accents

[Torco]

I suppose I'm not such a great voice actor after all
oh, well, I'll have to seek a carreer in hand modelling, then.

Duuude, you even pronounced lenited /ʝ/ as [ʒ], or is that a Chilean lower class thing too?

its more retroflex, but yeah.

also, that is one tiny ass shrimp

[Ser]

Haha, the things we do to other languages. Thankfully Spanish has a fairly logical orthography, otherwise I could be murdering it, lol.

Yes, English is an enormous headache in regards to reading pronunciations... stressed <o>, followed by a consonant that's not /r/ in what seems to be a closed syllable, generally represents the /ɑ/ vowel (in Vancouver English), as in "object, occidental, pox, lost, hot, soft, rock"... except in those few words that hide from view until you pass by, when they stab you in the back: "host, most, ghost, post".

[Travis B.]

Haha, the things we do to other languages. Thankfully Spanish has a fairly logical orthography, otherwise I could be murdering it, lol.

Yes, English is an enormous headache in regards to reading pronunciations... stressed <o>, followed by a consonant that's not /r/ in what seems to be a closed syllable, generally represents the /ɑ/ vowel (in Vancouver English), as in "object, occidental, pox, lost, hot, soft, rock"... except in those few words that hide from view until you pass by, when they stab you in the back: "host, most, ghost, post".

You are lucky that you are using a variety of North American English that is cot-caught-merged, as lost and soft are actually CLOTH words, and hence have /ɔ/ (typically opened to [ɒ]) rather than /ɑ/ in unmerged NAE varieties.

[ol bofosh]

Two birds with one stone, I wash my hair and go fishing, lol.

Or you get a haircut, even. xD

But, but, but... you'll take away my strength!!!

also, that is one tiny ass shrimp Iberian Crayfish.

Yes, it's one of the small ones.

I thank my lucky stars that I grew up with English and learnt that "this letter is silent" and "that letter is said z even though it is written with a t", you know, crazy stuff like that. The day I came home and said "Mum, there's a lesson called Skyence." She'll never forget that, I think. Oh, and Peugeot, which was Pyoo-jyot.

[Thry]

While we, in Spain, were with the /b/ plus /a/ makes /ba/, you were with the <o> plus <o> makes /u/ moooo.

[ol bofosh]

Flood. Blood.

Can be /u/. Might be /ʌ/.

There's probably some study somewhere that with such a creative/crazy orthography that anglophone brains have more interesting neural connections.

[Ser]

You are lucky that you are using a variety of North American English that is cot-caught-merged, as lost and soft are actually CLOTH words, and hence have /ɔ/ (typically opened to [ɒ]) rather than /ɑ/ in unmerged NAE varieties.

Yeah, let alone varieties without the father-bother merger. I honestly feel sorry for any Spanish speaker trying to master London English... I wouldn't like to deal with the distinction of all /ɔː, ɒ, ɑː/, all while dealing with tons of readings pronunciations where, actually, historical /a/s randomly became /ɑː/ and /ɔ/s randomly failed to lower to /ɒ/ by joining /ɔː/ instead...

I thank my lucky stars that I grew up with English and learnt that "this letter is silent" and "that letter is said z even though it is written with a t", you know, crazy stuff like that. The day I came home and said "Mum, there's a lesson called Skyence." She'll never forget that, I think. Oh, and Peugeot, which was Pyoo-jyot.

Just FYI plenty of North American speakers actually pronounce it "pyoo-JOH" or "PYOO-joh". (The NAE equivalent of your /ɵː/ is generally [ɵ ˞] [8`], after all.)

you were with the <o> plus <o> makes /u/ moooo.

...Except when it doesn't, as in "book" or "blood"...... Or "cooperation"...

There's probably some study somewhere that with such a creative/crazy orthography that anglophone brains have more interesting neural connections.

Nah, I'd like to know about literate Tibetans or Tamils instead. Now those are some obscure orthographies. Or Latin speakers in northern Spain during the 10th-11th centuries...

[Thry]

...Except when it doesn't, as in "book" or "blood"......

book is u-like enough to be well-behaved. blood shall be split because of the floods, nevertheless.

[Imralu]

...Except when it doesn't, as in "book" or "blood"......

book is u-like enough to be well-behaved. blood shall be split because of the floods, nevertheless.

/U/ may sound more like /u:/ than /V/ does, but they are still phonemically different. Mix them up and we'll notice straight away.

[Torco]

also, that is one tiny ass shrimp Iberian Crayfish.

iz shrimp!
i can haz it? wants to eat it! my preciousss

[Ser]

Oh? Could I beg you to record a comparison between your Vancouverite Spanish accent and your Salvadoran Spanish accents?

I said a Vancouver English accent in Spanish.

Yes, thats what I said.

