Help your fluency in a nifty way

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hwhatting
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

Astraios wrote:Так прошёл у нас ещё один праздник. Мы с Зишой отпраздновали со многими эпизодами «Футурамы», а потом он меня познакомил с «Бургерами Боба», в которые я совершенно влюбилась. Мы тоже приготовили не одную, не две, а три пиццы (на каждого), даже и месили тесто собственными руками, но третья стала мне очень липко под руками и мне было стыдно её подать. Рекомендации для лучшего теста, кто-нибудь? Ах а у меня также выжегся большой палец на подносе печи. А вина не хватало (вина никогда не хватает!). Но два очень хороших дня эти и были.

So another festival just ended. Me and Ziz celebrated with many episodes of Futurama, and then he introduced me to Bob’s Burgers, which I just fell in love with. We also made not one, not two, but three pizzas (each), and we even kneaded [I want to say /"nEd/] the dough with our very hands, but the third one went all sticky in my hands and I was ashamed to serve it. Tips for the perfect dough, anyone? Oh, and I also cauterized my thumb on the oven tray. And there wasn't enough wine (there's never enough wine!). But it was two very good days.
Nie mogę pomóc, niestety tylko wiem jak odgrzewać mrożone pizze kupione w sklepie.
Ik kann niet helpen, ik weet helaas maar hoe men ingevrorene, in de winkel gekochte pizza's warm maakt.

I can't help, I unfortunately only know how to warm shop-bought frozen pizzas.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

hwhatting wrote:Ik kann niet helpen, ik weet helaas alleen maar hoe men je ingevrorene bevroren, in de winkel gekochte pizza's warm maakt.
Unfortunately, there's very little right about that sentence :). I would go for "Ik kan je helaas niet helpen, want ik weet alleen maar hoe je bevroren kant-en-klaar pizza's moet klaarmaken." The actual errors: "kann" -> "kan" (there's never two of the same consonants at the end of a Dutch word), "maar" -> "alleen maar", "men" -> "je" (not wrong per se, but very marked as formal), "ingevrorene" -> "ingevroren" (I'm not sure about the rules here, but the e is wrong) -> "bevroren" ("ingevroren" focusses on the proces of getting it frozen, "bevroren" focusses on the state), "in de winkel gekochte" - not wrong per se, but such a pizza is called a "kant-en-klaar pizza". Also it sounds a bit formal to have an adjectival subclause. "warm maken" -> "opwarmen" ("warm maken" isn't wrong per se, but "opwarmen" is more idiomatic). Also frozen pizzas typically need to be actually baked to finish them, so I substituted "klaarmaken" ("to finish").

Ich hoffe, dass ich nächste Mahl mehr Zeit dazu habe, etwas längeres zu schreiben.
I hope that next time, I've got more time to write something longer.

EDIT: changed "klaarmaakt" into "moet klaarmaken", which sounds more idiomatic on a second reading.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:Unfortunately, there's very little right about that sentence :)
Thanks for the explanations, they really help me learn!

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Aangezien ik nederlands leer, ik zal op nederlands een beetje schrijven. Vooral omdat jullie me met mijn nederlands kunnen raden. Ik heb een grote fiche te lezen op de uitspraakproblemen van Franstalige leerders. Ik weet niet als dit veel goed voor mij zal doen. :P

