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zompist bboard • View topic - Confusing headlines and other trips down the garden path

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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 9:24 am 
Sanno
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Sunday I watched a four-hour mashup of the plays of Aristophanes. Each section ended with a moral and the moral for the second section (which incorporated The Knights) was "Never trust someone with sausages." I actually sought out the actress at intermission to ask her, "Does this mean that if someone has sausages, you shouldn't trust them or that you shouldn't give someone sausages and trust them with them?" and she replied "Both".

In summary, sausages ruin relationships.


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PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:23 am 
Sanno
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Sounds like they mashed in some of Juno and the Paycock along the way...

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PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 7:28 pm 
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Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.


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PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 8:37 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:09 pm 
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Yeah, he was a little over the top, but that fly really had it coming.

(headline from Drudgereport)

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Sunàqʷa the Sea Lamprey says:


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 7:54 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 11:31 am 
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The BBC's "most read" list today has not one but two beauties.

This one genuinely had me perplexed at first:
Led Zeppelin's Jimmy Page and Robbie Williams continue planning battle

This one only briefly mislead me but is worth mentioning:
Aberdeen sanitary product pilot to start across Scotland

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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 10:15 pm 
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If you cannot change your mind, are you sure you have one?

Here's a .


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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2018 11:35 pm 
Smeric
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I have my guesses as to what both of those headlines mean, but I'm not sure whether they're right.

EDIT:


Spoiler:


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:15 am 
Sumerul
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:43 am 
Sanno
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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 9:57 am 
Avisaru
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I assume that the pilot occurred in Aberdeen, and now is rolling out across all of Scotland.

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I generally forget to say, so if it's relevant and I don't mention it--I'm from Southern Michigan and speak Inland North American English. Yes, I have the Northern Cities Vowel Shift; no, I don't have the cot-caught merger; and it is called pop.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 10:11 am 
Smeric
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[sanitary] [product pilot] doesn't even make any sense, so it's obviously [sanitary product] [pilot]


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 11:17 am 
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Sunàqʷa the Sea Lamprey says:


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 11:45 am 
Avisaru
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Huh, the ambiguity between [sanitary product] and [sanitary] [product] completely escaped me. "Sanitary products" is a polite euphemism for pads and tampons, Sal.

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I generally forget to say, so if it's relevant and I don't mention it--I'm from Southern Michigan and speak Inland North American English. Yes, I have the Northern Cities Vowel Shift; no, I don't have the cot-caught merger; and it is called pop.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:38 pm 
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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:41 pm 
Sanno
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...oh for fuck's sake, can't at least one thread be free of this bullshit?


The thread title is not "I don't understand these words please explain them to me oh great one, because I'm a fucking moron." It's a thread about syntactic ambiguities and confusing sentence structures, not a thread for patronisingly explaining jokes back to the people who made them. Yes I have heard of sanitary products, because I'm not fucking six; but that does not eliminate the parsing ambiguities.


If you seriously can't see anything ambiguous in that sentence then stop acting so superior, because it's you who're missing something. For example, replace "Aberdeen sanitary products" with "aeroplane" or "Dutch". Would "Aeroplane pilot starts across Scotland" or "Dutch pilot starts across Scotland" have the same default interpretation? No. Which means that the 'correct' interpretation of the headline is being driven by the semantics, not by the syntax, which is indeed ambiguous.

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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 1:53 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 3:38 pm 
Smeric
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I guess the pilot joke just flew over everybody's heads. Oh well, i shouldve known better. Tampon jokes just arent funny, period.

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 8:25 pm 
Smeric
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 9:12 am 
Avisaru
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I generally forget to say, so if it's relevant and I don't mention it--I'm from Southern Michigan and speak Inland North American English. Yes, I have the Northern Cities Vowel Shift; no, I don't have the cot-caught merger; and it is called pop.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:10 am 
Sumerul
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Which once again shows the superior orthography of German and Dutch, that clearly distinguish noun compounds from adjective + noun :).


JAL


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 11:48 am 
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:46 pm 
Sanno
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But the semantics are the same. In both cases you're talking about the same products being trialed for the same reasons. Semantics cannot clarify which of two structures is intended when the meaning is the same.

It's like saying that semantics can clarify whether "pink rose colour" means [pink rose] [colour] or [pink] [rose colour]. Both mean the same thing! There is indeed likely no fact of the matter which structure was 'intended' in a particular case (except where emphasis makes it clear).

But whatever the fuck. Clearly this has gone beyond discussion of either syntax or semantic; I don't know why it's so desparately important to fight me word-by-word over this, but I have better things to spend my mental health on.

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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:35 pm 
Smeric
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The semantics clearly are not the same. A [sanitary] [product pilot] is a product pilot that is sanitary, whatever that means. A [sanitary product] [pilot] is a pilot for sanitary products, aka tampons and pads. Since only the second one actually means anything to me, it's the only reasonable choice.

I really don't know how you're seeing this all as us insisting on fighting with you - we're just trying to explain why this headline doesn't pose any problems to us in the face of you insisting that it's indisputably problematic.


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