zompist bboard

What it says on the tin. It doesn't have to be super extensive, but the more terms that better of course. I've found a smattering of vocabulary in different places with different levels of confidence, but I'm just wondering if there's somewhere that has a large collection of it in one spot. Alternately, is there a good way of back deriving it from Middle Japanese, especially in the cases that o1/o2, i1/i2, and e1/e2 have merged?

I live near a state university in the US but I don't know how much they'd help non-students, so preferably things that could be found/accessed through a public library or online would work best for me though I realize that limits things a lot.

Thanks for reading and any help ahead of time.

I only have a vocabulary list and grammar notes for Kaguya-hime, which is probably way too little to be useful to you.

Qwynegold wrote:I only have a vocabulary list and grammar notes for Kaguya-hime, which is probably way too little to be useful to you.

Actually, I'd appreciate it. If nothing else that's one of my favorite stories.

I PM'ed vampyre_smiles about my documents. If anyone else is interested, please PM your e-mail adress.

LinguistCat wrote:"Vocabulary list for Old Japanese?" What it says on the tin. It doesn't have to be super extensive, but the more terms that better of course. I've found a smattering of vocabulary in different places with different levels of confidence, but I'm just wondering if there's somewhere that has a large collection of it in one spot.

If you mean a corpus, the online Man'yōshū provided by the U of Virginia has been an excellent resource for me: http://jti.lib.virginia.edu/japanese/manyoshu/

UVA has other titles available as well, as part of their Japanese Text Initiative. Good stuff. http://jti.lib.virginia.edu/japanese/

If you mean a list of unique OJP terms, I don't have anything like that. But combine the corpus options above with an online 古語 dictionary, say the 学研全訳古語辞典 (Gakken Zen-yaku Kogo Jiten, "Entrance Exam All-Translated Old Japanese Dictionary", focusing on the OJP terms that appear in modern Japanese education) that you can access via Weblio (https://kobun.weblio.jp/), and you've got a good online setup for getting into OJP.

LinguistCat wrote:Alternately, is there a good way of back deriving it from Middle Japanese, especially in the cases that o1/o2, i1/i2, and e1/e2 have merged?

If you've studied a lot of Japanese etymologies, you can start to guess where some of these 甲乙 / Type-A, Type-B / sub-1, sub-2 distinctions might appear, such as when modern standalone terms and their bound forms (persisting in old compounds) have different vowels, like modern 神 kami (ancient kami₂) and ancient combining bound form kamu, modern 木 ki (ancient ki₂) and bound form ko (ancient ko₂), modern 目 me (ancient me₂) and bound form ma, etc. But back-derivation of the Type-A and Type-B values from later stages of the language is, I believe, not really possible. If memory serves, the e₁ / e₂ distinction, for instance, was wholly unknown to Japanese philologists until the re-discovery of 上代特殊仮名遣い (Jōdai Tokushu Kanadzukai, "Old Japanese Special Kana Spellings"), and folks had previously thought that the final -e on certain verb stems for the realis / hypothetical conjugation (已然形 izenkei / 仮定形 kateikei) was the same thing as the -e ending for the imperative conjugation (命令形 meireikei). See more on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C5%8Dda ... _Kanazukai

HTH!

Thanks. I did think e1/e2 seemed kind of rare from the vocabulary I found.