Since I'm learning Dutch, I'll write a little in Dutch. Especially because y'all can advise me with my Dutch. I have a large sheet to read on pronunciation problems for French speakers. I don't know if this will do much good for me. :P
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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hwhatting wrote:Thanks for the explanations, they really help me learn!
That goes both ways, though I doubt I'll ever get those pesky declensions down :(. As for not adding an "e" after "bevroren", the general rule is that participles ending in -en don't get an extra e (or perhaps the more general rule is that any adjectival that ends in -en doesn't get -e, which also includes materials like "ijzeren"), so it's "een geslagen hond", "een vergeten cadeautje", "een gelezen boek" but "een geschopte hond", "een verharde weg", "een berispte leerling".
Viktor77 wrote:Aangezien ik nederlands leer, ik zal op nederlands een beetje schrijven. Vooral omdat jullie me met mijn nederlands kunnen raden. Ik heb een grote fiche te lezen op de uitspraakproblemen van Franstalige leerders. Ik weet niet als dit veel goed voor mij zal doen.
Cool you're trying Vik! :) The only thing in the above that'll stump Dutch speakers is "raden", which means "guess" i/o "advise" or "help". If I were to rephrase the above in idiomatically and grammatically correct Dutch, I'd say something along the lines of: "Aangezien ik Nederlands aan het leren ben, zal ik een beetje in het Nederlands schrijven. Vooral omdat jullie me met mijn Nederlands kunnen helpen. Ik moet een groot blad* lezen over uitspraakproblemen voor studenten met Frans als moedertaal. Ik weet niet of ik daar heel veel aan heb."
*I'm not sure how to translate "sheet" here. I'd need to see the sheet in question to propose a proper translation.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:Cool you're trying Vik! :) The only thing in the above that'll stump Dutch speakers is "raden", which means "guess" i/o "advise" or "help". If I were to rephrase the above in idiomatically and grammatically correct Dutch, I'd say something along the lines of: "Aangezien ik Nederlands aan het leren ben, zal ik een beetje in het Nederlands schrijven. Vooral omdat jullie me met mijn Nederlands kunnen helpen. Ik moet een groot blad* lezen over uitspraakproblemen voor studenten met Frans als moedertaal. Ik weet niet of ik daar heel veel aan heb."
*I'm not sure how to translate "sheet" here. I'd need to see the sheet in question to propose a proper translation.
Dit is een PDF van een boek, 1 pagina. Onze leerar zegt "tekst." Met het Nederlands, maak ik me zorgen over de zinsschema en de semantiek (idiomatischespraak). Maar het zal gebueren.*

*Ik heb deze zin van Frans getranslateerd, van ça va arriver.


This is a PDF from a book, 1 page. Our teacher says "tekst." With Dutch I'm worried about sentence structure and semantics (idiomatic speak). But that'll come.*

*I translated this phrase from French, from ça va arriver.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Viktor77 wrote:Het is een PDF van een boek, 1 pagina. Onze leraar zegt "tekst." Met het Nederlands, maak ik me zorgen over de* zinsopbouw en de semantiek (idiomatische spraak). Maar het zal gebeuren.*
*Ik heb deze zin uit het Frans vertaald, van ça va arriver.

If it's a page of text, in the previous translation I'd say "bladzijde" for "sheet". "zegt" could be translated with "noemt het", but then again, in English you also have "says" (i/o "calls it"). Instead of "zinsopbouw" you could also say "zinsstructuur" or even "syntax" (but you don't have that in English either). Are you forgetting English? "idiomatic speak" doesn't seem right? ("speech"?). "Het zal gebeuren" is indeed not idiomatic, I'd say "maar dat komt wel".

EDIT: * "schema" is a "het" word, so "het zinsschema". But "zinsschema" isn't idiomatic here.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:
Viktor77 wrote:Het is een PDF van een boek, 1 pagina. Onze leraar zegt "tekst." Met het Nederlands, maak ik me zorgen over de* zinsopbouw en de semantiek (idiomatische spraak). Maar het zal gebeuren.*
*Ik heb deze zin uit het Frans vertaald, van ça va arriver.

If it's a page of text, in the previous translation I'd say "bladzijde" for "sheet". "zegt" could be translated with "noemt het", but then again, in English you also have "says" (i/o "calls it"). Instead of "zinsopbouw" you could also say "zinsstructuur" or even "syntax" (but you don't have that in English either). Are you forgetting English? "idiomatic speak" doesn't seem right? ("speech"?). "Het zal gebeuren" is indeed not idiomatic, I'd say "maar dat komt wel".

EDIT: * "schema" is a "het" word, so "het zinsschema". But "zinsschema" isn't idiomatic here.


Ah, onze leraar noemt het "zinsschema" in de Administratieve gegevens, dus ik dacht dat deze wood "sentence structure" was. En ja, ik vergeet mijn Engels. Nu dat ik in België woon, ik ben omringd door Frans en dus ik vergeet mijn Engels. :P Ik moet op Engels-Frans "conversation tables" volgende week deelnemen. Ik maak me zorgen over mijn Engels haha, niet mijn Frans.