If i ever say Vancouverite in relation to language, be assured that I mean that the Vancouverite is L1 English speaking.

I don't know what could be interesting about that though... Just shove Spanish words into English phonotactics, really. Like splitting almost all the rising diphthongs (fiesta [ˈfjesta] > [fɪjˈɛstə], since English hardly has any, other than [jʊw]), aspirating many /p t tʃ k/ (tachar [taˈtʃaɾ] > [tʰəˈtʃʰɑɚ] or [ˌtʰɑˈtʃʰɑɚ]), nasalizing vowels before nasal consonants (pregunto [pɾeˈɣ̞unto] > [pɹ̥ɪ.ˈgʊ̃w̃n(ˌtʰ)oʊ]), etc.

[Seamus]

I currently live in Soth Dakota and I speak with an Upper Midwestern Accent. I live in the West River part of the state and my accent is more closer to a Wyoming accent than a Minnesota accent. Before I lived in South Dakota, I lived in Ohio for several years. However since I moved to South Dakota right before I hit puberty (I was 12), I've been told I sound like I've been living in South Dakota my whole life. My family is kind of wierd because we all talk different. My mom is from California and my dad is from Pennsylvania and they still retain the accents of their home states. My older sister on the other hand hit puberty when she we still lived in Ohio and therefore her accent is more of an Ohio accent than a South Dakota accent like mine. Because of my sister's and my experience I believe in the theory that you are stuck forever with the accent you hit puberty with. Look at my grandma. She came to the United States from Ireland when she was seventeen and still has a pretty heavy Irish accent.

I can do many accents (some well and some not that well). I can do a California (Northern) accent considering I was born in San Francisco and I could also do a New Jersey accent which is where my aunt, uncle and cousins live. I can also do a general Southern accent and a Texas accent. Foreign accents I can do include Canadian (Alberta), English, Irish, Australian, Russian, French and South African.

[ol bofosh]

Oh? Could I beg you to record a comparison between your Vancouverite Spanish accent and your Salvadoran Spanish accents?

I said a Vancouver English accent in Spanish.

Yes, thats what I said.

If i ever say Vancouverite in relation to language, be assured that I mean that the Vancouverite is L1 English speaking.

I don't know what could be interesting about that though... Just shove Spanish words into English phonotactics, really. Like splitting almost all the rising diphthongs (fiesta [ˈfjesta] > [fɪjˈɛstə], since English hardly has any, other than [jʊw]), aspirating many /p t tʃ k/ (tachar [taˈtʃaɾ] > [tʰəˈtʃʰɑɚ] or [ˌtʰɑˈtʃʰɑɚ]), nasalizing vowels before nasal consonants (pregunto [pɾeˈɣ̞unto] > [pɹ̥ɪ.ˈgʊ̃w̃n(ˌtʰ)oʊ]), etc.

You can add non-rhotic to what would happen with my accent.

Cantar - [kʰæntʰɐ:]
temer - [tʰɛmɛ:] or [tʰəmɛ:]
partir - [pʰɐ:tʰɪə]

And that's still with the same rules of emphasis.

[Ser]

Well... I don't know your dialect. *I think* London English would use /ˌkɑnˈtɑɚ/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɑː], instead of /ˌkɑnˈtɵ ˞/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɵː], but I'm not sure. I've heard plenty of Vancouverites speak Spanish though, at my uni.

[Melteor]

^^To me, there's really no justification for English phonotactics entering Spanish because Spanish prosody is so much simpler than English's.

[Travis B.]

^^To me, there's really no justification for English phonotactics entering Spanish because Spanish prosody is so much simpler than English's.

As if we could simply turn off the influence of our native English phonology just because the language we are attempting to speak happens to have a simpler phonology.

Personally, butchering Spanish in my dialect's phonology would result in:

cantar: /ˌkanˈtar/ > [ˌkʰã(n)ˈtʰɑ(ː)ʁˤ]
temer: /ˌtɛˈmer/ > [ˌtʰɛ̃ːˈmɛ̝(ː)ʁˤ] or /ˌteˈmer/ > [ˌtʰẽːˈmɛ̝(ː)ʁˤ]
partir: /ˌparˈtir/ > [ˌpʰɑʁˤˈtʰɪ(ː)ʁˤ]

That is, assuming that one did not even try to pronounce things according to Spanish phonology.

For myself the hard parts I would expect would be pronouncing /r/ (I can trill and tap on command need be, but I suck at doing it in actual speech), turning off nasalization (under special conditions in my dialect there can be [n] preceded by a unnasalized vowel, but that always involves the coalescence of a /dn/ or /dVn/ sequence), pronouncing voiceless obstruents as fortis yet voiceless (in the examples of these three words I was listening to to make sure I generally perceived the plosives as fortis even though they were unaspirated, except that I heard the [t] in temer clearly as a /d/ to my ears), turning off my phonologically conditioned vowel length, making sure my /u/ stays a back vowel, and avoiding apical/laminal and palatoalveolar/alveolopalatal alternations. I do not expect vowel qualities before /r/ to be a problem such that Spanish /r/ is so different from my native one that I do not really perceive it as equivalent.

