Help your fluency in a nifty way

Discussion of natural languages, or language in general.
Ziz
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Ziz »

クッキーを食べすぎて、ちょっと病んだ。だが、もっと食べたいよ。
I ate too many cookies and I feel a bit sick. But I want to eat more.

Japonés es un poco feo escrito. Los carácteres no tienen una densidad o complejidad uniforme. Ojalá que por fin tiraran los kanjis y escribirlo todo con hiragana, tal vez con espacios entre las palabras. No me trago que los kanjis les ayuden enormemente a comprender el idioma escrito. El idioma hablado se entiende perfectamente bien.
Japanese is a bit ugly written. The characters don't have a uniform density or complexity. I wish they would finally throw out the kanji and write everything with hiragana, maybe with spaces between the words. I don't buy the argument that the kanji help tremendously to understand the written language. The spoken language is understood perfectly well.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

Viktor77 wrote:Ik ken sommige van die zangers maar niet allemaal, dus bedankt (behalve Frans Bauer lol). Ik vind K3 leuk. Ze zijn* blijkbaar een oude meidengroep (misschien vindt jouw dochter hen leuk haha) maar ze zijn echt leuk. Ik vind ook Nielson leuk (en mooi :P), vooral Sexy als ik dans. Ik vind ook De** Jeugd van de Tegenwoordig en Gers Pardoel (ook dit nummer) leuk. En Mr. Polska en Jebroer, natuurlijk. Vind je ook elk*** van deze zangers leuk?
*There's a plural/singular mismatch here that jars a bit. I'd say "ze vormen". Or "Dat is", because "K3" is singular already.
**That's what they're calling themselves, including the article.
***More idiomatically "al deze zangers". Personally I'd also move "ook" to before "leuk" (since it's "ook leuk" (like me), not "ook deze zangers" (like the other singers)).

K3 ist eine "alte" Mädchengruppe, aber heutzutage sind sie alle wieder jung! Alle drei meiner Kinder (zwei Töchter, ein Sohn) finden K3 hubsch, obwohl sie alle zu alt dafür sind.
K3 is an "old" girl band, but nowadays they're all young again! All three of my kids (two daughters, one son) think K3 is swell, even though they're too old for that.
Mijn God! Ik heb naar Monique Smit geluisteerd toen ik een teenager was!
Wir machen alle fehler wenn wir jung sind.
We all make mistakes when we're young.

P.S. This song by Kenny G is one of my favourite Dutch language songs.


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finlay
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by finlay »

Ziz wrote:クッキーを食べすぎて、ちょっと病んだ。だが、もっと食べたい
I ate too many cookies and I feel a bit sick. But I want to eat more.

Japonés es un poco feo escrito. Los carácteres no tienen una densidad o complejidad uniforme. Ojalá que por fin tiraran los kanjis y escribirlo todo con hiragana, tal vez con espacios entre las palabras. No me trago que los kanjis les ayuden enormemente a comprender el idioma escrito. El idioma hablado se entiende perfectamente bien.
Japanese is a bit ugly written. The characters don't have a uniform density or complexity. I wish they would finally throw out the kanji and write everything with hiragana, maybe with spaces between the words. I don't buy the argument that the kanji help tremendously to understand the written language. The spoken language is understood perfectly well.
まぁ、問題がいろいろあるけど、1つの利点は、漢字を知っていると今まで見ていない言葉がすぐわかること。たとえば、病んだって使ったことはないけど、意味がはっきりと分かれる。(普通で「病気になった」とよくいうので)でも、意味が明確なのに、発音が出来ないのは難しいことの1つです。トレードオフなんだ。ふりがながあったら大丈夫なんだけど、そんなシステムはちょったバカだね。
まあ、もんだいが いろいろ あるけど、ひとつの りてんは、かんじを しっていると いままで みていない ことばが すぐ わかること。たとえば、やんだって つかったことは ないけど、いみが はっきりと わかれる。(ふつうで「びょうきに なった」と よく いうので)でも、いみが めいかくなのに、はつおんが できないのは むずかしいことの ひとつです。とれーどおふなんだ。ふりがなが あったら だいじょうぶなんだけど、そんな しすてむは ちょっと ばかだね。
Well, there are many problems with the system, but one advantage is as long as you can understand the kanji, you can quickly understand words you haven't seen before. Like I haven't used 病んだ (yanda) before, but I can clearly understand its meaning. (usually people say 'byouki ni natta') But while the meaning is clear, you can't pronounce it, which is one of the difficult points - it's a trade-off between the two. If you have furigana it's OK, but then that system is a bit stupid.

