The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

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Sumelic
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Sumelic »

jaguar /ˈdʒægwɚ/. I also used to (and maybe still do occasionally) have a variant with /aɪ.ɚ/ at the end.
koala /koˈɑlə/ pronounced [kʰoʊ̯ˈɑɫə], more or less. I don't think the transition between the "o" and "a" is as constrictive as a phonemic /w/; at least, the start of the word seems to be distinguishable from the start of "cowalker", and even though that contrast could be analyzed as a matter of juncture it seems simpler to me to just assume that "koala" doesn't really have phonemic /w/ for me.

how about 'll contractions?

For me, it's like this (going from least to greatest amount of reduction)

I'll: [aɪ̯.ɫ̩~aɪ̯ɫ], [ɑɫ], [ɫ̩] - the first feels almost like it has an "unnaturally" low amount of reduction, if that makes sense, but it does feel possible.
you'll: [jʊɫ], [jɫ̩] - For me, [juɫ] (like "Yule") doesn't feel possible, maybe because of influence from "you're/your". To me, [ʊɫ] and [ɫ̩] sound very similar, so I can't distinguish them too well.
he'll: [hiɫ], [hɪɫ], [hɫ̩] - the first definitely feels unnatural to me: although possible, I don't think I'd say it spontaneously. The closest analogy I can think of is using [aʊɚ̯~aʊ.ɚ] for "our", which is something that is possible for me but only in unnaturally carefully enunciated speech (maybe in singing, for example).
she'll: [ʃiɫ], [ʃɪɫ], [ʃɫ̩] - ditto
it'll: [ɪdɫ̩] or [ɪɾɫ̩] (I can't really hear the difference between [d] and [ɾ] in English words), [ɪɫ̩~ɪɫ(ː)~ɪɫ] - default feels like it has [ɾ], but very weakly articulated
they'll: [ðe̞ə̯ɫ], [ðɪɫ], [ðɫ̩]
there'll: [ðe̞ɚ̯.ɫ̩~ðe̞ɚ̯ɫ̩], [ðe̞ə̯ɫ], [ðɪɫ], [ðɫ̩] - I was surprised to realize I can fairly easily drop /r/ here, even though I have a rhotic accent

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Sol717 »

Does anyone else pronounce "seal" (as in the animal) and "seal" (as in the stamp) differently? I pronounce the former [si.əw] and the later [sew]~[se.əw]. As far as I've checked, all other other historic /-iːl/ words pattern to the latter (e.g. real [ɹeəw] wholemeal [hɔwˈmeəw]).

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Qxentio »

linguoboy wrote:
Imralu wrote:A lot of singers turn the HAPPY vowel into something like [e] or even [E] and pronouncing it as [ i ] seems weird to me, like if the person's singing is not amazing, that will make it sound worse.

How did this start?
Could it be related to the lack of happy tensing in Southern American English? I can easily see lowering the [ɪ] to [e] to make it more salient in singing.
Sorry to butt into the discussion so late, but I find the phonetics of singing absolutely fascinating. Lots of things happen that don't happen in any other registers of speech.
For example, I love it when in this song, the singer goes: /loun.le loun.le, laun.liː/. Two totally different pronunciations of the same word.
Sol717 wrote:Does anyone else pronounce "seal" (as in the animal) and "seal" (as in the stamp) differently? I pronounce the former [si.əw] and the later [sew]~[se.əw]. As far as I've checked, all other other historic /-iːl/ words pattern to the latter (e.g. real [ɹeəw] wholemeal [hɔwˈmeəw]).
That's weird. Both pronunciations make sense to me as dialectal variations, but as minimal pairs?
Meine Muttersprache ist Deutsch. My second language is English. Olim discēbam Latinam. Sú ginévam Jagárhvejak. Opiskelen Suomea. Un ek kür en lütten Tick Platt.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Sol717 »