[Astraios]

Well... I don't know your dialect. *I think* London English would use /ˌkɑnˈtɑɚ/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɑː], instead of /ˌkɑnˈtɵ ˞/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɵː], but I'm not sure.

/kæntɑ:/...

[Lyra]

Maria purisimia...

~Lyra

[Thry]

Maria purisimia...

~Lyra

Si destrossen el castellà així, què farien amb el català? QUÈ?! /k@n.t{/?

[Ser]

Well... I don't know your dialect. *I think* London English would use /ˌkɑnˈtɑɚ/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɑː], instead of /ˌkɑnˈtɵ ˞/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɵː], but I'm not sure.

/kæntɑ:/...

Hmm... /æ/... The fact that Spanish textbooks describe /a/ as "a as in father" makes many learners (with NAE as their L1 anyway) prefer /ɑ/ though.

[ol bofosh]

Well... I don't know your dialect. *I think* London English would use /ˌkɑnˈtɑɚ/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɑː], instead of /ˌkɑnˈtɵ ˞/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɵː], but I'm not sure.

/kæntɑ:/...

Hmm... /æ/... The fact that Spanish textbooks describe /a/ as "a as in father" makes many learners (with NAE as their L1 anyway) prefer /ɑ/ though.

I think Astraios was saying that "London English" would use /æ/ (presumably you were talking about RP, not Cockney or some other) My own accent would favour æ: [kʰæntʰɐ:]

[Jerian]

Hey, if anyone doesn't already know about it,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internatio ... h_dialects

is a great way to see the pronunciations, and helps with your accent. It's helped with my Australian one significantly (almost have the confidence to voice record and upload it!)

Unfortunately, it only has a few different dialects, however there may be some other version of that article.

[Ngohe]

Well... I don't know your dialect. *I think* London English would use /ˌkɑnˈtɑɚ/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɑː], instead of /ˌkɑnˈtɵ ˞/ [ˌkʰɑnˈtʰɵː], but I'm not sure.

/kæntɑ:/...

Hmm... /æ/... The fact that Spanish textbooks describe /a/ as "a as in father" makes many learners (with NAE as their L1 anyway) prefer /ɑ/ though.

The "a as in father" thing is a rough approximation; not an exact linguistic characterisation. Traditionally, there has been a variation among English dialects and speakers whether to nativise "foreign" /a/ as /æ/ or as /ɑ(ː)/. RP and some other dialects have traditionally favoured /æ/, at least in closed syllables. I'm not sure about Cockney and other non-standard Southern BE accents though.


And as for me, I'd say my L2 English is mostly based on RP-ish or (Southern) Standard BE. Maybe do some crude immitations of other accents. But I think there is limited value in people simply *writing* what accents they claim to be able to do - the real proof would be actual voice recordings (as some of you have provided). Could you pass for a native speaker? Could you sound like someone who had lived in a given region for some time? Or does your "accent" mostly consist of your own stereotypes of other language varieties?

[ol bofosh]

Hey, if anyone doesn't already know about it,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internatio ... h_dialects

is a great way to see the pronunciations, and helps with your accent. It's helped with my Australian one significantly (almost have the confidence to voice record and upload it!)

Unfortunately, it only has a few different dialects, however there may be some other version of that article.

Yes, that was a huge help to me too. Stopped me relying on RP interpretation of my vowels.
But there's nothing comprehensive about Estuary, which I find in bits and pieces around Wikipedia.

I'm not sure about Cockney and other non-standard Southern BE accents though.

Cockney I think uses /ɛ/ where I would use /æ/. When I imitate something like "thanks", that's roughly what I get. And I think I read it somewhere on Wikipedia.

The only accents I'm confident about imitating are Cockney and middle-class RP (they're present in my accent anyway). Everything else is probably stereotype.

[Ngohe]

I'm not sure about Cockney and other non-standard Southern BE accents though.

Cockney I think uses /ɛ/ where I would use /æ/. When I imitate something like "thanks", that's roughly what I get. And I think I read it somewhere on Wikipedia.

The Cockney [ɛ] is still the same phoneme as /æ/ in other English dialects, right? Just that its phonetic realisation is less open.

Everything else is probably stereotype.

[

I think I have a quite good theoretical understanding of many English accents, and I could probably pronounce many individual words (in isolation), with different accents. But I find it more difficult to read whole passages. It would feel kinda stilted and feigned. And especially when it comes to immitating NA accents, I would usually fail at the first bath-set word.