Ah, our teacher calls it "zinsschema" in the the Administrative information, so I thought that this word was "sentence structure. And yes, I forget my English. Now that I live in Belgium, I am surrounded by French and so I forget my English. :P I have to participate at English-French conversation tables next week. I'm worried about my English haha, not my French.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Viktor77 wrote:Ah, onze leraar noemt het "zinsschema" in de Administratieve gegevens, dus ik dacht dat dit woord "sentence structure" was. En ja, ik vergeet mijn Engels. Nu dat ik in België woon, ben ik omringd door Frans en dus vergeet ik mijn Engels. Ik moet aan Engels-Franse "conversation tables" deelnemen volgende week. Ik maak me zorgen over mijn Engels haha, niet mijn Frans.
I googled "zinsschema", and apart from false hits in German, there's very little to be found. The few grammar pages that use it, seem to use it for a schema of syntactic slots, or the like.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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ik heb geld nodig. help me, iemand!
お金が要るわ。誰か助けてください!
i need money.. help me someone!

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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finlay wrote:ik heb geld nodig. help me, iemand!
Though it sounds a bit off, I'm not sure how to translate the "somebody" in the English original. I think I'd say "help me alsjeblieft" or the like, instead.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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finlay wrote:ik heb geld nodig. help me, iemand!
お金が要るわ。誰か助けてください!
i need money.. help me someone!
Ich auch. 2015 ist scheiße.
Me too. 2015 sucks.

Ich bin arm, hungrig, geisteskrank und mir ist kalt.
I'm poor, hungry, cold and mentally ill.

Just being dramatic. Cold and hungry are about to be fixed.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Imralu wrote:I'm poor, hungry, cold and mentally ill.
Just being dramatic. Cold and hungry are about to be fixed.
Ha ha, genau, wenn man nich langer hungrig und kalt ist, ist es ganz egal ob man geisteskrank oder arm ist :).
Heheh, right, when you're no longer hungry and cold, it doesn't matter whether you're mentally ill and poor :).


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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9月はいつもそんな感じで、不安が出ている。誕生日のせいかな。誕生日は来週で、去年と同じく彼氏と一緒にキャンプ行くつもりだ。その上に、パーティーも行きたいが、用意するのは大変だわ。
September is always the same way, I get anxiety. I think it's because of my birthday, next week. Like last year I'm gonna go camping with my boyfriend, but I also want to have a party, but planning that shit is difficult.

そしたらも、今年はすぐ寒くなってたし、ホリデーにいつも雨が降って続けているし、もう大変だ。
Also, this year got cold pretty quickly, and it keeps raining and raining on my days off, so it's also difficult.

(actually this means that the temperature is a balmy 23° and it's quite easy to move around and I don't have to use the AC, but I've grown to expect long summers in Japan and September's been a bit of a washout)

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Maudit allemand! A cause de toi je pouvais pas bien parler néerlandais. J’ai dit comme réponse à la question « Wat is typische Nederlands voor je » (je suis sûr que mon professeur a bien meilleur formé cette question que moi) « De grote mensen, aber in België… » Ou « Aber ik kan niet so gut Nederlands spreken. » Aussi, c’est un peu difficile de parler et écouter le néerlandais pendant 4 heures et après parler en français. Du coup j’avais mal à la tête. Mais ça va arriver parce que je peux changer entre anglais et français sans problème. Je dois très rapidement apprendre beaucoup de néerlandais parce que dans notre « werkcollege » il faut répondre au professeur, parler, etc. et la plupart d'étudiants a suivi plus de 4 ans de néerlandais au lycée. Donc c’est ça mon but cette semaine, apprendre tout ce que je peux avant notre prochain séance, être prêt à parler, à répondre même si c’est assez élémentaire.

Ok, c’est tout. Je vous jure que je suis pas normalement râleur.


Damn you, German! Because of you I couldn't speak Dutch well. I said as a response to the question "Wat is typische Nederlands voor je" (I' sure my professor said it better), "De grote mensen, aber in België… " Or "Aber ik kan niet so gut Nederlands spreken." Also, it's difficult to speak and listen to Dutch for 4 hours and then after speak French. So I had a headache. But that'll come because I can change between English and French without any problem. I have to learn lots of Dutch very quickly because in our "werkcollege" we have to respond to the professor, speak, etc. and the majority of the students took more than 4 years of Dutch in high school. So my goal this week is to learn as much as I can before the next class and be ready to speak and respond even thought it's somewhat elementary.

