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zompist bboard • View topic - English help needed

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 Post subject: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 9:59 am 
Smeric
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 10:24 am 
Lebom
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Okay, I'm not a native speaker, but I can tell you that "damn gay" definitely doesn't work -- for multiple reasons.

For one, "gay" is mostly used as an adjective, and when it's used as a noun it's usually in the plural. (I think this is a somewhat general pattern with adjectives used as nouns in English, c.f. "blacks", "whites".) Furthermore, I agree with you that bög is a bit stronger than "gay". Something like "fag" may be a more accurate translation, but I think bög lies somewhere between those two. The "damn" part also feels awkward to me, even if you changed it to like "damned gay", "damn fag", or something similar. "Damn" doesn't compound as smoothly as jävel.

I think you should move away from the idea of translating bög and jävel separately and instead try to come up with a single English word that carries the same connotations. A strong slur like "faggot" might be the most accurate, but that may be considered too risque in the English speaking world -- although that obviously depends on the intended audience of the book.


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 10:36 am 
Smeric
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 10:55 am 
Smeric
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Magbmight be right about it being "too strong". Faggot is pretty strong (although some people, both gay and otherwise, consider it acceptable if and only if its a friend. Some consider it acceptable if a gay person uses it, and I think there's a reclamation movement for the word). Fag is just a shortening, with all of the same considerations. Also, in Britain (but not in other Commonwealth countries), it generally means a bundle of firewood.

Yet damn doesn't work either. You could just soften it to "Gay". Alternatively, you might translate it literally. A book called "The Gay Devil" sounds interesting.

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ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 12:09 pm 
Avisaru
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Meanwhile, I'm just wondering why the duvet is moist.

EDIT: actually, here's a few more things if you find them helpful. Some of these might fall more into the editing category than the translation category, I confess.

3. "Senior" usually refers only to the last year of high school, so something with "last year" might be more natural: "I'm in my last year [at / of] middle school; high school starts in (the) fall." ("the" is optional)

4. It's [slightly past / a little past] [3 PM / three in the afternoon] and dinner [will soon be / is almost] ready.

5. It's fine to say she helps herself to the food, although I'd also probably also take out "light-colored"; that's somewhat implied by "cream sauce". (would "gravy" be an appropriate word here?)

6. It's fine, although maybe a touch awkward; it'd probably be more natural to say something like "The air in the room is stale, and I feel like I [have / need] to air it out."

7. Definitely "television" if you're going for AmE. "Telly" is very British-sounding. Again, though: moist??

8. We've always stuck together.
It's OK, although maybe "We've always stuck [with / by] each other" would avoid the mental image that they're literally attached to each other!

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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 2:24 pm 
Sanno
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:27 pm 
Avisaru
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American English (specifically, GA) is my native language, so (without really reading all the other responses, which are probably better than mine):