その上、最初はみんなそんなことを信じていたけど、レベルがよくなっていると違うと思うよ。で、漢字が本当に嫌いなら使わないこともできるよ。そしたら子供の本みたいだけど、まだ日本語だから大丈夫かなね。
そのうえ、さいしょは みんな そんな ことを しんじていたけど、れべるが よく なっていると 違うと おもうよ。で、かんじが ほんとうに きらいなら つかわないことも できるよ。そしたら こどもの ほん みたいだけど、まだ にほんご だから だいじょうぶ かなね。
Also, everyone thinks like this at first, once your level is higher I think it's different. And if you really hate kanji you don't have to use them, like it just makes it look like a kids' book, but it's still Japanese.

(It's also more difficult to type it like that)

(also I like how words pop out more when you write them with kanji or katakana)
Last edited by finlay on Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:37 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

jal wrote:K3 ist eine "alte" Mädchengruppe, aber heutzutage sind sie alle wieder jung! Alle drei meiner Kinder (zwei Töchter, ein Sohn) finden K3 hübsch*1), obwohl sie alle zu alt dafür sind.
K3 is an "old" girl band, but nowadays they're all young again! All three of my kids (two daughters, one son) think K3 is swell, even though they're too old for that.

Wir machen alle Fehler, wenn wir jung sind.
We all make mistakes when we're young.
*1) hübsch is used only for looks / outside appearance; if you mean they find them great generally, use toll / super / spitze or similar.

In Duitsland keenen wij slechts de Nederlandse zangers en groepen, die op Duits of op Engels zingen (Bots, Hermann van Veen, Golden Earring, The Nits...)
In Germany, we only know the Dutch singers and Groups who sing in German or English (Bots, Hermann van Veen, Golden Earring, The Nits...)

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Lambuzhao »

Golden Earring...
¿El arete de oro? Es Cuando la bala da en el hueso ~ ¡Arré!
Golden earring? It's when the bullet hits the bone - W00T!

Zona de Penumbra
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TecvgT8KBko


Una canción clásica de un grupo bien chévere.
Classic song by an awesome band.

:mrgreen:

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Viktor77 »

jal wrote:P.S. This song by Kenny G is one of my favourite Dutch language songs.
Ja, ik heb eigenlijk naar het al geluisterd. Ik weet niet wat ik ervan denk. Het is een vreemde mix van het Frans en het Nederlands.

Ik vind Kind van de Duivel van Jebroer echt leuk maar ik zag op de YouTube commentaar dat een kind die erg van dit lied hield, overleden door een jetski is. Het lied gaat over een kind die gangster wil worden maar per ongeluk pleegt hij zelfmoord. Ik weet niet het volledige verhaal van het kind die overleden door de jetski is maar het lijkt alsof dit kind, geïnspireerd door dit gewelddadig lied, heeft gevaarlijke trucs op een jetski uitgevoerd waardoor hij overleden is. Kan een lied te gewelddadig zijn? Ik weet het niet maar het is zeker een interessante vraag, wat me betreft ten minste.


Yes, I've actually already listened to it. I don't know what to think about it. It's a strange mix of French and Dutch.

I really like Kind van de Duivel by Jebroer but I saw in the YouTube comments that a kid who really loved this song was killed by a jet ski. The song is about a kid who wants to become gangster but accidentally kills himself. I don't know the whole story about the kid who was killed by the jetski but it sounds like this kid, inspired by a violent song, did dangerous tricks on a jetski which killed him. Can a song be too violent? I don't know but it's an interesting question, to me at least.
Falgwian and Falgwia!!