Ok that's all. I swear I'm not normally a complainer.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:Ha ha, genau, wenn man nicht mehr hungrig ist und einem nicht kalt ist, ist es ganz egal, ob man geisteskrank oder arm ist :).
Heheh, right, when you're no longer hungry and cold, it doesn't matter whether you're mentally ill and poor :).
Jestem zmięczony
Ik ben moe.
Je suis fatigué.
Estoy cansado.
Sono stanco.
Defessus sum.
Yorgunum
Шаршадым

I'm tired.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:
Imralu wrote:I'm poor, hungry, cold and mentally ill.
Just being dramatic. Cold and hungry are about to be fixed.
Ha ha, genau, wenn man nich langer hungrig und kalt ist, ist es ganz egal ob man geisteskrank oder arm ist :).
Heheh, right, when you're no longer hungry and cold, it doesn't matter whether you're mentally ill and poor :).
Die Hälfte von meinen Problemen sind gelöst.
Half of my problems have been fixed.

Hwhatting, neden yorgunsun? Uyumadın mı?
Hwhatting, why are you tired? Didn't you sleep?
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Imralu wrote:Half of my problems have been fixed.
Du sollst den Lotterie spielen, da du 50% Chance zu gewinnen hast: du gewinst, oder du gewinst nicht :).
You should play the lottery, as you have a 50% winning chance: either you win, or you don't :).


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Viktor77 wrote:"De grote mensen, aber in België… " Or "Aber ik kan niet so gut Nederlands spreken."
Erinnere sich, das es kein /g/ gibt in Niederländisch, und du willst niemals [gut] sagen (statt [xut] oder [ɣut] auf Flämisch) :). Und "aber" ist "maar" in Niederländisch, aber das weist du denke ich schon.
Remember that there's no /g/ in Dutch, and you'll never say [gut] (instead of [] or [] in Flemmish). And "aber" is "maar" in Dutch, but I assume you already know that.
So my goal this week is to learn as much as I can before the next class and be ready to speak and respond even thought it's somewhat elementary.
Respect to you! I'd never be able to pick up so much so quickly!


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:
So my goal this week is to learn as much as I can before the next class and be ready to speak and respond even thought it's somewhat elementary.
Respect to you! I'd never be able to pick up so much so quickly!
Zolang ik waarlijk slaag. :) Zal ik met de vraag: "Where is Brian? -Brian is in the kitchen" beginnen?

Waar is Brian? Brian is in de keuken!


As long as I actually succeed. :) Shall I begin with the question: "Where is Brian? -Brian is in the kitchen?"

Where is Brian? Brian is in the kitchen!
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Viktor77 wrote:Zolang Als ik waarlijk maar slaag. :) Zal ik met de vraag: "Where is Brian? -Brian is in the kitchen" beginnen?
"Zolang" always implies a certain stretch of time, and can't be used with resultatives (if that's the word) like "slagen". "waarlijk" is, at least in Netherlands Dutch, relegated to church language, though it may be more current in Flemmish. I've got problems translating "actually" here, so I left it out ("maar" is added for whatever modal function it has). I marked "beginnen" in orange for no other reason than that I think it's more idomatic to insert it after "ik" to avoid inserting too much between subject and verb.

Mein Gott, es ist fast 1 uhr! Ich muß schalfen gehen!
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Guten Tag! wie geht's euch?
Good day! how are you(plural)?
See here for a short introduction of some of my conlangs: http://cals.conlang.org/people/472

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jal wrote:
Viktor77 wrote:Zolang Als ik waarlijk maar slaag. :) Zal ik met de vraag: "Where is Brian? -Brian is in the kitchen" beginnen?
"Zolang" always implies a certain stretch of time, and can't be used with resultatives (if that's the word) like "slagen". "waarlijk" is, at least in Netherlands Dutch, relegated to church language, though it may be more current in Flemmish. I've got problems translating "actually" here, so I left it out ("maar" is added for whatever modal function it has). I marked "beginnen" in orange for no other reason than that I think it's more idomatic to insert it after "ik" to avoid inserting too much between subject and verb.
Ah dank je wel.
k1234567890y wrote:Guten Tag! wie geht's euch?
Good day! how are you(plural)?
Goed! Hoe gaat het met jou? Vandaag was ik in Oostende op het strand. Het is een moderne stad, niet zeer mooi maar het strand is wel mooi. Maar wanneer ik de stad wilde verlaten, op het trein station de trein lag nog tussen Gent en Brugge, een vertraging van 20 minuten, doordat een persoon bij de trein was getroft! :o

