and it's easier for me to read.

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