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

hwhatting wrote:In Duitsland kennen we alleen de Nederlandse zangers en groepen, die in het Duits of op Engels zingen (Bots, Hermann van Veen, Golden Earring, The Nits...)
Das sind alle sehr alte Bands, aus der siebziger Jahre... Ich weiß fast sicher, dass es auch aktueller Bands gibt, der mann kennt in Deutschland.
These are all very old bands, from the 70s... I'm pretty sure there are more recent bands that are known in Germany.
Viktor77 wrote:Ja, daar heb ik eigenlijk* het al naar geluisterd. Ik weet niet wat ik ervan denk**. Het is een vreemde mix van het Frans en het Nederlands.
*There's no good translation for "actually", "eigenlijk" has different uses.
**More idiomatic "moet vinden" or "moet denken".
Ik vind Kind van de Duivel van Jebroer echt* leuk maar ik zag op de YouTube commentaar dat een kind die erg van dit lied hield**, omgekomen is bij een ongeval met een jetski. Het lied gaat over een kind die gangster wil worden maar per ongeluk pleegt hij zelfmoord***. Ik ken niet het volledige verhaal van het kind die is omgekomen door het jetskiongeval^ is maar het lijkt alsof dit kind, geïnspireerd door dit gewelddadig lied, gevaarlijke trucs op een jetski heeft uitgevoerd waardoor hij verongelukt is. Kan een lied te gewelddadig zijn? Ik weet het niet maar het is zeker^^ een interessante vraag, wat mij betreft ten minste.
*Better: "erg". "Echt" has connotations of "despite what you claim" or "really, trust me" or the like.
**Better: "die dit lied erg leuk vond" or "helemaal weg was van dit lied" or the like.
***I don't think it's possible to accidently commit suicide. Better: "per ongeluk schiet hij zichzelf dood" or the like (unfortunately, there's no general way in Dutch to translate "to kill", you need to add what causes it)
^I'd just say "Ik ken niet het volledige verhaal", why the repetition?
^^There's no "certainly" in your English.
I saw in the YouTube comments
Und das war das richtige Moment um auf zu halten.
And that was the right moment to stop.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

Mein niederländische Lieblingsband ist Bettie Serveert. Nur ihre Name ist auf Niederländisch.
Is é an banna Ollannach is gile liom ná Bettie Serveert. Ní hOllainnis ach an ainm dóibh.
My favourite Dutch band is Bettie Serveert. Only their name is Dutch.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Imralu »

Victor88 wrote:Good news! I don't like roommates but I hope you all get along well.
Asante. Mimi pia ninapenda kuishi peke yangu, lakini sina pesa inayotosha. Niling'amua kwamba ninapatana na mtu mmoja ninayeishi tunaposema Kiingereza. Wengine wawili wanaosema kiserbokroatia pamoja na sisi sote watatu tunasema Kiingereza.
Thanks! I also love living alone but I don't have enough money. I found out that I get on much better with one of the people I live with when we speak in English. The two others speak Serbocroatian together and all three of us speak English together.

Ninataka kununua chokoleti, lakini nitahitaji kuvaa nguo na viatu, kwenda nje na kutembea mita mia moja. Maishi ni magumu.
I want to buy chocolate but I'll have to get dressed and put on shoes, go outside and walk one hundred metres. Life is hard.

Edit:

Nilienda nje. Nilinunua biskuti za chokoleti.
I went outside. I bought chocolate biscuits.

Laiti Kiswahili kingekuwa na neno kwa flatmate.
I wish Swahili had a word for "flatmate".
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Ziz
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Ziz »

Solía practicar el japonés con videojuegos para niños, que se escriben casi todos sólo con hiragana.
I used to practice Japanese with children's video games, which are almost all written just in hiragana.

¿Por qué escribir con sólo 50 carácteres si más que 2.000 servirán también?
Why write with just 50 characters when more than 2,000 will do?

Mi amiga volvió a Israel después de dos meses al extranjero, pero iba demasiado en bicicleta mientras hacía mucho calor, así que no tengo empeño para ir a verla. Ella ya está con otra amiga, espero que se diviertan juntas sin notar que yo aún no estoy con ellas.
My friend came back to Israel after two months abroad, but I was cycling for too long while it was very hot, so I don't have any energy to go see her. She's already with another friend, so I hope they're having fun together without noticing that I'm not with them.

A fin de mes, voy a mudarme a otro piso con gente que no conozco. Una de ellos será canadiense, y me alegro que no tenga que hacer un esfuerzo para hablar con ella. Me parece bien simpática, en conformidad con el estereotipo.
At the end of the month, I'm moving to another apartment with people I don't know. One of them is Canadian, and I'm happy that I won't have to make an effort to talk to her. She seems pretty nice, in conformity with the stereotype.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

linguoboy wrote:My favourite Dutch band is Bettie Serveert. Only their name is Dutch.
Ich habe immer gedacht, dass das eine Flämische Band ist...
I've always thought it's a Flemmish band...