Qxentio wrote:
Sol717 wrote:Does anyone else pronounce "seal" (as in the animal) and "seal" (as in the stamp) differently? I pronounce the former [si.əw] and the later [sew]~[se.əw]. As far as I've checked, all other other historic /-iːl/ words pattern to the latter (e.g. real [ɹeəw] wholemeal [hɔwˈmeəw]).
That's weird. Both pronunciations make sense to me as dialectal variations, but as minimal pairs?
I think the /-i.əw/ pronunciation is an American-influenced variant, as I natively speak New Zealand English, but I lived in the US for a while; I believe Oregon (where I lived) has quite a large seal population, therefore the word's use increased quite a bit. The use of the other "seal" wouldn't've changed.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Pole, the »

“duo”
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

[ˈtʲʉ̯uːˌoː]
Last edited by Travis B. on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by alynnidalar »

I... think I just say [du.oʊ̯]. That can't be right, can it? It's never that straightforward.
I generally forget to say, so if it's relevant and I don't mention it--I'm from Southern Michigan and speak Inland North American English. Yes, I have the Northern Cities Vowel Shift; no, I don't have the cot-caught merger; and it is called pop.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Pole, the »

I've heard it recently as “Jew-oh” and it took me a while.
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Salmoneus »

Pole, the wrote:I've heard it recently as “Jew-oh” and it took me a while.
That's ordinary yod-coalescence, which you'll find in dialects across the Commonwealth (including Estuary). Americans do a weird thing instead where they drop the yod entirely (v.s. alynnidalar), which can be confusing.

Personally, I think I (SSBE) mostly keep /dj/, but probably do sometimes have coalescence in speech; I know that even among my friends, many of them have coalescence as standard. I suspect it will be completely standard in a generation.
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Sumelic »

Yeah, I've read linguistically oriented texts that treat coalescence of historical /dj/, resulting in a merger with historical /dʒ/, as standard for a typical contemporary British English accent. Apparently some American English speakers have sporadic retention of /dj/ in some but not all words.

There is also sometimes the possibility in American English of unexpected /dʒ/ /tʃ/ from coalescence before a stressed syllable, but that's quite rare and mainly occurs in variant analogical pronunciations. The main word I can think of where /tʃ/ from historical /tj/ is common before a stressed syllable in American English is "mature" (using /t/ here sounds affected to me).

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

My dialect has done the weird thing that it has lost /j/ after C in stressed syllables outside of sure and sugar and mature, where it coalesced it instead, but then later palatalized coronals in general before /w uː ʊ ər/, and then in turn frequently palatalizing and affricating /t/ in not only words like tune but also words like two. Furthermore /uː/ after but not before a coronal often diphthongizes, sometimes effectively restoring the yod (I have a friend who pronounces stupid with a clear [i̯u] and I find myself when emphasizing two pronouncing it as [tsʲʰi̯uː]).
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Zaarin »

Travis B. wrote:I have a friend who pronounces stupid with a clear [i̯u]
Does he happen to be a short, redheaded boy of extraordinary intelligence in a labcoat with an inexplicable Eastern European accent? :p
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

Zaarin wrote:
Travis B. wrote:I have a friend who pronounces stupid with a clear [i̯u]
Does he happen to be a short, redheaded boy of extraordinary intelligence in a labcoat with an inexplicable Eastern European accent? :p
Nah, she is a lawyer who grew up in the same town as myself in southeastern Wisconsin.
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by StrangerCoug »

Does anybody else here familiar with chess terminology find Zugzwang awkward to pronounce and want to turn the second /t͡s/ into an /s/?
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ »

what
start
feel
tower
tire
it'd
it'd have
want to
isn't it :> innit?
what have you :> whatcha?

Also, do you turn -ing to (for instance trying to) into [ɾ̃ə] or [nə]?

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by linguoboy »

ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:what have you :> whatcha?
Hmm, I don't think I have this contraction in my speech. All the instances of whatcha I can think of are shortenings of "what (are/do) you", e.g. "Whatcha doing?", "Whatcha got there?", "Whatcha want?" (And I more often have "whaddya" here anyhow.)