Good! How are you? Today I was in Ostend at the beach. It is a modern city, not very pretty but the beach is nice. But when I wanted to leave the city, at the train station the train was still between Ghent and Bruges, a delay of 20 minutes, because a person was hit by the train! :o
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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Viktor77 wrote:Goed! Hoe gaat het met jou? Vandaag was ik in Oostende op het strand. Het is een moderne stad, niet zeer mooi maar het strand is wel mooi. Maar wanneer toen ik de stad wilde verlaten, bleek op het trein station dat de trein lag nog tussen Gent en Brugge lag, een vertraging van 20 minuten, doordat een persoon bij door de trein was getroft aangereden!
Wow, Vik, almost flawless! I'm again impressed. Just a few notes: "Het" seems to refer to the beach, so I coloured it orange, but I see you made the same semantic jump in English :). "zeer" is, at least in Netherlands Dutch*, writing style, I'd say "heel". I coloured "is" and "mooi" because it seems overly repetative, I'd just leave it out ("het strand wel"). "Wanneer" is not used when referring to a specific instance of time, in that case use "toen". The short-cut English takes with the PP "at the train station" doesn't work for me in Dutch, I'd add "bleek" ("turned out" or the like), which relegates "lag" to the end (alternative without "dat": "bleek de trein nog (...) te liggen"). Agents of a passive sentence always take "door" (I assume "bij" is a too literal translation from English). The verb "treffen" has past participle "getroffen", but in case of a vehicle, "aangereden" (from "aanrijden") is more common (you'd use "getroffen" in case of projectiles like balls or bullets, or lightning ("door de bliksem getroffen", also a failry oft used expression).

*I'll refrain in the future from explcitly stating it. My knowledge of Flemmish Dutch is relatively scant, so what I say about Dutch is about NL Dutch (and therefore may not hold in Flanders), unless otherwise stated.

Jetzt muß ich wieder an die Arbeit!
Now I have to work again!


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:
Viktor77 wrote:Goed! Hoe gaat het met jou? Vandaag was ik in Oostende op het strand. Het is een moderne stad, niet zeer mooi maar het strand is wel mooi. Maar wanneer toen ik de stad wilde verlaten, bleek op het trein station dat de trein lag nog tussen Gent en Brugge lag, een vertraging van 20 minuten, doordat een persoon bij door de trein was getroft aangereden!
Wow, Vik, almost flawless! I'm again impressed. Just a few notes: "Het" seems to refer to the beach, so I coloured it orange, but I see you made the same semantic jump in English :). "zeer" is, at least in Netherlands Dutch*, writing style, I'd say "heel". I coloured "is" and "mooi" because it seems overly repetative, I'd just leave it out ("het strand wel"). "Wanneer" is not used when referring to a specific instance of time, in that case use "toen". The short-cut English takes with the PP "at the train station" doesn't work for me in Dutch, I'd add "bleek" ("turned out" or the like), which relegates "lag" to the end (alternative without "dat": "bleek de trein nog (...) te liggen"). Agents of a passive sentence always take "door" (I assume "bij" is a too literal translation from English). The verb "treffen" has past participle "getroffen", but in case of a vehicle, "aangereden" (from "aanrijden") is more common (you'd use "getroffen" in case of projectiles like balls or bullets, or lightning ("door de bliksem getroffen", also a failry oft used expression).

*I'll refrain in the future from explcitly stating it. My knowledge of Flemmish Dutch is relatively scant, so what I say about Dutch is about NL Dutch (and therefore may not hold in Flanders), unless otherwise stated.

Jetzt muß ich wieder an die Arbeit!
Now I have to work again!
Jal, dank je. :) Kun je me het verschil uitleggen tussen "heel" en "zeer" en "veel?" (In Nederlandse Nederlands niet Vlaamse Nederlands natuurlijk) Ik heb deze uitleg gebruikt:
veel = much, a great deal = beaucoup
heel = wholly, entirely, completely = tout à fait, complètement
zeer = very, greatly, most = très
Falgwian and Falgwia!!

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

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