Help your fluency in a nifty way

Discussion of natural languages, or language in general.
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ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ »

Eh bien, je pense que ce sujet est considéré neutre. Tu pourrais commencer dire d'un sujet émotionnel mais je ne sais pas comment la conversation se développera.
Well, I think this topic is considered neutral. You could start talking about an emotional one but I don't know how the conversation will develop.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

Wenn du nur einige Hobbys hättest, HaWe...
If only you had some hobbies, H-W...

Ein Bekannter von mir ist Chef. Gestern hat er mir zu einem sechsgängigen russischen Abendessen in seiner Wohnung eingeladen. Zum ersten Mal im Leben hab ich Borschtsch richtig genossen.
A friend of mine is a chef. Yesterday he invited me to a six-course Russian dinner in his apartment. For the first time in my life I had some borscht that I actually liked.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

linguoboy wrote:Ein Bekannter von mir ist Koch / Küchenchef*1). Gestern hat er mich zu einem sechsgängigen russischen Abendessen in seiner Wohnung eingeladen. Zum ersten Mal im Leben hab ich Borschtsch richtig genossen.
A friend of mine is a chef. Yesterday he invited me to a six-course Russian dinner in his apartment. For the first time in my life I had some borscht that I actually liked.
*1) Chef is "boss" (in the work sense, not in the gaming sense).
linguoboy wrote:If only you had some hobbies, H-W...
Mam zbyt dużo hobby.
Imam previše hobija.
Aš turiu per daug hobis.
J'ai trop de passe-temps.
Ho troppi hobby.
Tengo demasaiados pasatiempos.
Ik heb te veel hobby's.
Jeg har for mange hobbyer.
. من خیلی زیاد سرگرمی دارم
Benim çok fazla hobim var.
Менің тым көп хоббиім бар.
Mening sevimli mashg'ulotlarim juda ko'p.
. عندي الكثير من الهوايات
Saya terlalu banyak hobi.

I've got too many hobbies.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Imralu »

Unapenda kufanya nini?
What do you like doing?

Ripoti ya hali ya hewa ilisema kwamba mvua isingenyesha, lakini inanyesha. Tafadhali waite polisi!
The weather report said it wouldn't rain, but it's raining. Please call the police!
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

Imralu wrote:What do you like doing?

Uczyć się języków. Konstruować języki. Językoznawstwo historyczne. Czytać. Dzieje. Grać w golfa. Grać w Civ. Gotować. A ty?
Apprendre des langues. Construire des langues. Linguistique historique. Lire. Histoire. Jouer au golf. Jouer à Civ. Cuisiner. Et toi?
Talen leren. Talen construeren. Historische taalwetenschap. Lezen. Geschiedenis. Golf spelen. Civ spelen. Kokkerellen. En jij?

Learning languages. Constructing languages. Historical linguistics. Reading. History. Playing golf. Playing Civ. Cooking. And you?

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

Was liest du grade?
What are you reading?

Ich lese ein Buch, das ein Bekannter als "Schlechtfühlroman" beschrieben hat.
I'm doing what an acquaintance characterised as some "feel-bad reading".

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Pole, the »

hwhatting wrote:
Imralu wrote:What do you like doing?

Uczyć się języków. Konstruować języki. Językoznawstwo historyczne. Czytać. Dzieje. Grać w golfa. Grać w Civ. Gotować.
I don't think you can mix nouns and verbs like that in Polish. You should either turn everything into nouns (Uczenie się języków. Konstruowanie języków…) or verbs (Zajmować się językoznawstwem historycznym. Uczyć się historii…).

Also, using dzieje in the meaning of “history” is a bit archaic and could be considered a mistranslation.

Also also, frequent repetitions (języków … języki … językoznawstwo; grać … grać) are often considered a stylistic error in Polish. You would rather look for synonyms (tworzenie conlangów, lingwistyka historyczna, uprawianie golfa…).
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

hwhatting wrote:Kokkerellen.
Not bad per se, but given the other translations, "koken" would be better.
Pole, the wrote:Also also, frequent repetitions (...) are often considered a stylistic error in Polish.
Das haben wir auch in Niederländisch!
We have the same in Dutch!


