The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

[finlay]

I would say it's a register difference, at least in the UK. You'd be looked down on somewhat for using glottal stops in court, but probably not in the office because offices aren't that formal. It's less noticeable at the end of a word, though. Words like "bottle" vary in register from lower [bɔʔʊu̯] up to higher [bɒtʰɫ̩] in london english for example. Unless you consider that a dialect instead of a register... i mean the boundary between those is fuzzy at best.

[Salmoneus]

I would say it's a register difference, at least in the UK. You'd be looked down on somewhat for using glottal stops in court, but probably not in the office because offices aren't that formal. It's less noticeable at the end of a word, though. Words like "bottle" vary in register from lower [bɔʔʊu̯] up to higher [bɒtʰɫ̩] in london english for example. Unless you consider that a dialect instead of a register... i mean the boundary between those is fuzzy at best.

For once, I agree with you!
Yes, for me and people I know, much glottalisation is register-based. Well, context-based, at least - it's probably not purely based on register per se. But for me, I do tend to glottalise things in less clear [more informal, lower register, less emphasised, non-disambiguating, more rapid, etc] speech and not in the opposite.

Although I'm not sure I ever actually glottalise 'bottle' and the like (i.e. before syllabic /l/, though I do before syllabic /n/ and in other contexts). Most of my glottalisation is also probably glottal reinforcement and non-release rather than pure replacement by glottal stops. But yeah.

[spanick]

Perhaps it is a U.K./US difference. I tend to agree with Travis...I use glottalizarion is most contexts, even high register ones. Whereas I would actually enunciate a aspirated /t/ when being particularly emphatic or clear. That may include more high register situations, but I only think of it as adding emphasis while vocab and grammar govern register.

[Travis B.]

Perhaps it is a U.K./US difference. I tend to agree with Travis...I use glottalizarion is most contexts, even high register ones. Whereas I would actually enunciate a aspirated /t/ when being particularly emphatic or clear. That may include more high register situations, but I only think of it as adding emphasis while vocab and grammar govern register.

To me at least (pre)glottalization or non-release is a key part of how fortis and lenis obstruents are distinguished, regardless of register; without it, in many cases vowel length would literally be the only thing keeping fortis and lenis obstruents apart. (This is why non-native speakers who neither preglottalize nor non-release and who lack vowel length allophony can be so confusing.)

[ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪]

I'll post fragments for transcriptions and this what I produced:
hear about you
got a lot out of
Are we waiting or wading?
we're going to beat him
[ˈhɪːɹ̠ʷəˈbaʊ̯̽ʔt͡ʃʷə]
[ˈɡɔ̞ɾəˌlɔ̞ˈɾaʊ̯̽ɾə]
[ˈɑ̟ːˌwiˈwɛɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋˌɔ̽ːˈwe̞ːɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋ]
[ˌwɪːˈɡɔˑɪ̟̯̃ŋəˈbiɾɪ̃m]
Does this sound kind of natively or do I have to speak to my friends less understandably?

[Qxentio]

Does this sound kind of natively or do I have to speak to my friends less understandably?

You really seem to enjoy making complex phonetic notations with the IPA. This becomes difficult to realize or imagine for the average user of this board, or so I believe.
This type of question is more easily answered by providing an audio recording of your speech.

[Travis B.]

I'll post fragments for transcriptions and this what I produced:
hear about you
got a lot out of
Are we waiting or wading?
we're going to beat him
[ˈhɪːɹ̠ʷəˈbaʊ̯̽ʔt͡ʃʷə]
[ˈɡɔ̞ɾəˌlɔ̞ˈɾaʊ̯̽ɾə]
[ˈɑ̟ːˌwiˈwɛɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋˌɔ̽ːˈwe̞ːɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋ]
[ˌwɪːˈɡɔˑɪ̟̯̃ŋəˈbiɾɪ̃m]
Does this sound kind of natively or do I have to speak to my friends less understandably?

What kind of variety are you attempting to emulate? I just ask because what you write here is neither GA nor RP, due to flapping combined with non-rhoticity.

[ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪]

I'll post fragments for transcriptions and this what I produced:
hear about you
got a lot out of
Are we waiting or wading?
we're going to beat him
[ˈhɪːɹ̠ʷəˈbaʊ̯̽ʔt͡ʃʷə]
[ˈɡɔ̞ɾəˌlɔ̞ˈɾaʊ̯̽ɾə]
[ˈɑ̟ːˌwiˈwɛɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋˌɔ̽ːˈwe̞ːɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋ]
[ˌwɪːˈɡɔˑɪ̟̯̃ŋəˈbiɾɪ̃m]
Does this sound kind of natively or do I have to speak to my friends less understandably?

