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Yesterday I began messing with Scandinavian dialects again, and ended up making this map. It uses a somewhat non-standard classification for the different varieties than what's usually seen. The accuracy of this classification can obviously be discussed, but I think it's fairly good. One main point of this map was that I wanted to try to step away from labelling everything with "Danish" or "Norwegian" because, well, it's a continuum. This is why you see some non-standard terms used for some varieties, although, this is not the case for all of them. And just so we're clear, I'm not saying these are all part of the same continuum, or that they're all dialects or something like that. I'm pointing out general varieties of the North Scandinavian language in a traditional/historical sense.

Comments and criticism is most welcome, especially thoughts about the classification are welcome, as it's rather experimental than something that I'm arguing for. And even if you don't know or care too much about Scandinavian languages, I thought this could still be interesting, because it's an interesting map. :)

And in case anyone's wondering, the 2 encirlced pixels refer to Runö (Ruhnu) and Gammelsvenskby (Старошведське). Also note that "Swedish" should be read in the context of svear, rather than of Sweden. I felt like making the names look good in English, which created this little ambiguity, but what're you gonna do :(

So, here you go:

What? I don't speak Swedish anymore!?

rickardspaghetti wrote:What? I don't speak Swedish anymore!?

Swedish = Svealandish here.

"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

You'd be surprised to know there are also Icelandic speakers in Manitoba. (Not noted on the map, obviously.)

Nice map! I think it's pretty accurate. One comment: the classification of the languages/dialects spoken around Älvdalen, Sweden (in the northeastern corner of the area you painted dark green) is heavily disputed. Some (Swedish) linguists have classified it as a form of Svealandic, others consider it a separate language, in between East- and West-Norse. But I have never seen it classified with the Østland varieties.

I myself have also tried to make a map of the Scandinavian dialects, but I wanted to do it in much more detail. I stopped when I learned that almost every parish in Norway and Sweden has its own dialect variety. But if you're interested I can post the map as far as I have it.

Agricola Avicula wrote:Nice map! I think it's pretty accurate. One comment: the classification of the languages/dialects spoken around Älvdalen, Sweden (in the northeastern corner of the area you painted dark green) is heavily disputed. Some (Swedish) linguists have classified it as a form of Svealandic, others consider it a separate language, in between East- and West-Norse. But I have never seen it classified with the Østland varieties.

It isn't. The part you're confusing for Älvdalen is in face the two parishes Särna and Idre. Älvdalen is to the south east, within the Swedish area.

Agricola Avicula wrote:I myself have also tried to make a map of the Scandinavian dialects, but I wanted to do it in much more detail. I stopped when I learned that almost every parish in Norway and Sweden has its own dialect variety. But if you're interested I can post the map as far as I have it.

Sure.

rickardspaghetti wrote:What? I don't speak Swedish anymore!?

I suggest you read the text. Besides, you probably speak Standard Book Swedish anyway, which is not covered on this map.

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

I suggest you read the text.

What were your sources for this, or is your personal knowledge of Scandinavian continua that detailed?

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

A decent amount is personal knowledge, and then i complement with several books and some websites. On Danish and Norwegian I have to rely a bit more on a narrow amount of sources because I unfortunately don't have a lot of literature about their dialects (I'm more well-supplied on the Swedish ones).

To be completely fair, this classification is somewhat based on several discussions I had like one or two years ago, and I don't remember the full details on what we based everything on. As I said it's a bit experimental. What made me pick it up again was that I started to think about the relationships between the varieties of Sweden and Norway, because I'm not too convinced a straight Swedish vs Norwegian grouping is necessarily the best one.

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

It was founded by Swedes who were deported from Estonia by Catherine the Great.

Aszev wrote:

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

It was founded by Swedes who were deported from Estonia by Catherine the Great.

Huh, I've heard something completely else. Oh well.

Aszev wrote:

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

It was founded by Swedes who were deported from Estonia by Catherine the Great.

It was founded by Xenu, as a colony for his secret agents who then migrated to Sweden and brought their language with them. Yes, Xenu and his people speak Swedish and English is just another dialect of it, like Hixkaryana and Esperanto(Edo Nyland was right after all!). If you believe otherwise, you're stupid!

Looks like you managed to fix up the legend really well. The map looks really good, and is considerably easier to follow than the legendless version I first laid my eyes on.

It's a good map, but I wonder what features you're splitting on?

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

The eighteenth-century Swedish army conquered stuff in Ukraine? Wow.

(Incidentally, I was under the impression that the eighteenth-century Swedish army pretty much succeeded only in losing what the seventeenth-century one had conquered - which itself had stopped a few thousand miles short of Ukraine, AFAIK. But it's amazing what you can learn on the Interwebz, and without Google, too!)

Åge Kruger wrote:It's a good map, but I wonder what features you're splitting on?

WHS. Give us an isogloss map next!

What's spoken at the northern tip of Sw?

Io wrote:What's spoken at the northern tip of Sw?

Trees can't talk.

Io wrote:What's spoken at the northern tip of Sw?

Sami?


JAL

jal wrote:

Io wrote:What's spoken at the northern tip of Sw?

Sami?


JAL

The Swedish spoken there is mainly transplanted dialects from other parts of Norrland, but no dialects really are 'native' there, except for dialects of Finnish and Sami - and probably the number of Finnish speakers always has been higher than that of Sami speakers there.

Xonen wrote:

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

The eighteenth-century Swedish army conquered stuff in Ukraine? Wow.

(Incidentally, I was under the impression that the eighteenth-century Swedish army pretty much succeeded only in losing what the seventeenth-century one had conquered - which itself had stopped a few thousand miles short of Ukraine, AFAIK. But it's amazing what you can learn on the Interwebz, and without Google, too!)

Gammalsvenskby was actually founded by Swedes who were effectively deported from Estonia by Catherine the Great (or at least deceptively promised what seemed to be a good offer land-wise at the time); most of the Swedes who were initially moved there actually died on the way or pretty soon thereafter.

Xonen wrote:

Qwynegold wrote:

rickardspaghetti wrote:"Rickard looks through the map once again."

What!? There are Swedish speakers in Ukraine?

It was founded in like the 18th century by people from the Swedish army when they were conquering stuff.

The eighteenth-century Swedish army conquered stuff in Ukraine? Wow.

(Incidentally, I was under the impression that the eighteenth-century Swedish army pretty much succeeded only in losing what the seventeenth-century one had conquered - which itself had stopped a few thousand miles short of Ukraine, AFAIK. But it's amazing what you can learn on the Interwebz, and without Google, too!)

They somehow winded up there from Germany. I don't know, I just read about it in a newspaper article once.

Apparently some Germans got there too, indeed, but the Swedes came from (what is now) Estonia. They apparently still speak some variety of German over there, and some even speak an old Swedish dialect

But there are probably other sources that contradict the ones some of us here have read

Where's Elfdalian?