1. "Homo" is more pejorative than "gay". Though you'd use "fucking" with it: "Fucking homo". But this would be someone calling someone else this.
2. I'd just use "faggot" here, though that has a connotation of self-deprecation in this scenario, if someone is describing themselves.
2.5. "Fifteen-year-old person" is fine. ("fifteen-year-old" is one phrasal adjective, so it gets hyphenated together to make it one "unit", whatever the real linguistics terms are). For that phrase, you spell it out; you'd use the numeral form with other things ("1970's-era music")
3. I'd say "last year of middle school"; there are schools in America where middle school goes through 9th grade (that is, the grade where people are 14–15 generally). I'd probably add "I start my first of three years of high school in the fall" to make the cultural note clearer, even if it's not a perfect translation
4. "It's slightly past three in the afternoon, and dinner ready soon". Again, you write out the number, though using the numeral isn't *wrong*, just weirder to me. Also note that "soon" tends to come after "ready", not before (to my ear). In casual speech, people tend to say "in the afternoon" instead of "PM", or just drop it altogether: if you tell someone you'll be having dinner at 3, they'll know you mean the afternoon (though that's an extraordinarily early time for dinner, to me; I think of the earliest you can have dinner as being about 4:30–5)
5. This sentence is perfectly fine to me. You can help yourself to something you cooked, and it doesn't have a negative connotation to me; it just means that you're serving yourself, and probably a larger helping. If you want to sneak the sauce name in, you can say "pork chops drowned in gräddsås, a light-colored cream sauce". Unless it's a culinary plot, I think you're fine with that level of detail. The actual name gives any curious readers the ability to google it.
6. Yes, you can open a window to air out a room. This sentence reads awkwardly to me. I'd probably say "The air in the room has gotten stale; I feel like it needs to be aired out."
7. Telly is British-ism. Here, we say "TV" or "television", probably the former.
7.5. I never remember the lay/lie distinction, so I can't comment on that.
7.75. Moist is a word in English that has a lot of negative connotations for some people. If "damp" is also reasonable, I'd recommend that, instead.
8. Nope, seems fine to me, though I'd rather some additional prepositional phrase or clause: "We've always stuck together through thick and thin" or "We've always stuck together despite our occasional fights" or something like that.
9. This phrasing is perfectly reasonable to me. "Little triangle" isn't particularly a slang word we'd use, so its meaning is a little obfuscated, but given context, it's clear. There's probably a more natural slang term that's just not coming to me right now.


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:34 pm 
Avisaru
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But it sounds like it's supposed to be a strong expression, so "fucking faggot/homo" seems like the most most appropriate translation. Then again, English-speaking audiences may be more sensitive; consider how the Swedish film "Fucking Åmål" became "Show me love" in English.

I think you might also want to consider (or ask the author) how "local" you want it to sound. If part of the appeal is that the story clearly takes place in Sweden (as is decidedly the case with the aforementioned film, for one example) you should be careful not to change too much of things like how the school system works. You could even go as far as to include mildly unusual idioms, and conventions like 24h time, to add a local flavour.

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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:35 pm 
Avisaru
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:57 pm 
Sanno
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But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 7:45 pm 
Smeric
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ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:19 pm 
Avisaru
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:23 pm 
Avisaru
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I was thinking it was urine. The combination of "warm" with "moist" just screams "SOMEONE PEED" to me.

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I generally forget to say, so if it's relevant and I don't mention it--I'm from Southern Michigan and speak Inland North American English. Yes, I have the Northern Cities Vowel Shift; no, I don't have the cot-caught merger; and it is called pop.


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:31 pm 
Smeric
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If I just walked into Rorschach test, I don't want to dwell on what my answer says about me...

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ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:41 pm 
Avisaru
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As noted by my answer to it, I imagined it was just a bit of water, kind of like someone spilled some on it.

Though come to think of it, I don't usually consider damp things to be warm...


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:50 pm 
Smeric
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I jumped to my conclusion because self-depreciating title about gay protagonist somehow led to self-hate-sex.

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ìtsanso, God In The Mountain, may our names inspire the deepest feelings of fear in urkos and all his ilk, for we have saved another man from his lies! I welcome back to the feast hall kal, who will never gamble again! May the eleven gods bless him!


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 9:04 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 5:58 am 
Smeric
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Thank you so much for all the replies! I won't respond to everything individually, but I've used suggestions from pretty much everyone. I knew there were gonna be quite many things that native speakers will find odd, but damn... :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:01 am 
Sumerul
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I think you mean that it’s warm and humid/sticky/sweaty under the duvet, not moist.


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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:14 am 
Smeric
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:19 am 
Smeric
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About the dinner: I think usually lunch here in Sweden is at around 12:00, and dinner at 5-6 PM. So 3 PM is not very usual; I don't know if they've had lunch already or not. In the original text the mom yells "maten är klar!" (the food is ready). I thought that this is unidiomatic in English, so I chose dinner. :?

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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:22 am 
Smeric
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:29 am 
Smeric
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:35 am 
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 Post subject: Re: English help needed
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 6:44 am 
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