What kind of variety are you attempting to emulate? I just ask because what you write here is neither GA nor RP, due to flapping combined with non-rhoticity.

*blushes* ...Kind of Australian?
EDIT: A little comment: I chose Australian because I am used to not producing syllable-final /r/ and I like vowel length distinction. If I was misinformed that flapping occurs in AusE, what a pity. I also chose [e̞ːɪ̟̯] vs. [ɛɪ̟̯] to keep being understood by friends with [ɛj]; [ɑ̟ː] and [ɪː] because of an imitation of RP I tried to use before.

[Sumelic]

I've heard that some British non-rhotic accents have a limited amount of t-flapping/tapping, but I don't think it's as extensive as Diego shows. See this post on John Wells' blog: http://phonetic-blog.blogspot.com/2010/12/t-to-r.html and the comments; it seems to generally only be a possibility after a short vowel.

I put the primary stress in "got a lot out of" on "lot", not on "out". I guess I could flip it in some contexts, though.

[Znex]

I'll post fragments for transcriptions and this what I produced:
hear about you
got a lot out of
Are we waiting or wading?
we're going to beat him
[ˈhɪːɹ̠ʷəˈbaʊ̯̽ʔt͡ʃʷə]
[ˈɡɔ̞ɾəˌlɔ̞ˈɾaʊ̯̽ɾə]
[ˈɑ̟ːˌwiˈwɛɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋˌɔ̽ːˈwe̞ːɪ̟̯ɾɪ̃ˑŋ]
[ˌwɪːˈɡɔˑɪ̟̯̃ŋəˈbiɾɪ̃m]
Does this sound kind of natively or do I have to speak to my friends less understandably?

What kind of variety are you attempting to emulate? I just ask because what you write here is neither GA nor RP, due to flapping combined with non-rhoticity.

*blushes* ...Kind of Australian?
EDIT: A little comment: I chose Australian because I am used to not producing syllable-final /r/ and I like vowel length distinction. If I was misinformed that flapping occurs in AusE, what a pity. I also chose [e̞ːɪ̟̯] vs. [ɛɪ̟̯] to keep being understood by friends with [ɛj]; [ɑ̟ː] and [ɪː] because of an imitation of RP I tried to use before.

No, flapping does tend to occur in AuE (particularly among young men and younger and in lower registers). You're not too far off from how an Aussie would sound, although let me show you how I would say them:

hear about you ['hɪə̯(ɻə)bao̯ʔtʃʷʏ̥]
got a lot out of ['gɔɾəˌɫɔ'ɾao̯ɾə(v)]
Are we waiting or wading? [əˌwiˑ'wɛɪ̯tʰɪ̃ŋʔõ'wɛˑɪdɪ̃ŋ] (< such a sentence would suggest the need for a higher register for these words, hence the change)
we're going to beat him [ˌweˑ'gɔ̃nə'biˑɾm̩]

[ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪]

No, flapping does tend to occur in AuE (particularly among young men and younger and in lower registers). You're not too far off from how an Aussie would sound, although let me show you how I would say them:
hear about you ['hɪə̯(ɻə)bao̯ʔtʃʷʏ̥]
got a lot out of ['gɔɾəˌɫɔ'ɾao̯ɾə(v)]
Are we waiting or wading? [əˌwiˑ'wɛɪ̯tʰɪ̃ŋʔõ'wɛˑɪdɪ̃ŋ] (< such a sentence would suggest the need for a higher register for these words, hence the change)
we're going to beat him [ˌweˑ'gɔ̃nə'biˑɾm̩]

Thank you, but:
1. How is the difference between where and we're kept?
2. Is initial /l/ velarised?
3. Does the FACE vowel begin with [æ] or [ɛ]?
And, additionally, some more curiosity: is going to first vowel the LOT/CLOTH sound?

[Znex]

No, flapping does tend to occur in AuE (particularly among young men and younger and in lower registers). You're not too far off from how an Aussie would sound, although let me show you how I would say them:
hear about you ['hɪə̯(ɻə)bao̯ʔtʃʷʏ̥]
got a lot out of ['gɔɾəˌɫɔ'ɾao̯ɾə(v)]
Are we waiting or wading? [əˌwiˑ'wɛɪ̯tʰɪ̃ŋʔõ'wɛˑɪdɪ̃ŋ] (< such a sentence would suggest the need for a higher register for these words, hence the change)
we're going to beat him [ˌweˑ'gɔ̃nə'biˑɾm̩]

Thank you, but:
1. How is the difference between where and we're kept?
2. Is initial /l/ velarised?
3. Does the FACE vowel begin with [æ] or [ɛ]?
And, additionally, some more curiosity: is going to first vowel the LOT/CLOTH sound?

