Cool or Trendy Languages

Discussion of natural languages, or language in general.
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WechtleinUns
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Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by WechtleinUns »

So, how much does the "cool" factor determine the aquisition of a language? Are you more likely to learn a language that is considered "cool" than useful? Out of Chinese/Japanese/Korean and German/Russian, which do you think is most highly regarded by your native countrymen?

Also, is there a way to make a conlang appear "chic" to non language fanboys?

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Pthagnar »

Jose wrote:Also, is there a way to make a conlang appear "chic" to non language fanboys?
most definitely not.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Astraios »

Languages aren't cool or trendy unless you're a language fanboy already.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Radius Solis »

1. The "cool factor" only applies to language nerds and fans of various fictional things. Otherwise people learn languages mostly only when they have to, and only as much as they have to.

2. That's five languages, not two.

3. Yes. The time-tested method is to make it look like either Quenya or something Germanic.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by tubragg »

Radius Solis wrote:1. The "cool factor" only applies to language nerds and fans of various fictional things. Otherwise people learn languages mostly only when they have to, and only as much as they have to.
I partly disagree. Yes, people mostly learn languages when they have to, but I know several non-nerds (unless you count any fascination in languages as nerdery, but then most people would be language nerds) who have taken language classes mostly for the fun of it. They might not get anywhere near fluent, of course. Anyway, in those cases I think the cool factor does come into play.

Out of the languages mentioned by the OP, I would assess the cool factor where I live (Stockholm area, Sweden) like this: Japanese still slightly edges out Chinese, both way ahead of Korean (which you would mostly need to be a genuine nerd to even consider. Or adopted.). Russian possesses a cool factor in some circles, unlike German, which is still more studied due to tradition and usefulness. Generally East Asian languages are considered a lot cooler than European ones.

Others may disagree with my estimate, of course.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Thry »

Pthagnar wrote:
Jose wrote:Also, is there a way to make a conlang appear "chic" to non language fanboys?
most definitely not.
? Making them like the conworld it's spoken in of course... Dothraki? Draconic?
Maybe not "chic", but cool or powerful most definitely

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Salmoneus »

Radius Solis wrote:1. The "cool factor" only applies to language nerds and fans of various fictional things. Otherwise people learn languages mostly only when they have to, and only as much as they have to.
I disagree strongly. Being able to speak multiple languages is itself generally considered cool, and some languages more than others - you've really never encountered the idea that people able to speak French is sexy?

2. That's five languages, not two.

3. Yes. The time-tested method is to make it look like either Quenya or something Germanic.
Better method: become a sex-god rockstar, filmstar and athlete, and then get your band to write songs in the language, get your teammates to get tattoos in the language, and put in lots of injokes in your films.
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Pthagnar »

Salmoneus wrote:
Radius Solis wrote:1. The "cool factor" only applies to language nerds and fans of various fictional things. Otherwise people learn languages mostly only when they have to, and only as much as they have to.
I disagree strongly. Being able to speak multiple languages is itself generally considered cool, and some languages more than others - you've really never encountered the idea that people able to speak French is sexy?
so is having big tits

are there really that many people who learn french as adults because it will make them sexier? when i think of somebody who is being told "oh you speak french, so sexy!" then i would expect that is because:
a) they are actually French (which is sexy because fuck a foreigner) OR
b) they lived in France for a while and so had to learn French (which is sexy because... that is daring?) OR
c) they got a degree in French (this isn't sexy, actually, but such people usually fall into another category q.v.) OR
d) they had a French governess or went to a French language school in England or something equally bourgeois (which could be sexy i guess)

none of which is:

z) they decided one day to learn French because French is so cool

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Chuma »

Japanese way cooler than the others, among people I know. For making conlangs cool, using them in fiction is the most obvious way - Tolkien and Star Trek are still considered a little geeky, but they're pretty mainstream these days.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Vuvuzela »

I think it's not which languages you speak, but how many, that impresses people. Observe:
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Thry »

It depends on who you're trying to impress, and how you say it:

i.e. if I go into a bar and scream I SPEAK SINDARIN people will go with "yep, nerd detected"
if I tell a girl which is not into conlangs a cool sentence she likes and tell her, "that's elvish", she can be like "cuuuute".