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Pole, the
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

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jal wrote:
linguoboy wrote:My favourite Dutch band is Bettie Serveert. Only their name is Dutch.
Ich habe immer gedacht, dass das eine Flämische Band ist...
I've always thought it's a Flemmish band...
Meine niederländische Lieblingsbänder sind Mew, Wintergatan, Indica, Leaves Eyes, Arcade Fire und Travis.
My favourite Dutch bands are Mew, Wintergatan, Indica, Leaves Eyes, Arcade Fire and Travis.

Schade, dass Delain, Epica und Within Temptation nicht auch niederländisch sind.
What a shame Delain, Epica and Within Temptation aren't Dutch as well.
The conlanger formerly known as “the conlanger formerly known as Pole, the”.

If we don't study the mistakes of the future we're doomed to repeat them for the first time.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Imralu »

Usiku wa jana tulifanya kalamu kwa mtu atayehama nyumba yetu.
Last night, we had a party for the person who is moving out of our house.

Nilimwalika mwanaume ambaye nilikutana naye katika ubani na ninapendezwa naye. Sasa ninajua kwamba anapendezwa na wanawake kwa bahati mbaya, lakini ni vizuri kujua na vilevile yeye ni mtu mzuri sana na ninafikiri kwamba tutakuwa rafiki wazuri.
I invited the man who I met on the train and have a crush on. Now I know that he's straight, unfortunately, but it's good to know and also he's a really nice guy and I think we will be good friends.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

Pole, the wrote:What a shame Delain, Epica and Within Temptation aren't Dutch as well.
Du bist so ein Witzer!
You're such a joker!


JAL

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Bristel »

He empazado a aprender galés.
I have started to learn Welsh.

Bore dydd Llun da! Dw i eisiau cath.
Good Monday morning! I want a cat.
[bɹ̠ˤʷɪs.təɫ]
Nōn quālibet inīquā cupiditāte illectus hoc agō
Yo te pongo en tu lugar...
Taisc mach Daró

Ziz
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Ziz »

Bristel wrote:He empazado a aprender galés.
I have started to learn Welsh.

Bore dydd Llun da! Dw i eisiau cath.
Good Monday morning! I want a cat.
Boa sorte! O galês é uma das línguas mais confusas que tenho tentado aprender. Infelizmente, é um pouco difícil encontrar recursos que explicam tudo claramente. Parei com isso, mas espero que você tenha mais êxito.
Good luck! Welsh is one of the most confusing languages I've tried to learn. Unfortunately, it's a little difficult to find resources that explain everything clearly. I gave up on it, but I hope you have more success.

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Bristel, unajua mtu anayesema Kiwelisi? Huku kuna mtu mmoja au wawili wanaoweza kukusaidia. Au huenda katika CBB.
Bristel, do you know anyone who speaks Welsh? There are one or two people here who can help you. Or maybe in the CBB.

Sasa Duolingo ina kozi ya Kiwelisi.
Duolingo has a Welsh course now.

Mimi pia ninataka paka, lakini sitaki kuwajibika.
I want a cat too, but I don't want the responsibility.
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Yng »

Bristel wrote: Bore dydd Llun da! Dw i eisiau cath.
Good Monday morning! I want a cat.
Bore Llun da sounds better - bore llun is monday morning.

Be sydd ar y Gymraeg?
What's wrong with Welsh?
Last edited by Yng on Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
كان يا ما كان / يا صمت العشية / قمري هاجر في الصبح بعيدا / في العيون العسلية

tà yi póbo tsùtsùr ciivà dè!

short texts in Cuhbi

Risha Cuhbi grammar

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

Ich mag Katze nicht, ich wollte gerne einen Hund, aber ich habe kein Zeit dazu.
I don't like cats, I'd like to have a dog, but I don't have the time.


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linguoboy
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

Bristel wrote:Bore dydd Llun da! Dw i eisiau cath.
Pa fath o gath?
Cén saghas cait?
What sort of cat?

