Common L2 English mistakes

[Viktor77]

My experience with Czechs, Slovaks, and Slovenes who had pretty much zilch study of the language before coming here is that, besides the whole article thing, they have trouble with contractions and strong verbs. Contractions they usually ignore until they've practiced them enough, so "I am thinking" or "I cannot do it." And with strong verbs they frequently ignored the past tense forms, usually by just substituting the present tense even though the context implied past, such as "I come from practice this morning."

[Imralu]

Speak for yourself. I've had Upper Intermediate students that have told me that that's one of the hardest things for them.

I spoke for myself? I wasn't generalising like you.

Saying "That's far from being one of the real nightmares of English" is not a generalisation?

[Drydic]

Imralu spoke to himself for himself.

[Pole, the]

Well, speaking of Imralu, he is [automatically] generalizing every time he speaks for himself.

[Astraios]

"As for me, everyone is me."

[ol bofosh]

Spain is developing its own dialect of English...

"The people is..."
"Take a photo to [of]..."
"Get up the car..." (in the car)
"Get down the car..." (out the car)
"Open to (someone)..." (let someone in/out)

I find Spanish mistakes useful for learning about Spanish grammar.

[Astraios]

"The people is..."

La gente esta muy loca.

[ol bofosh]

"The people is..."

La gente esta muy loca.

I have to keep stopping myself doing the opposite. So hey, new anglo-Spanish dialect forming, "La gente son..."

[Astraios]

It's alright, you're not learning Hebrew, where 'water' and 'sky' and 'face' and 'life' always have plural agreement, even if you only have one of each.

[ol bofosh]

It's alright, you're not learning Hebrew, where 'water' and 'sky' and 'face' and 'life' always have plural agreement, even if you only have one of each.

So, they're like mass nouns then?

Come to think of it, mass nouns in English give people difficulty.

[Astraios]

No, because mass nouns are singular.

orez lavan
rice white

but

panim levanot
face-M.PL white-F.PL

And no, I didn't mess up the gender glosses...

[ol bofosh]

No, because mass nouns are singular.

a water vs. a drop of water
a wheat vs a grain of wheat
and
some water
some wheat
?

And no, I didn't mess up the gender glosses...

Wow, how does that work?

[Astraios]

a water vs. a drop of water
a wheat vs a grain of wheat
and
some water
some wheat
?

mayim, tipat mayim, mayim
water(-M.PL), drop-FS.of water(-M.PL), water(-M.PL)
water, a drop of water, some water

Wow, how does that work?

Just a feminine noun that uses the masculine plural ending. :p

[Terra]

It's a reasonable thing to get stuck on:

We have until Friday to do this. / We have to do this by Friday. / We have to do this until Friday.

The first two mean the same, even though the first and last look like they should mean the same.

So, it looks like "until" is adding some kind of repetitive or habitual meaning to the third sentence, but I can't pinpoint why it doesn't apply to the first sentence also. But it's not just "until"; "for" does it too:

d) We have to do this for three years.
e) *We have for three to do this.
f) We have three years to do this.

Ideas?

And, if "until" or "by" marks the end point of a time frame, what marks the start point? "since"? Things don't look quite the same though:

g) We have had since Monday to do this.
h) We have had to do this since Monday.

Note the change in aspect and the lack of analog to "by". Interestingly, h) still implies some kind of repetition or habitualness though.

[Imralu]

We have until Friday to do this. = We have a continuous period of time that extends from now to Friday in order to do this.
We have to do this by Friday. = We have to do this no later than Friday.
We have to do this until Friday. = We have to do this for a continuous period of time that extends from now to Friday.

[Pole, the]

It's alright, you're not learning Hebrew, where 'water' and 'sky' and 'face' and 'life' always have plural agreement, even if you only have one of each.

Also, Polish "usta" 'mouth'.

We have until Friday to do this. = We have a continuous period of time that extends from now to Friday in order to do this.
We have to do this by Friday. = We have to do this no later than Friday.
We have to do this until Friday. = We have to do this for a continuous period of time that extends from now to Friday.

Oh, expressing the aspect on the preposition? Interesting.

[Io]

omg those 4 (four) nouns

hebrew is so kawaii :3

oh you hebrew~~

[Io]

Also, Polish "usta" 'mouth'.

Here you get the odd person using plural with уста, but it's really rare, my mother, for example, uses plurals inconsistently with it. In pretentious journalist speak you can hear при затворени врата when they talk about a hearing, discussion or whatever, it annoys the hell out of me because it's so needlessly archaic, journalists here aren't exactly known for being the most well-spoken and eloquent members of society and it just sounds bizarre to any pair of modern ears.

[Imralu]

Also, Polish "usta" 'mouth'.

Here you get the odd person using plural with уста, but it's really rare, my mother, for example, uses plurals inconsistently with it. In pretentious journalist speak you can hear при затворени врата when they talk about a hearing, discussion or whatever, it annoys the hell out of me because it's so needlessly archaic, journalists here aren't exactly known for being the most well-spoken and eloquent members of society and it just sounds bizarre to any pair of modern ears.

I feel the same about "an" before /h/ in unstressed syllables. News reports always have ridiculous phrases like "an horrific accident" or "an historic event".

As for plural nouns, English has them but generally only for things where there is something paired. I'm not aware of any arbitrarily plural nouns in German, but if I remember correctly, the Finnish word for wedding is "häät", which is plural, and I think there are others.

[ebilein]

(getting a little bit OT) Finnish plural nouns include also kasvot 'face', aivot 'brain(s)', and the more easily explicable housut 'trousers' and sakset 'scissors' for paired things. Although you could add aivot, if it's plural because (everyone) has two halfs.

I like the sound of "Figaron häät".

[Io]

Imralu, the ones Pole and I refer to are former dual forms, since we've dropped it many centuries ago уста has been retained as plural in some dialects, however I'm not aware of the same for врата.

[Qwynegold]

(getting a little bit OT) Finnish plural nouns include also kasvot 'face', aivot 'brain(s)', and the more easily explicable housut 'trousers' and sakset 'scissors' for paired things. Although you could add aivot, if it's plural because (everyone) has two halfs.

I like the sound of "Figaron häät".

Heh, I had been thinking about the word kasvot a little while ago. Weird that it's a plural. Then there's naama which also means face but which isn't plural.

[Pole, the]

Heh, I had been thinking about the word kasvot a little while ago. Weird that it's a plural. Then there's naama which also means face but which isn't plural.

Polish wrota 'gate(s)' (plurale tantum) and brama 'gate' (not a plural).

[Bryan]

Swan's "Learner English" is the go-to guide.

[Trebor]

It's a reasonable thing to get stuck on:

We have until Friday to do this. / We have to do this by Friday. / We have to do this until Friday.

The first two mean the same, even though the first and last look like they should mean the same.

So, it looks like "until" is adding some kind of repetitive or habitual meaning to the third sentence, but I can't pinpoint why it doesn't apply to the first sentence also. But it's not just "until"; "for" does it too:

d) We have to do this for three years.
e) *We have for three to do this.
f) We have three years to do this.

Ideas?

And, if "until" or "by" marks the end point of a time frame, what marks the start point? "since"? Things don't look quite the same though:

g) We have had since Monday to do this.
h) We have had to do this since Monday.

Note the change in aspect and the lack of analog to "by". Interestingly, h) still implies some kind of repetition or habitualness though.

You've hit upon one of the areas of difficulty which I especially noticed my old Arabic tutor had: how to use "for/since" and select the right tense/aspect combination. She might say things like, "We've lived here since two years."