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

jal wrote:Das haben wir auch in Niederländisch!
Im Englischen auch. Manchmal find ich, dass ich das Vermeiden eher übertreiben, bis zur Gespreiztheit.
In English, too. Sometimes I find that I take the avoidance too far and my sentences sound stilted.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

linguoboy wrote:In English, too. Sometimes I find that I take the avoidance too far and my sentences sound stilted.
Wirklich? Ich finde Englisch eine Sprache, die gerade viele Wiederholungen verwendet.
Really? I find English a language that uses many repetitions.


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Last edited by jal on Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

jal wrote:Really? I find English a language that uses many repetitions.
Das ist überwiegend eine Eigenschaft höherer Stilebenen. Es kommt oft in Zeitungen vor, z.B.
It's chiefly a feature of higher registers. You commonly see it in newspaper articles, for instance.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Qwynegold »

hwhatting wrote:Learning languages. Constructing languages. Historical linguistics. Reading. History. Playing golf. Playing Civ. Cooking. And you?
どの『シヴィライゼーション』?こっちはもう『シヴィライゼーション3』をしてる。
Dono "Shiviraizeeshon"? Kotchi wa mō "Shiviraizeeshon 3" wo shite ru.
Which Civilization? I myself am still playing Civilization 3.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Pole, the »

Qwynegold wrote: どの『シヴィライゼーション』?こっちはもう『シヴィライゼーション3』をしてる。
Dono "Shiviraizeeshon"? Kotchi wa mō "Shiviraizeeshon 3" wo shite ru.
Which Civilization? I myself am still playing Civilization 3.
Alpha Centauri ist der einzig richtig Civ!!!
Alpha Centauri is the only true Civ!!!
( :P )
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

linguoboy wrote:Was liest du grade?
What are you reading?
Jak zawsze, kilka książek jednocześnie: przekład na rosyjski Hafeza, jeden gazel w dzień; historię Libana (Boutros Dib, "Histoire du Liban"), i "Greek and Indo-European Etymology in Action. Proto-Indo-European *aǵ-" Raimo Anttili jako lektura do łóżka.
Comme toujours, plusieurs livres simultanément: Une traduction Russe de Hafez, un ghazal par jour; une Histoire du Liban (Boutros Dib, "Histoire du Liban"), et "Greek and Indo-European Etymology in Action. Proto-Indo-European *aǵ-" de Raimo Anttila comme livre de chevet.
Zoals altijd, meerdere boeken gelijktijdig: een russische vertaling van Hafez, een ghazal per dag; een geschiedenis van de Libanon (Boutros Dib, "Histoire du Liban"), en "Greek and Indo-European Etymology in Action. Proto-Indo-European *aǵ-" van Raimo Anttila als nachtkastliteratuur.

As always, several books in parallel: A Russian tanslation of Hafez, one ghazal per day; a history of Lebanon (Boutros Dib, "Histoire du Liban"), and Raimo Anttila's "Greek and Indo-European Etymology in Action. Proto-Indo-European *aǵ-" as bedtime reading.
linguoboy wrote:Ich lese ein Buch, das ein Bekannter als "Schlechtfühlroman" beschrieben hat.
I'm doing what an acquaintance characterised as some "feel-bad reading".
Jaką powieść czytasz?
Koji roman čitaš?
Kurį romaną tu skaitai?
Quelle roman est-ce que tu lis?
Quale romanzo stai leggendo?
¿Qué novela estás leyendo?
Welke roman ben je aan het lezen?
Hvilken roman læser du?
کدام رمان را تو می خوانی؟
Hangi roman okuyorsun?
Сен қай роман оқып жатырсын?
Qaysi romanni o'qiyapsan?
أي الرواية انت تقرأ؟
Which novel are you reading?
Pole, the wrote:
hwhatting wrote:
Imralu wrote:What do you like doing?

Uczyć się języków. Konstruować języki. Językoznawstwo historyczne. Czytać. Dzieje. Grać w golfa. Grać w Civ. Gotować.
I don't think you can mix nouns and verbs like that in Polish. You should either turn everything into nouns (Uczenie się języków. Konstruowanie języków…) or verbs (Zajmować się językoznawstwem historycznym. Uczyć się historii…).