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

jal wrote:Das sind alle sehr alte Bands, aus den siebziger Jahren... Ich bin mir ziemlich sicher, dass es auch aktuellere Bands gibt, die mann kennt in Deutschland kennt.
These are all very old bands, from the 70s... I'm pretty sure there are more recent bands that are known in Germany.
I saw in the YouTube comments
Und das wäre der richtige Moment gewesen, um aufzuhören.
And that was the right moment to stop.
linguoboy wrote:Meine niederländische Lieblingsband ist Bettie Serveert. Nur ihre Name ist auf Niederländisch.
My favourite Dutch band is Bettie Serveert. Only their name is Dutch.
jal wrote:Ich habe immer gedacht, dass das eine flämische Band ist...
I've always thought it's a Flemmish band...
Pole, the wrote:Meine niederländischen Lieblingsbands sind Mew, Wintergatan, Indica, Leaves Eyes, Arcade Fire und Travis.
My favourite Dutch bands are Mew, Wintergatan, Indica, Leaves Eyes, Arcade Fire and Travis..
jal wrote:Du bist so ein Witzbold!
You're such a joker!
jal wrote:Ich mag Katzen nicht, ich hätte gerne einen Hund, aber ich habe kein Zeit dafür.
I don't like cats, I'd like to have a dog, but I don't have the time.
Być może, że istnieją więcej aktualne zespoły niderlandzkie, które są popularne w Niemczech, ale ja ich nie znam.
C'est possible qu'il y a des groupes néerlandaises plus actuelles, qui sont populaires en Allemagne, mais je ne les connais pas.
Het is mogelijk dat er actuelere Nederlandse groepen zijn, die en Duitsland populair zijn, maar ik ken ze niet.

It's possible that there are more recent Dutch bands that are popular in Germany, but I don't know them.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Viktor77 »

hwhatting wrote:C'est possible qu'il y ait des groupes néerlandais plus récents*, qui sont connus** en Allemagne, mais je ne les connais pas.
*I'm nitpicking here but your English translation was recent.
**Populair is a false cognate in standard French. It means common in the sense of class.

On vient d'emménager dans notre nouvel appartement à Memphis. On est dans les banlieues à deux pas de la frontière avec le Mississippi. On a un bel et grand appartement de 3 chambres et de 2 salles de bain. Comme ça on a une chambre d'amis et un bureau. Et on a enfin un sèche-linge, un lave-vaisselle et un grand lit (ce qu'on n'a pas eu avant). J'en suis content mais maintenant il faut défaire un tas de cartons, dont je ne suis pas content.

We just moved into our new apartment in Memphis. We are in the suburbs, a stone's throw from the Mississippi border. We have a nice big apartment with 3 bedrooms and 2 bathrooms. This way we have a guest room and an office. And finally we have a dryer, a dishwasher, and a king-sized bed (super king in UK) (which we didn't have before). I'm happy but now we have to unpack tons of boxes, which I'm not happy about.
Falgwian and Falgwia!!

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

hwhatting wrote:Het is mogelijk dat er actuelere Nederlandse groepen zijn, die in Duitsland populair zijn, maar ik ken ze niet.
Ich denke, dass du zu alt bist :). Zu mindestens musst du Within Temptation kennen, obwohl sie auch nicht so aktuel mehr sind.
I think you're too old :). At least you should know Within Temptation, even though they're also not very recent anymore.
Viktor77 wrote:*I'm nitpicking here but your English translation was recent.
Dass ist meine Fehler, ich hätte "recent" geschrieben obschon ich "aktuel" auf Deutsch geschrieben hätte.
That's my bad, I had written "recent" though I wrote "aktuel" in German.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Pole, the »

Być może, że istnieje więcej aktualnych (współczesnych?) holenderskich zespołów, które są popularne w Niemczech, ale ja ich nie znam.
The conlanger formerly known as “the conlanger formerly known as Pole, the”.

If we don't study the mistakes of the future we're doomed to repeat them for the first time.

hwhatting
Smeric
Smeric
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Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2002 2:49 am
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

jal wrote:Ich denke, dass du zu alt bist :). Zu mindestens müsstest du Within Temptation kennen, obwohl sie auch nicht mehr so aktuell mehr sind.
I think you're too old :). At least you should know Within Temptation, even though they're also not very recent anymore.

Dass ist meine Fehler, ich hatte "recent" geschrieben, obschon*1) ich "aktuell" auf Deutsch geschrieben hatte.
That's my bad, I had written "recent" though I wrote "aktuel" in German.
*1) Very bookish. I'd use obwohl.

Nie znałem ich i musiałem guglać ich. Nie znam dużo o metalu. Jestem stary. :-)
Je ne les ai pas connu et j'ai du les googler. Je ne connais pas bien le metal. Je suis vieux.
Ik heb ze niet gekend en moest ze googelen. Ik ken metal niet goed. Ik ben oud. :-)

I didn't know them and had to google them. I don't know metal well. I am old. :-)

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