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Vijay »

Zaarin wrote:
Travis B. wrote:I have a friend who pronounces stupid with a clear [i̯u]
Does he happen to be a short, redheaded boy of extraordinary intelligence in a labcoat with an inexplicable Eastern European accent? :p
Image

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

what: [wʌʔ], followed by a vowel [wʌɾ]~[wʌ]
start: [sʲtʲʌʁʔ], followed by a vowel [sʲtʲʌʁɾ]~[sʲtʲʌʁ]
feel: [fi(ː)ɯ̯]
tower: [tʰɑːɔ̯wʁ̩(ː)]
tire: [tʰəe̯ʁ̩(ː)]
it'd: [ɘːt], followed by a vowel [ɘːɾ]
it'd have: [ˈɘːɾəːf], followed by a vowel [ˈɘːɾəːv]
want to: [ˈwɒ̃ɾ̃ə(ː)]~[wɒ̃ːə̯]~[wɒ̃ː]
isn't it :> innit?: [ˈɘzn̩ːˌnɘʔ], followed by a vowel [ˈɘzn̩ːˌnɘɾ]~[ˈɘzn̩ːˌnɘ]
what have you :> whatcha?: [ˈwʌːvjə(ː)] (whatcha is what did you, i.e. [ˈwʌtʃə(ː)])
Also, do you turn -ing to (for instance trying to) into [ɾ̃ə] or [nə]? I pronounce this as [nə] normally
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

linguoboy wrote:
ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:what have you :> whatcha?
Hmm, I don't think I have this contraction in my speech. All the instances of whatcha I can think of are shortenings of "what (are/do) you", e.g. "Whatcha doing?", "Whatcha got there?", "Whatcha want?" (And I more often have "whaddya" here anyhow.)
For me what are you is [ˈwʌːʁjə(ː)] (i.e. what're ya), and what do you is [ˈwʌːjːə(ː)] (i.e. whaddya with /dj/ > [jː]).
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Vijay »

linguoboy wrote:
ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:what have you :> whatcha?
Hmm, I don't think I have this contraction in my speech. All the instances of whatcha I can think of are shortenings of "what (are/do) you", e.g. "Whatcha doing?", "Whatcha got there?", "Whatcha want?" (And I more often have "whaddya" here anyhow.)
You'd say what do you got? I'd say what have you got?.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Pole, the »

Vijay wrote:
linguoboy wrote:
ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:what have you :> whatcha?
Hmm, I don't think I have this contraction in my speech. All the instances of whatcha I can think of are shortenings of "what (are/do) you", e.g. "Whatcha doing?", "Whatcha got there?", "Whatcha want?" (And I more often have "whaddya" here anyhow.)
You'd say what do you got?
https://www.google.pl/search?q=what+do+you+got
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Travis B. »

Vijay wrote:
linguoboy wrote:
ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:what have you :> whatcha?
Hmm, I don't think I have this contraction in my speech. All the instances of whatcha I can think of are shortenings of "what (are/do) you", e.g. "Whatcha doing?", "Whatcha got there?", "Whatcha want?" (And I more often have "whaddya" here anyhow.)
You'd say what do you got? I'd say what have you got?.
I myself would say whatcha get or what've ya got rather than whatcha got. I can picture other people saying whatcha got though.
Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
Amuhawr jalla vowa vta hlakrhi hdm duthmi xaja.
Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ »

Afghanistan - in Polish I have something like /avganistan/ [ävɡ̠ä̃ˈɲ̟is̪t̪ä̃n̪] or [äʋʀ̝ä̃ˈis̪t̪ä̃n̪] and therefore I was surprised Wiktionary told me this /æfˈɡænɪˌstɑːn/. Does /f/ surface only in something like short /æ/?
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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Ryusenshi »

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "/f/ surface only in something like short /æ/".

It seems that in Polish, there is some voicing assimilation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assimilation_(phonology)) that turns /f/ into /v/ before a voiced consonant such as /g/. This is actually very common, and lots of languages would similarly turn an /f/ into a /v/ in this context. But English isn't one of them: English speakers can, at least potentially, keep a contrast between /f/ and /v/ in this situation. This has nothing to do with the previous vowel.

Or maybe that wasn't what you were asking, in which case I'm sorry.

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Re: The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

Post by Vijay »

ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:Afghanistan - in Polish I have something like /avganistan/ [ävɡ̠ä̃ˈɲ̟is̪t̪ä̃n̪] or [äʋʀ̝ä̃ˈis̪t̪ä̃n̪] and therefore I was surprised Wiktionary told me this /æfˈɡænɪˌstɑːn/.
That's just the usual American pronunciation of it. It's not the only valid one in English by any means.

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