Canadian accent in Spanish

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

Post by Ser »

A number of people here pronounce "egg" [e(ː)ɪg] as well.
Viktor77 wrote:Some of the worst offenses are things like using English [aI] in words which are cognates like idea, using English [tSr] in words with tr like eletricidad and not dropping final [d], and retaining [‏I].
[tʃɹ] is understandable though, I can imagine English speakers having a lot of trouble with standard [tɾ] or the more dialectal alternatives. There's nothing wrong with retaining word-final /d/ (usually pronounced [θ] in central/norhtern Spain, typically nothing or [ð] (high registers) elsewhere: bondad [bonˈdaθ, bonˈdað, bonˈda]). What is that thing of retaining [ɪ] though?
spats wrote:
Shm Jay wrote:A propósito, I presume there is such a thing as a typical anglo-estadounidense accent? What would be the general Latin American expectation as to what a nortíssimeamericanense (canadiense) accent sounds like? Or would such a thing be so rare and unexpected that no one would expect anything?

(I decided to adopt the castellaño accent to try and distinguish myself from the typical "American speaking Spanish who maybe learned in it high school".)
I can't say what would be expected, but if you're talking about a stereotypical Canadian English speaker, you're probably going to get:
* /a/ as a low front vowel instead of a low back or central vowel
* /e/ and /o/ with less/no diphthongization
...
But that's like, Toronto speech. People over here do diphthongize /eɪ/ and /oʊ/...
That's about it. Other than that, general Canadian doesn't differ much from GA. You'd expect the same problems with pronouncing /b d g/ as approximants, <y> and <ll> would still be [j], and <j> would still be /h/. Unstressed vowels would still be reduced. There would be the same tendency to incorrectly voice <z> and (to a lesser extent) <s> and pronounce final <s> fully.

Some of these features are, coincidentally, shared by inland Mexican Spanish, so they're not technically wrong. (Others, like voicing <z> and <s>, are just dumb.)
Actually, everything you mentioned is shared with basilectal Mexico City Spanish. Including pronouncing [z]s in curious places like intervocalically. :P As far as I can tell their use of [h] for ‹j› /x/ isn't as prominent as in many other dialects though (I've even had immigrants from Mexico City remark my use of [h] for /x/ in nearly every position...).

Also, thanks to Zompist or the mod who split the thread.

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

Post by spats »

Serafín wrote:
That's about it. Other than that, general Canadian doesn't differ much from GA. You'd expect the same problems with pronouncing /b d g/ as approximants, <y> and <ll> would still be [j], and <j> would still be /h/. Unstressed vowels would still be reduced. There would be the same tendency to incorrectly voice <z> and (to a lesser extent) <s> and pronounce final <s> fully.

Some of these features are, coincidentally, shared by inland Mexican Spanish, so they're not technically wrong. (Others, like voicing <z> and <s>, are just dumb.)
Actually, everything you mentioned is shared with basilectal Mexico City Spanish. Including pronouncing [z]s in curious places like intervocalically. :P As far as I can tell their use of [h] for ‹j› /x/ isn't as prominent as in many other dialects though (I've even had immigrants from Mexico City remark my use of [h] for /x/ in nearly every position...).
I was aware of some of it, but... all of it? Including Englishy realizations of /b d g/?

Is it due to some kind of weird Anglo-American influence?

(There are some Central American/Caribbean speakers that use [h] for ‹j›, from what I understand.)

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

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spats wrote:
Serafín wrote:
That's about it. Other than that, general Canadian doesn't differ much from GA. You'd expect the same problems with pronouncing /b d g/ as approximants, <y> and <ll> would still be [j], and <j> would still be /h/. Unstressed vowels would still be reduced. There would be the same tendency to incorrectly voice <z> and (to a lesser extent) <s> and pronounce final <s> fully.

Some of these features are, coincidentally, shared by inland Mexican Spanish, so they're not technically wrong. (Others, like voicing <z> and <s>, are just dumb.)
Actually, everything you mentioned is shared with basilectal Mexico City Spanish. Including pronouncing [z]s in curious places like intervocalically. :P As far as I can tell their use of [h] for ‹j› /x/ isn't as prominent as in many other dialects though (I've even had immigrants from Mexico City remark my use of [h] for /x/ in nearly every position...).
I was aware of some of it, but... all of it? Including Englishy realizations of /b d g/?
LOL, not that. Apparently I can't read, I totally overlooked that. :P
(There are some Central American/Caribbean speakers that use [h] for ‹j›, from what I understand.)
[h] for ‹j› /x/ in at least some phonological contexts is a very, very widespread thing. It happens all over Mexico, Central America and dialects spoken in lands with coasts to the Caribbean sea, and has a strong presence in the various "accessible areas" of later migrations from Spain including but not limited to Lima (Peru) and Santiago de Chile, as well as southern Spain as you'd expect.

Where did you get that it only happens in Central America and the Caribbean?

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

Post by spats »

Serafín wrote:Where did you get that it only happens in Central America and the Caribbean?
Didn't - just know it does happen there. I don't have a lot of contact with people from those countries on a regular basis that I can identify, "s/he's from ___". So it's hard to generalize further than that.

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

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spats wrote:
Serafín wrote:Where did you get that it only happens in Central America and the Caribbean?
Didn't - just know it does happen there. I don't have a lot of contact with people from those countries on a regular basis that I can identify,
But there's always the possibility to read on Spanish dialects. :wink:
"s/he's from ___". So it's hard to generalize further than that.
I'm actually pretty bad at identifying where people I talk to are from, mostly because they tend to tone down their dialect when speaking to people with a different dialect.

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Re: Canadian accent in Spanish

Post by spats »

Serafín wrote:
spats wrote:
Serafín wrote:Where did you get that it only happens in Central America and the Caribbean?
Didn't - just know it does happen there. I don't have a lot of contact with people from those countries on a regular basis that I can identify,
But there's always the possibility to read on Spanish dialects. :wink:
Did some reading before I went to Spain, plus have read the relevant Wikipedia :)

The Puerto Ricans I have met seem to have very "light" consonants. To me it seemed like <ll>, <y> and in many cases "hard" <g> were all [j], while <j> and "soft" <g> were [h]. A bunch of stuff just dropped out completely.

--Dave

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