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by linguoboy »

Salmoneus wrote:I disagree strongly. Being able to speak multiple languages is itself generally considered cool, and some languages more than others - you've really never encountered the idea that people able to speak French is sexy?
Yeah, but only insofar as this is considered indicative of overall suavity and sophistication.

Being able to speak French because your parents used to take you there on vacation: sexy.
Being able to speak French because you were writing a dissertation on Deleuze until you dropped out of grad school: not sexy.
Last edited by linguoboy on Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by din »

Ean wrote:It depends on who you're trying to impress, and how you say it:

i.e. if I go into a bar and scream I SPEAK SINDARIN people will go with "yep, nerd detected"
if I tell a girl which is not into conlangs a cool sentence she likes and tell her, "that's elvish", she can be like "cuuuute".
It won't be the elvish that'll make her think "cuuuute"--she probably already thought that and is like "aww, that's slightly weird but he's comfortable enough to share that weirdness with me, so aww (I hope it doesn't get too much weirder)."
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Thry »

I think the problem here is the No True Scotsman fallacy: what if she didn't mind conlangs and elvish, without being a freak, is that even possible? It's a bit like, I'm gay and I can say a chick is hot and I'm still gay, but do the opposite and you're no true hetero hohoho.

The fact is, we're not divided in discrete even fine categories but rather in continua of likes and dislikes that make each person unique in what they consider cool and can and cannot stand. And that also applies to the aversion or affinity for things we categorize as nerdy.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by din »

Hey, I brought up the phonetic alphabet in one of the first conversations I had with my now-partner, and hey, it worked.


(or at least, it didn't deter)


So who knows.
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Thry »

And your boyfriend isn't geeky?

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Bob Johnson »

Jose wrote:So, how much does the "cool" factor determine the aquisition of a language?
People will learn words and phrases, but not the whole language. "Tres chic!"
Jose wrote:Out of Chinese/Japanese/Korean and German/Russian, which do you think is most highly regarded by your native countrymen?
People seem to be ignoring this.. I'd say Japanese and German, though neither German nor Russian are particularly popular. Korean has a following among RTS gamers but it seems to be limited to them. English speakers find the Chinese languages too difficult compared to Japanese and Korean.

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by WechtleinUns »

I like how the criterion for "cool/trendy" seems to be, "able to get you laid." :3

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Thry »

Jose wrote:I like how the criterion for "cool/trendy" seems to be, "able to get you laid." :3
It follows smoothly from the premise, "sex is cool".

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by din »

Ean wrote:And your boyfriend isn't geeky?
Okay, you win.
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Boşkoventi »

Jose wrote:I like how the criterion for "cool/trendy" seems to be, "able to get you laid." :3
Isn't that pretty much the definition of "cool"?
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Qwynegold »

tubragg wrote:Out of the languages mentioned by the OP, I would assess the cool factor where I live (Stockholm area, Sweden) like this: Japanese still slightly edges out Chinese, both way ahead of Korean (which you would mostly need to be a genuine nerd to even consider. Or adopted.). Russian possesses a cool factor in some circles, unlike German, which is still more studied due to tradition and usefulness. Generally East Asian languages are considered a lot cooler than European ones.

Others may disagree with my estimate, of course.
I disagree. *raises hand* I think Korean is growing very quickly. But who thinks Russian is cool? And there are a lot of people who have a thing for German. Idk, like a fetish for German military uniforms and stuff, and so they think the language is also cool.
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by WechtleinUns »

Sex is for pussies. ;)

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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by Qwynegold »

Didn't you quit this forum? :?
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Re: Cool or Trendy Languages

Post by brandrinn »

People do learn a bit of language for the cool factor, but it's rarely the language itself that has all the cool. For example, the number of white kids who study Japanese is way higher than the number of white kids who study Korean, despite Korean being the clearly superior language. Why do they do this? Is it because they like non-past grammatical markers and dislike phonemic aspiration? No. They do it because they think (wrongly) that Japan is cool, not Japanese itself. They imagine a land of giant robots and blue-haired women who will have sex with them somehow, and they express their enthusiasm for this East Asian Elysium by shouting "Yokatta ZeeeeeEEEEEE!!!!111" and calling each other Steve-kun.
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