The "How do You Pronounce X" Thread

[Travis B.]

Still, it would require the original realization to be /kɔː.ɪ.nɔr/ or such.

* * *

How would you pronounce “Urquhart”?

Note that many English English dialects have the shift of /ʊr/ to [ɔː(ɹ)] as opposed to the shift of it to [uɹ] found in some NAE dialects such as my own.

As for Urquhart, that name is not native to my dialect, so I really have no particular way I pronounce it.

[Matrix]

[ˈɹ̩kəhaɹʔ]

[Mâq Lar]

Urquhart - rhymes with 'work it' but without the /w/ (can't type ipa at the moment for the exact pronunciation)

[jmcd]

[ʉːɾxʍɔʔ]

[Pole, the]

Urquhart - rhymes with 'work it' but without the /w/ (can't type ipa at the moment for the exact pronunciation)

/ˈɜrkɪt/?

[Sumelic]

/ˈɜrwɔrt/? Assuming this is quh as in "quhat."

How about:
sacrilegious
otiosity

[schyrsivochter]

sacrilegious [ˌsæ.kɻ̊ɪ̈.ˈlë.d͡ʒəs]
otiosity [ɜɵ̯.ʃɪ.ˈɒ.sɪ̈.tɪ]

Image of the IPA:

More: show

Unbenannt.PNG (2.11 KiB) Viewed 4972 times

[Travis B.]

sacreligious: /ˈsækrəˈlɪdʒəs/ [ˈsɛkʁəːˈʟ̞ɘːtʃɘs]
otiosity: /ˈoʊʃiˌɑsɪti/ [ˈoˌʃjasɘɾiː] (Note this is not a native pronunciation but rather how I would render the standard pronunciation of this word in my idiolect's phonology.)

[Sumelic]

Thanks both of you. I also was wondering recently about the pronunciation of the following words and phrases:

Atlantis
Atlantic
Atlanta
atlas
at least
Etna

[Nortaneous]

Atlantis /ətlæntɪs/ [əʔˈɫeə̯ɾ̃ɪs]
Atlantic /ətlæntɪk/ [əʔˈɫeə̯ɾ̃ɪʔk]
Atlanta /ətlæntə/ [əʔˈɫeə̯ɾ̃ə]
atlas /ætləs/ [ˈæʔɫəs]
at least /ət list/ [əʔˈɫɪi̯st]
Etna /ɛtnə/ [ˈɛʔnə]

[finlay]

Still, it would require the original realization to be /kɔː.ɪ.nɔr/ or such.

* * *

How would you pronounce “Urquhart”?

I had a teacher with this name - we said /ərkərt/

[Zaarin]

Atlantis [ætˈlæntɪs]
Atlantic [ætˈlæntɪk]
Atlanta [ætˈlæntə]
atlas [ˈætləs]
at least [ˌæt ˈlist]
Etna [ˈɛʔnə], or [ˈɛtnə] in careful speech

[Travis B.]

Atlantis: /ætˈlæntəs/ [ɛɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ntɘs] ~ /ætˈlæntəs/ [ɛɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ɘs] ~ /ətˈlæntəs/ [ɘɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ɘs] (This probably reflects this word being spoken more carefully than Atlantic or Atlanta.)
Atlantic: /ætˈlæntək/ [ɛɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ɘʔk] ~ /ətˈlæntək/ [ɘɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ɘʔk]
Atlanta: /ætˈlæntə/ [ɛɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ə(ː)] ~ /ətˈlæntə/ [ɘɾˈʟ̞ɛ̃ɾ̃ə(ː)]
atlas: /ˈætləs/ [ˈɛʔɰɘs]
at least: /ˌæt ˈlis/ [ˌɛʔ ˈʟ̞is]
Etna: /ˈɛtnə/ [ˈɜʔnə(ː)]

[alynnidalar]

I believe something akin to:

Atlantis [eə̯ʔˈlẽə̯nɪs]
Atlantic [eə̯ʔˈlẽə̯nɪk]
Atlanta [eə̯ʔˈlẽə̯nə̩]
atlas [ˈeə̯ʔləs]
at least [eə̯ʔˈli:s] or [eə̯ˈli:s]
Etna [ˈɛʔnə]

My /æ/ is closer to [eə̯] in most cases, and many/most of my /t/s are either glottal stops or disappear entirely.

EDIT: Now I'm second-guessing myself. When speaking quickly, my /æ/ might be even higher, sometimes it's sounding as high as [ɪə]. But I'm not sure if that's just the observer effect and I'm emphasizing the diphthong unintentionally.

