Potential vowel inventory:
[a e i o u]
[ɛ ɪ ɔ ʊ]
[ɨ ɪ̈ ɘ ɜ]
Having never used central vowels much in my conlangs, does this vowel inventory have an unrealistic number of them?
Too many central vowels?
Too many central vowels?
AKA Benjaburns
Re: Too many central vowels?
No. It's kind of an odd selection of central vowels, though.
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- Avisaru
- Posts: 704
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- Location: NY, USA
Re: Too many central vowels?
Let's reorganize a bit
Front: iɪeɛ
Cent: ɨɪ̈ɘɜ
Back: uʊoɔ
and /a/ goes somewhere.
A bit Englishy with all the ɪʊ business but it doesn't seem horribly imbalanced. You could probably make a case for it being real enough. The biggest problem I can see is the /ɪ̈/ and keeping a contrast with it and its 4 neighbors. Maybe spread it out a bit more to /ɨ ɘ ɜ ä/ in the center and have /a/ be very front. (Not very back; more back than front is impossible/very rare)
Also → C&CQ
Front: iɪeɛ
Cent: ɨɪ̈ɘɜ
Back: uʊoɔ
and /a/ goes somewhere.
A bit Englishy with all the ɪʊ business but it doesn't seem horribly imbalanced. You could probably make a case for it being real enough. The biggest problem I can see is the /ɪ̈/ and keeping a contrast with it and its 4 neighbors. Maybe spread it out a bit more to /ɨ ɘ ɜ ä/ in the center and have /a/ be very front. (Not very back; more back than front is impossible/very rare)
Also → C&CQ
Re: Too many central vowels?
@Bob: notice how Das Baron actually has them all in brackets, not slashes. I wonder if that was intentional?
Re: Too many central vowels?
I'll say that the point of having too many central vowels is when you cannot readily distinguish between them.
If you cannot make a difference between, say, /mɨˤkə/ and /mɘˤkə/, you'll probably interchangeably use "feces" and "candy" inside the language itself
If you cannot make a difference between, say, /mɨˤkə/ and /mɘˤkə/, you'll probably interchangeably use "feces" and "candy" inside the language itself
Warning: Recovering bilingual, attempting trilinguaility. Knowledge of French left behind in childhood. Currently repairing bilinguality. Repair stalled. Above content may be a touch off.
Re: Too many central vowels?
Swedish seems to manage fine with several central vowels, although one of our resident Swedes should really confirm or deny this.
Zompist's Markov generator wrote:it was labelled" orange marmalade," but that is unutterably hideous.
- Skomakar'n
- Smeric
- Posts: 1273
- Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:05 pm
Re: Too many central vowels?
And most of us don't even have a schwa.
Online dictionary for my conlang Vanga: http://royalrailway.com/tungumaalMiin/Vanga/
#undef FEMALE
I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688
Of an Ernst'ian one.
#undef FEMALE
I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688
Of an Ernst'ian one.
Re: Too many central vowels?
The number, no. [ɪ ɪ̈ ɨ] seem awfully close together though.Das Baron wrote:Potential vowel inventory:
[a e i o u]
[ɛ ɪ ɔ ʊ]
[ɨ ɪ̈ ɘ ɜ]
(Also, if the grouping implies that [ɛ ɔ] are laxed, that's rather Englishy.)
Re: Too many central vowels?
I think this is close to fine. It seems Germanic to me. Are there tense/lax or short/long pairs?Das Baron wrote:Potential vowel inventory:
[a e i o u]
[ɛ ɪ ɔ ʊ]
[ɨ ɪ̈ ɘ ɜ]
Having never used central vowels much in my conlangs, does this vowel inventory have an unrealistic number of them?
For example, if you grouped them thusly:
/i/ /ɪ/
/e/ /ɛ/
/a/
/o/ /ɔ/
/u/ /ʊ/
/ɨ/ /ɪ̈/
/ɘ/ /ɜ/
Then you'd effectively have German but with central instead of front rounded vowels. Adding a length, closed/open syllable, or tenseness distinction would help differentiate the series.
Another arrangement that's similar would be:
/i/ /ɪ/
/e/ /ɛ/
/a/ /ɐ/ (instead of /ɜ/)
/o/ /ɔ/
/u/ /ʊ/
/ɨ/ /ɪ̈/
/ə/ (instead of /ɘ/, unstressed syllables only)
If you're going for all monophthongs of the same length, then I think you're not likely to get much more complex than:
/i e ɛ a ɔ o u ɨ ɘ ɜ/
Most languages that I've seen that have the lax high vowels are the results of length/stress distinctions rather than part of the basic arrangement of vowels.