1. It isn't really, but I can't think of a situation where you could conceivably confuse the two words in conversation; the syntax for both words is very different. Spelling is another matter.
2. Usually, yes. Some Aussies even use a velar lateral approximant.
3. Depends on which Australian dialect you speak. I speak something of a cross between what are called Cultivated AuE and General AuE, so I will generally say [ɛɪ̯], but I have said [æɪ̯], and I know people who say [æɪ̯].
Extra. Yes, going to tends to reduce to gonna in colloquial AuE, with the LOT/CLOTH vowel; though as Wiktionary reminds me, the vowel can often be reduced further to a schwa: [gənə]. It's reduced similarly in some other English dialects; the American eye dialect spelling can be "gunna" for instance.

[ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪]

And what about all the mess Wikipedia tells about KIT and FLEECE vowels ( and [ɪi̯])?
I hope it's my very last question.

[Znex]

And what about all the mess Wikipedia tells about KIT and FLEECE vowels ( and [ɪi̯])?
I hope it's my very last question.

The KIT vowel is definitely much less centralised in AuE than in some other dialects, although it's still distinct from ; it's still a lower vowel at least.
eg. "kit" [kʰɪt̚] vs. "funny" ['fɐni]

The FLEECE vowel shifts similarly to the FACE vowel; in Cultivated and General AuE, it remains [ɪi̯], but in Broad AuE, it becomes more like [əɪ̯].

[Ryusenshi]

flapping combined with non-rhoticity.

I would do this, but only when I'm singing.

[Travis B.]

And what about all the mess Wikipedia tells about KIT and FLEECE vowels ( and [ɪi̯])?
I hope it's my very last question.

The KIT vowel is definitely much less centralised in AuE than in some other dialects, although it's still distinct from ; it's still a lower vowel at least.
eg. "kit" [kʰɪt̚] vs. "funny" ['fɐni]

The FLEECE vowel shifts similarly to the FACE vowel; in Cultivated and General AuE, it remains [ɪi̯], but in Broad AuE, it becomes more like [əɪ̯].

The idea of having no cardinal closed front vowel in stressed syllables is rather, well, interesting to me, to say the very least.

[Znex]

And what about all the mess Wikipedia tells about KIT and FLEECE vowels ( and [ɪi̯])?
I hope it's my very last question.

The KIT vowel is definitely much less centralised in AuE than in some other dialects, although it's still distinct from ; it's still a lower vowel at least.
eg. "kit" [kʰɪt̚] vs. "funny" ['fɐni]

The FLEECE vowel shifts similarly to the FACE vowel; in Cultivated and General AuE, it remains [ɪi̯], but in Broad AuE, it becomes more like [əɪ̯].

The idea of having no cardinal closed front vowel in stressed syllables is rather, well, interesting to me, to say the very least.

To be fair, Australian English tends to work by vowel length phonemically, despite the vowel quality difference for the high vowels; so [ɪ] technically is actually /i/, whereas [ɪi̯] is /i:/.

[Travis B.]

turn
tune
twenty
two
between
restaurant
factory
mystery
yesterday
sister
mister

[Zaarin]

turn [tʰɹ̩ˁn]
two [tʰu]
tune [tʰun]
twenty [tʰwɛn(t)i]
between [bɪˈtʰwin] (somewhat oddly, I'm quite positive I do not flap the /t/ here)
restaurant [ˈrɛstˌɹ̱ˁɑnt̚~ˈrɛstˌɹ̱ˁɒnt̚]
factory [ˈfæktɹ̱ˁi]
mystery [ˈmɪstɹ̱ˁi]
yesterday [ˈjɛstʰɹ̩ˁˌdɛɪ̯]
sister [ˈsɪstʰɹ̩ˁ]
mister [ˈmɪstʰɹ̩ˁ]

[Sumelic]

turn [tʰɚ̃ːn]
two [tʰʉː]
tune [tʰʉ̃ːn]
twenty [ˈtʷʰw̥ɛ̃ɾ̃i], [ˈtʷʰw̥ɛ̃ntʰi]
between [bəˈtʷʰw̥ĩːn]~[bɪˈtʷʰw̥ĩːn]
restaurant [ˈɹɛstɹɑ̃nt]

I don't really know exactly how the /str/ cluster here is pronounced. I definitely don't have [ʃtɹ], here or in words like "strike".
I think in "strike" I have some affrication of the /t/, but perhaps not as much as in "tricycle", and I think I have even less in "restaurant"
because the /t/ is not before a stressed syllable. Nonetheless, I think I do hear a bit of affrication after the /t/, so possibly
[ˈɹɛst͡ʃɹɑ̃nt] would be just as accurate a transcription.

factory [ˈfaktɚi]
mystery [ˈmɪstɚi]
yesterday [ˈjɛstɚdeɪ̯]
sister [ˈsɪstɚ]
mister [ˈmɪstɚ]

I definitely don't have [ʃ] in any of the above either, and I also am pretty sure I don't have any affrication of the /t/. However, maybe the [s] is palatalized a bit. I can't really tell.