[schyrsivochter]

Atlantis /ət.ˈlæn.tɪs/ [ətˡ.ˈl̥æ̈n.tʰɘs]
Atlantic /ət.ˈlæn.tɪk/ [ətˡ.ˈl̥æ̈n.tʰɪ̈k]
Atlanta /ət.ˈlæn.tə/ [ətˡ.ˈl̥æ̈n.tʰə]
atlas /ˈæt.ləs/ [at.l̥əs]
at least /æt ˈliːst/ [ɐtˡˈl̥ɪ̯istʰ]
Etna /ɛtnə/ [ˈɛ̈tⁿ.nə]

More: show

Rendering of the IPA in a proper Unicode font

Unbenannt.PNG (8.83 KiB) Viewed 4899 times

[Travis B.]

at least [eə̯ʔˈli:s] or [eə̯ˈli:s]

You have phonemic vowel length over in Michigan?

I thought that phonemic vowel length had largely died out in North America, so it is quite interesting if you do.

[alynnidalar]

at least [eə̯ʔˈli:s] or [eə̯ˈli:s]

You have phonemic vowel length over in Michigan?

I thought that phonemic vowel length had largely died out in North America, so it is quite interesting if you do.

I don't think it's phonemic for me, just phonetic.

[Travis B.]

at least [eə̯ʔˈli:s] or [eə̯ˈli:s]

You have phonemic vowel length over in Michigan?

I thought that phonemic vowel length had largely died out in North America, so it is quite interesting if you do.

I don't think it's phonemic for me, just phonetic.

If one has longer vowels for /aɪ eɪ iː ɑː aʊ ɔː ɔɪ oʊ uː/ than for /æ ɛ ɪ ɐ ə ɨ ɒ ʊ/ assuming equal stress and the same following consonants, and after one takes vowel mergers into account (such as that of /ɑː ɒ/) , then one has phonemic vowel length.

Allophonic vowel length in North American English and some other varieties is conditioned by stress and following consonants, with following fortis obstruents conditioning shorter vowels and the lack of them conditioning longer vowels (or following lenis obstruents conditioning longer vowels and the lack of them conditioning shorter vowels, the details depending on the exact variety). Note that allophonic vowel length is not incompatible with phonemic vowel length; e.g. English English varieties typically have both on top of one another.

What is interesting, though, is that you say that you do not have phonemic vowel length, yet you have a long vowel in an environment that would be decidedly short in any variety where the primary source of vowel length is allophonic vowel length, and I know of no English variety where coda /s/ conditions a longer vowel.

[alynnidalar]

I'm curious why you wouldn't expect <least>, particularly when it's stressed, to have a long vowel? I don't have a physical dictionary at hand, but I checked a couple of online ones that use the IPA and they both agreed it's a long vowel.

[Travis B.]

I'm curious why you wouldn't expect <least>, particularly when it's stressed, to have a long vowel? I don't have a physical dictionary at hand, but I checked a couple of online ones that use the IPA and they both agreed it's a long vowel.

Dictionaries, when they do use IPA*, typically mark historical phonemic vowel length, by the way. And least does historically have a long vowel. (Note that dictionaries practically never mark allophonic vowel length, for obvious reasons.)

Why I would expect least to have a short vowel is that in English varieties with allophonic vowel length, e.g. most North American English varieties, coda /s/, being a fortis obstruent, normally conditions a short vowel. (Scottish English has allophonic vowel length, but has somewhat different rules from NAE, but that is irrelevant here.)

That is why it is interesting that you have a long vowel in least, which indicates that you probably do have phonemic vowel length.

As for vowels being long versus short, being long versus short is independent of stress, even though stress affects length, in that a short vowel in a stressed syllable is longer than a short vowel in an unstressed syllable while stressed syllables can contain both short and long vowels.

* Many dictionaries do not use IPA, and mark pronunciation in ways that are ambiguous with regard to vowel length versus vowel quality.

[jal]

That is why it is interesting that you have a long vowel in least, which indicates that you probably do have phonemic vowel length.

Don't you have a long vowel in "lease", "sees" or "beast"?


JAL

[Travis B.]

That is why it is interesting that you have a long vowel in least, which indicates that you probably do have phonemic vowel length.

Don't you have a long vowel in "lease", "sees" or "beast"?

I have a long vowel in sees, since it postvocalically has /z/, a lenis obstruent, but I have a short vowel in lease and beast, since they postvocalically have /s/ and /st/, both of which consist of fortis obstruents.

[finlay]

how about liz, sis and pissed

answers on a spectrogram plz

also freeze just to cover some bases.

[Travis B.]

how about liz, sis and pissed

answers on a spectrogram plz

also freeze just to cover some bases.

Liz and freeze have long vowels, and sis and pissed have short vowels for me.

And no, I am not going to provide spectrograms, unless you can find a piece of spectrogram software that has a Debian package that will install under Debian testing for me.

[finlay]

http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/download_linux.html