Also, using dzieje in the meaning of “history” is a bit archaic and could be considered a mistranslation.
Dziękuję!
jal wrote:
hwhatting wrote:Kokkerellen.
Not bad per se, but given the other translations, "koken" would be better.
Hmm.. what I was aiming for was "cooking" as a hobby / activity, like French cuisiner, as opposed to "boiling" or "cooking" as a process food is undergoing. So kokkerellen doesn't have that connotation? What is it used for?
jal wrote:
Pole, the wrote:Also also, frequent repetitions (...) are often considered a stylistic error in Polish.
Das haben wir auch im Niederländischen!
We have the same in Dutch!
In German, we have that, too. But I was aiming for the repetition here.
linguoboy wrote:Im Englischen auch. Manchmal find ich, dass ich das Vermeiden eher übertreiben, bis hin zur Gespreiztheit.
In English, too. Sometimes I find that I take the avoidance too far and my sentences sound stilted.
Qwynegold wrote:Which Civilization? I myself am still playing Civilization 3.
Obecnie gram w Civ 5, ale mój brat ma Civ 6 i grałem w niego na jego komputerze. Chcę grać wszystkie cywilizazcje w Civ 5, zanim przejdę do Civ 6.
I'm currently playing Civ 5, but my brother has Civ 6 and I have played it on his computer. I want to play all civilizations in Civ 5 before I move on to Civ 6.
Pole, the wrote:Alpha Centauri ist das*1) einzig richtige Civ!!!
Alpha Centauri is the only true Civ!!!
*1) As Spiel "game" is neuter, board and computer games are normally treated as neuter. You can also use the gender of the game's title, which would be female (die Zivilisation), although I wouldn't do it in this case when the shortened title is used.

Nigdy nie grałem w tego. Jeszcze nie znam Civ 6 dostatecznie, ale w tejy chwili sądzę, że Civ 2 i Civ 4 miały najlepszą równowagę.
I never played that one. I don't know Civ 6 well enough yet, but for now I think that Civ 2 and Civ 4 had the best balance.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by finlay »

俺はシブ2だけを遊んだことがある。でも、数年前だけども、Mac OSXに変わると、それを含むいろんなゲームは使えなくなった。やばかった、本当に。今もやってるさ、アップルは。たとえば、最近は32ビットと64ビットの違いのせいでいろんなiPhoneアプリとかも使えなくなった。
ore wa sibu 2 dake wo asonda koto ga aru. demo, suu-nen-mae da-kedo-mo, mac osx ni kawaru to, sore wo fukumu ironna ge:mu wa tukaenaku natta. yabakatta, hontou ni. ima mo yatteru sa, appuru wa. tatoeba, saikin wa 32 bitto to 64 bitto no chigai no sei de ironna iphone apuri toka mo tukaenaku natta.
Moi, j'ai joué seulement Civ II. Il y a très longtemps, mais quand on a changé à Mac OS X, beaucoup des jeus vidéos ont devenu inutilisable, y compris Civ II. C'était horrible, vraiment. Toujours ils fait ça, putain~ ! Par exemple, recemment à cause de l'update de 32-bit à 64-bit, beaucoup des appli de l'iPhone ont aussi devenu inutilisable.
I've only played Civ II. But including that, a lot of games became unplayable when they changed over to Mac OS X, all those years ago. It was really bad, really annoying. They're still fucking doing it. Like recently a lot of iPhone apps have become unusable because of the update from 32-bit to 64-bit.

ところで、日本語は重複が絶対いいよ。でも、そんなリストではどの言語でもいいんじゃない?文じゃないなら。
tokoro de, nihongo wa choufuku ga zettai ii yo. demo, sonna risuto de wa dono gengo demo ii-n-ja nai? bun ja nai nara
Repetition is absolutely fine in japanese, btw. But is it not ok in that kind of list in any language?? it's not a sentence...

Merde, mon français a rouillé... il faut que j'ai cherché trop de mots pour ce message. J'ai oublié surtout les adverbes. :oops:
Shit... my french has degraded (a lot)... I had to look up way too many words for this message. I've especially forgotten adverbs... :? (I had to look up très... i mean come on...)
Last edited by finlay on Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:03 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ »

hwhatting wrote:Jak zawsze, kilka książek jednocześnie: przekład na rosyjski Hafeza, jeden gazel dziennie; historię Libana (Boutros Dib, "Histoire du Liban"), i "Greek and Indo-European Etymology in Action. Proto-Indo-European *aǵ-" Raimo Anttili jako lektura do łóżka.