Probably, my accent doesn't have much of what you're looking for.

[Travis B.]

Here are what I have:

These words have palatalization of /t/, and frequently have affrication of /t/ as [tɕʰ], in my dialect, even though I personally (atypically) do not affricate /t/ in them,

turn [tʲʰʁ̩̃(ː)(n)]
tune [tʲʰʉ̃(ː)(n)]
twenty [ˈtʲʰwʌ̃ɾ̃i(ː)]~[ˈtʲʰwʌ̃ːĩ̯]

This word has palatalization of /t/, and frequently have affrication of /t/, in my dialect; I used to, again, atypically not affricate /t/ in this word, but at some point along the way I started frequently affricating it, but with an odd [tsʲʰ] realization rather than the expected [tɕʰ].

two [tʲʰʉ̯u(ː)]~[tsʲʰʉ̯u(ː)]

I just included this word to see if anyone had anything going on with word-internal /tw/ clusters. I have just have palatalization alone here, and I have not heard any noticeable affrication from anyone around here in this word.

between [pɘˈtʲʰwĩ(ː)(n)]

These are words that indisputably have affrication and palatalization of /t/, and if preceded by /s/ oftentimes palatalization of that too, in my dialect. Everyone here has the affrication and palatalization of /t/ here, such that it sounds very odd to hear speakers of other English varieties who do not have this. (Note that unlike many other English varieties, the dialect here does not have syncope in these words.)

restaurant [ˈʁʷɜɕtɕʁ̩ːʁɑ̃ʔ]
factory [ˈfɛʔktɕʁ̩ːʁi(ː)]
mystery [ˈmɘɕtɕʁ̩ːʁi(ː)]

These I included because in my idiolect I have affrication of /t/, palatalization of /st/, and much of the time subsequent reduction. However, I have kind of learned that these are not normal pronunciations of these words even in my dialect, and thus when speaking more carefully I opt to use pronunciations more in line with what others here use.

yesterday [ˈjɜɕtɕʁ̩ːɾe(ː)]~[ˈjɜɕːʁ̩ːɾe(ː)] (normally [ˈjɜsʲtʲʁ̩ːɾe(ː)]~[ˈjɜsʲːʁ̩ːɾe(ː)])
sister [ˈsɘɕtɕʁ̩(ː)~[ˈsɘɕːʁ̩(ː)] (normally [ˈsɘsʲtʲʁ̩(ː)~[ˈsɘsʲːʁ̩(ː)])
mister [ˈmɘɕtɕʁ̩(ː)~[ˈmɘɕːʁ̩(ː)] (normally [ˈmɘsʲtʲʁ̩(ː)~[ˈmɘsʲːʁ̩(ː)])

[linguoboy]

resuscitate

I just realised I have [ɛ] for the stressed antepenultimate vowel.

[Zaarin]

resuscitate [ɹ̠ˁʷɪˈsɐsɪˌtʰɛɪ̯t̚]

[Travis B.]

resuscitate [ʁʷɘˈsʌsɘˌtʰeʔ]

[Qxentio]

turn [tʰɛɹn ~ tʰɚn]
tune [tʰʊ͜un]
twenty [ˈtʰwɛ.ni]
two [tʰʊ͜u]
between [bəˈtʰwiːn]
restaurant [ɹɛs.t͡ɕɹɑˑn]
factory [ˈfæˑk.t͡ɕɹi ~ ˈfæˑk.tʰᵊɹi]
mystery [ˈmɪs.t͡ɕɹi ~ ˈmɪs.k.tʰᵊɹi]
yesterday [ˈjɛs.tə.dɛ͡i ~ ˈjɛs.t͡ɕɚ.dɛ͡i]
sister [ˈsɪs.tə ~ ˈsɪs.t͡ɕɚ]
mister [ˈmɪs.tə ~ ˈmɪs.t͡ɕɚ]
Oh man, my pronunciation is all over the place. Especially rhoticity is an issue.