On the topic of learning

[Generally_Illiterate]

Everyone here seems so knowledgable about linguistics etc., so I have question.

How did everybody come to know so much? How did you go about learning/understanding the more complex terms (I'm endlessly confused by some of the phonetics terminology). Was it college, or did you teach yourself?

Thanks!

[Gulliver]

The more you read, the more you learn. Whether it be in formal education or just reading a lot of Wikipedia, building up a familiarity with any topic will allow you to understand more and more bits.

I am studying linguistics at MA level, and I believe there are a few PhD people around. I think the ZBB probably helped steer me in that direction, many years ago...

One little thing, though: there have been a few instances of people seeming knowledgeable but actually talking, what is in my opinion, unfounded nonsense, or at the very least anecdote presented as fact. Usually this triggers an interesting debate, though.

[Salmoneus]

Yeah, you have to be careful about that - often the loudest people know the least (myself included). And of course to a lesser extent you also have to bear that in mind when reading the internet.

But it's always worth remembering: stuff they teach you at university is almost always ridiculously easy. Just hanging around the ZBB and reading links people put up is a university-level education in itself (in certain areas - the board is not a great place to learn about formal syntactic theories, in general; on the other hand, it may be better than many universities when it comes to, eg, indo-european diachronics). Back when I was deciding what to do at uni, I looked at a course that had a linguistics componant, and went so far as to buy the introductory book that was the main textbook for the course - only to find that pretty much everything in it was stuff I already knew from the internet (and this was a long, long time ago now). The best way to learn things isn't to set out to learn them, but just to acquire understanding piece by piece. Patience is the greatest asset in this sort of learning.

And asking questions.

Short version: just read stuff. It doesn't matter if you don't understand it today, it may still help you understand something tomorrow.

[finlay]

Everyone here seems so knowledgable about linguistics etc., so I have question.

How did everybody come to know so much? How did you go about learning/understanding the more complex terms (I'm endlessly confused by some of the phonetics terminology). Was it college, or did you teach yourself?

Thanks!

Many of us have been on here for the best part of ten years, that's how! I kinda taught myself with the help of folk on here, originally. Then later I went to college, but yeah. It's like when I went to college, and later to the teacher training course to learn how to do TEFL, I already knew the IPA back to front and inside out, and it was a step I didn't have to take at the time (a lot of people found it hard when they'd just seen it for the first time and were asked to memorize it).

You'll get there, if you're genuinely interested. We're always happy to answer linguistics questions. Sometimes they're questions that have been answered a million times before, so people are a bit tired of answering, but try not to let those people put you off.

[Jipí]

Back when I was deciding what to do at uni, I looked at a course that had a linguistics componant, and went so far as to buy the introductory book that was the main textbook for the course - only to find that pretty much everything in it was stuff I already knew from the internet

I made very much this experience as well. I took an introductory course to German linguistics at uni once and was a little disappointed that the Language Construction Kit basically taught me the same years before already.

Short version: just read stuff. It doesn't matter if you don't understand it today, it may still help you understand something tomorrow.

In my experience it was often a bit difficult reading linguistics papers at the beginning because they were often written in quite dense academic prose. Granted, I'm not a native speaker of English, but it's not exactly for beginners. And even now I still find reading them challenging sometimes (especially if they contain complicated-looking mathsy notation for probably not too difficult concepts). I, too, think that reading the ZBB and asking questions about things you don't understand even with some effort of your own (people here may get angry if you want them to do your homework) helps quite a bit, though.

[cybrxkhan]

I don't know a lot, and kind of am a noob compared to the many veteran conlangers here, but I learned what I learned through conlanging for years and years, and eventually I pick up something for my troubles. I still have anything but a rudimentary understanding of syntax, and my knowledge of how other parts of grammar work is pretty lame at best, but I definitely know way more than I did when I started seriously conlanging more than half a decade ago.

So just work on conlanging and learning the interesting things natlangs do.

[Gulliver]

Oh, and ask questions! Asking "can someone please explain BLAH to me" is almost certain to get a response, even if it's just pointing you in the direction of a Wikipedia page with an unlikely name that has really useful information halfway down.

[Generally_Illiterate]

Thanks guys!
I'll admit the answer I got was, well, simpler than I was expecting (which is definitely a good thing). So, to summarise for myself, read and ask questions. I'm also looking to get the 2nd Language Construction Kit for my birthday too.

[Ser]

Since you already have the dead-tree LCK, have a look at Zompist's recommendations at the end of the book. Those books he recommends are pretty common reads.

[Gulliver]

I've been having a think about books I'd recommend, and the following have floated up to the top of the file.

Teach Yourself Linguistics (Jean Aitchinson, 1999) is a good starting point. It's not at all in depth but it's a pleasant enough read and covers a lot of basics. On UK Amazon it costs 1p, so I'm guessing you can get it cheaply wherever. Your local library might even have it.

Peter Ladefoged's Vowels and Consonants or A Course in Phonetics are both accessible and comprehensive. You'd probably need a university library, though, otherwise use Wikipedia for the basics and check on the more challenging bits as and when you think you need them.

For learning about grammar, I think there's nothing better than looking at a few phrasebooks and Teach Yourself-type courses to basically get a feel of how different things can be between languages, and then look them up later. Wikipedia is generally pretty good for stuff about grammar, although things can be quite well hidden and sometimes you need to know what something is called before you have any chance of finding it. It's good for "Tell me everything I need to know about..." queries, but completely useless for "What's it called when..." ones.

There are a few good blogs out and about, such as David Crystal's blog, languagehat.com, John Well's phonetics blog and Language Log. Stack Exchange (which is like Yahoo! Answers but less penis-size focal) is good as well, although it can be a bit catty.

I would steer clear of Describing Morphosyntax, which for a while people on this board farted rainbows about, for a long time; it is an achingly boring read and, in my opinion, does nothing but pour water on the creative fires. I'm not saying it does not have its uses, but those uses are niche and it misses some preliminary steps.