Obecnie gram w Civ 5, ale mój brat ma Civ 6 i grałem w nią* na jego komputerze. Chcę zagrać/pograć we wszystkie cywilizacje w Civ 5, zanim przejdę do Civ 6.
I'm currently playing Civ 5, but my brother has Civ 6 and I have played it on his computer. I want to play all civilizations in Civ 5 before I move on to Civ 6.

Nigdy nie grałem w to (/nigdy w to nie grałem). Jeszcze nie znam Civ 6 dostatecznie, ale w tej chwili sądzę, że Civ 2 i Civ 4 miały najlepszą równowagę (/ były najbardziej zbalansowane).
I never played that one. I don't know Civ 6 well enough yet, but for now I think that Civ 2 and Civ 4 had the best balance.

*Civs are most often called "cywilizacja" or "civka", hence the feminine form.
The blue parts just sound more naturally to me. The green ones are typos.

Moi-même, j'aime le Civ IV, je le jouais beaucoup quand j'étais petit
Personally, I like Civ IV, I played it a lot when I was younger.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Znex »

linguoboy wrote:
jal wrote:Das haben wir auch in Niederländisch!
Im Englischen auch. Manchmal find ich, dass ich das Vermeiden eher übertreiben, bis zur Gespreiztheit.
In English, too. Sometimes I find that I take the avoidance too far and my sentences sound stilted.
Awa, ake hi latcho, un me penoms ap englishes, te me kamoms tchomone, kai his estetikes haimlego:
Ja, so es ist alles in Ordnung, aber würde ich in englisch gesagt, ob ich wollte, was ästhetisch angenehm wäre:
Yeah, like it's okay, but I would've said in English, if I was going for something aesthetically pleasing:
hwhatting wrote:Learning languages. Constructing languages. Historical linguistics. Reading. History. Playing golf. Playing Civ. Cooking.
Learning languages, constructing them, reconstructing them, reading, learning about history, going golfing, playing Civ, and cooking.

Me kamau gar tchatchepaha i Civ shpilen. Feteder hi mange Crusader Kings un Total War.
Ich liebe nicht wirklich die Civ Spiele. Ich ziehe selbst Crusader Kings und Total War vor.
I don't really like the Civ games. I prefer Crusader Kings and Total War myself.
Last edited by Znex on Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by Pole, the »

ˈd̪ʲɛ.gɔ kɾuˑl̪ wrote:*Civs are most often called "cywilizacja" or "civka", hence the feminine form.
I don't know, I'd most naturally use „Civ” as a masculine noun and say something like „… gram w Civa 5, ale mój brat ma Civa 6 i grałem w niego …”, but well, I haven't actually played them, so maybe Civ fans use it differently.
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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

Znex wrote:Yeah, like it's okay, but I would've said in English, if I was going for something aesthetically pleasing:
hwhatting wrote:Learning languages. Constructing languages. Historical linguistics. Reading. History. Playing golf. Playing Civ. Cooking.
Learning languages, constructing them, reconstructing them, reading, learning about history, going golfing, playing Civ, and cooking.
Tastes obviously vary. To me, your version sounds mushy, while I was aiming for jagged crispiness. And "Learning languages, constructing them, reconstructing them" makes it look like I learn languages, then construct the languages I learn, and afterwards I reconstruct those constructed languages... :-)
A last nitpick - doing historical linguistics is more than reconstructing languages; a lot of it is following, documenting, and trying to explain attested developments without necessarily reconstructing anything.
Znex wrote:Ich mag nicht wirklich die Civ-Spiele nicht wirklich. Ich selbst bevorzuge selbst*1) Crusader Kings und Total War vor.
I don't really like the Civ games. I prefer Crusader Kings and Total War myself.
*1) Putting selbst where you put it makes it looks like it refers to "Crusader Kings und Total War", and a German speaker would be more likely to interpret it as "I prefer even Crusader Kings and Total War".

Nigdy nie grałem w te gry, dlatego nie mogę porównywać ich.
Je n'ai jamais joué à ces jeux, donc je ne peux pas les comparer.
Ik heb deze spelen nooit gespeeld, daarom kan ik ze niet vergelijken.

I never played these games, so I can't compare them.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

hwhatting wrote:Hmm.. what I was aiming for was "cooking" as a hobby / activity, like French cuisiner, as opposed to "boiling" or "cooking" as a process food is undergoing. So kokkerellen doesn't have that connotation? What is it used for?
"Kokerellen" has a kind of amateurish, old-fashioned, corny kinda feel, at least for me. If that's what you associate what you do with it's fine, but if you feel more of an amateur chef, you'd use "koken" instead.

Ich habe niemals Civ gespielt, ich weiss kaum was es ist :).
I never played Civ, I hardly know what it is :).

EDIT: Forgot this one:
Ik heb deze spellen nooit gespeeld, daarom kan ik ze niet vergelijken.
"spelen" are games like the Olympics (so more like tournaments), "spellen" are games like chess and Civ.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

jal wrote:
hwhatting wrote:Hmm.. what I was aiming for was "cooking" as a hobby / activity, like French cuisiner, as opposed to "boiling" or "cooking" as a process food is undergoing. So kokkerellen doesn't have that connotation? What is it used for?
"Kokerellen" has a kind of amateurish, old-fashioned, corny kinda feel, at least for me. If that's what you associate what you do with it's fine, but if you feel more of an amateur chef, you'd use "koken" instead.
Ok, thanks!
jal wrote:Ich habe niemals Civ gespielt, ich weiß kaum, was das ist :).
I never played Civ, I hardly know what it is :).

Wszystkie zdania podrzędne muszą być oddzielone przecinkiem.
Toutes propositions subordonnées doivent être séparées par une virgule.
Alle bijzinnen moeten worden gescheiden door een komma.

All depedent sentences must be separated by a comma.

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by aquatius »

みんな「ビッツィー」知っていますか。3色のグラッフィクスとか、簡単な変数プログラミングしか使えないブラウザで動くゲームメーカなのです。私はそれで今IPAの母音チャートに基づくアートゲームを作っています。

気になったらここへ: http://ledoux.io/bitsy/editor.html

Has everyone heard of Bitsy? It's a pared down game maker that runs in browswer where you can only use three colours and simple variables. I'm making an art game based on the IPA vowel quadrant in it.

If you're interested you can check it out here: http://ledoux.io/bitsy/editor.html

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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by jal »

aquatius wrote:Has everyone heard of Bitsy?
Ich hatte da nie von gehört. Ich weiß nicht, ob ich es "Spiele" nennen werde. Es gibt kein Spielogik, mann kann nur rundspazieren und Text lesen.
I hadn't heard of it. I'm not sure I'd call it "games". There's no game logic, one can only walk around and read text.


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Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by hwhatting »

jal wrote:
aquatius wrote:Has everyone heard of Bitsy?
Ich hatte da noch nie*1) von gehört. Ich weiß nicht, ob ich es "Spiele" nennen würde. Es gibt keine Spiellogik, mann kann nur rumspazieren und Text lesen.
I hadn't heard of it. I'm not sure I'd call it "games". There's no game logic, one can only walk around and read text.
*1) Separating da and von like this is colloquial, don't do it if you ever write official letters in German. ;-)

Nie mam czasu żeby to sprawdzać.
Je n'ai pas de temps pour vérifier ça.
Ik heb geen tijd om het uit te checken.

I don't have time to check it out.

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linguoboy
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Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2002 9:00 am
Location: Rogers Park/Evanston

Re: Help your fluency in a nifty way

Post by linguoboy »

hwhatting wrote:
linguoboy wrote:Ich lese ein Buch, das ein Bekannter als "Schlechtfühlroman" beschrieben hat.
Jaką powieść czytasz?
Es heisst Wir müssen über Kevin reden. Es handelt sich um die Mutter von einem jugendlichen Amokläufer. Erschütternd beim Lesen.
The title is We need to talk about Kevin. It's about the mother of a school shooter. A harrowing read.

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