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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 10:07 pm 
Sanci
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Laur has no gender distinctions, even in kin-terms. Further, such terms do not see vocative or post-contextual use - the speakers just address kin by name.

otekan - father/mother/parent
eısıean - sister/brother/sibling
planaš otekan - grandfather/grandmother/grandparent (lit: second parent)
planaš eısıean - (m/f) cousin (lit: second sibling)
planlı (third)
planğeir (fourth)

An 'uncle' needs to be translated "eısıe-otekan" (brother-father/brother of a/the father), and so on. For legal purposes, the gender of a kin-term is simply written out as "female parent" or "male parent", but again never in address.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 8:16 am 
Lebom
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http://qatama.googlepages.com/alyudem.wav

Here is a recording of me reading the Ilya list.


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2007 10:35 pm 
Smeric
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In Zali:

Parent: Aba ["aba]
Mother: Ama ["ama] (or abaren ["abazEn], literally just "female parent")
Father: Ata ["ata] (or abaraz ["abazaZ], literally "male parent")

Sibling: Kali ["kali]
Sister: Jeje ["dZEdZE] (or kalyen ["kaLEn], literally "female sibling")
Brother: Bubu ["bubu] (or kalyaz, literally "male sibling")

Son/Daughter: Kil [kil] (this is the general word for either "son" or "daughter" ... there are no gendered roots)
Daughter: Kilen ["kilEn]
Son: Kilaz ["kilaZ]

Spouse/partner: Liv [liv]
Wife: Liven ["livEn]
Husband: Livaz ["livaZ]

Other relations are generally formed using these, with the word ib ('of').

For example, "cousin" is kil ib kali ib aba ["kilib"kaLib"aba], but you can mark for gender whereever necessary, eg kilen ib jejer ib ata nas means "my father's sister's daughter".
"Father in law" is Liv(az) ib ama ["liv(aZ)ib"ama].

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:07 pm 
Niš
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Location: Mikhicíltéas, Kingdom of Veldan
Veldan has an interesting kinname property: when one has more than two siblings or cousins they are distinguished as being “first” or “second” based on how close they are to one’s age.

So that:
fhiezar = older brother
fhiezí = even older brother (older than fhiezar)
ehlaza = younger brother
ehlazē = even younger brother (younger than ehlaza)
shāzvae = older sister
??? = even older sister
shātae = younger sister

aedethas = parent
taédiar = father
ānlaeti = mother
forosdhe = brother (general)
shācíā = sister (general)
kavete = son
shaelis = only son
eámin = daughter
dhíatke = uncle
??? = aunt

It also distinguishes between grandparents from the paternal or maternal line.

aêdariar = father’s father (grandfather)
aêdartí = father’s mother (grandmother)
tuthariar = mother’s father (grandfather)
tutharetí = mother’s mother (grandmother)

It also has phrases for great-grandparents, which must agree based on gender and paternal/maternal line:

aêdariar akaëtat = father’s father’s father
aêdariar ezaëtat = father’s father’s mother
aêdartí akaëten = father’s mother’s father
aêdartí ezaëten = father’s mother’s mother
tuthariar akeoti = mother’s father’s father
tuthariar ezeota = mother’s father’s mother
tutharetí akeoti = mother’s mother’s father
tutharetí ezeota = mother’s mother’s mother

Yes, it's highly confusing, but its all part of the Veldan people's philosophy of showing reverence towards elders.

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Last edited by GidhrileasZ on Sun Jul 01, 2007 11:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 6:05 am 
Niš
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Ritanese:

Alpha male - pirad
Alpha female - pamb
Sibling - sanon
Community - cucos
Outsider - ijal


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 12:00 pm 
Niš
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Kinship terms for Old Klounal-Ampae:

biological mother - mabha
biological father - pabha
female adoptive parent / spouse's parent - gwalbha
male adoptive parent / spouse's parent - werbha
sibling - sogha
spouse - teelgha
child - naendha
elder - yalbha (used for older relatives that aren't direct ancestors, and also older people (usually mentors) that the speaker is not related to but feels close to)

Relationships to more distant kin were originally just described by stating their relationship to the speaker using the above terms (i.e. someone's aunt or uncle on their mother's side would have been referred to as mabha doi sogha - 'mother's sibling'), but over time the phrases were shortened, so that the first syllable of the term for the closest relative turned into an affix that is added to the other relationship terms. For the direct paternal and maternal lines, the first syllable of the number of generations between the speaker and their ancestor is used as the affix instead. (From shortenings of constructions such as mabha doi mabha doi mabha - 'mother's mother's mother' into tlaide mabha - 'third mother (tracing back)'.) Also, the final vowels shift to <e> (/@/) because the addition of an affix changes the stress of the words.

Examples of expanded kinship terms:

paternal grandfather - daupabhe
paternal greatgrandfather - tlaipabhe
father's mother - pamabhe
father's sibling - pasoghe (can be applied to any paternal relative from the same generation as the speaker's father)
mother's sibling's child - panaendhe (can be applied to any paternal relative from the speaker's generation)
paternal elder - payalbhe (can be applied to any paternal relative older than the speaker's father's generation)
sibling's spouse - soteelghe
sibling's child - sonaendhe
grandchild - daunaendhe

- Contrail


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:11 pm 
Avisaru
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:30 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:01 pm 
Avisaru
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More on kuzi kin terms.

eKani, offspring, is not distinguished by sex, but the terms for cousin are.
girowa female cousin
t'eLaowa male cousin

This is because sex differences are considered of little importance before puberty. girowa and t'eLowa are also subject to the mutations in my last post indicating remove i.e.

J\irowadolt'e female cousin three generations younger
d'eLowatidDe male cousin six generations older
(This cousin is almost certainly dead. The speaker is probably looking him up in the family tree.)

Cousins are also distinguished by degree. The numerical suffix -res\ (reK in some dialects) changes a figure to a multiplier i.e. lanres\ once (or one times), diares\ twice (two times).
In kin terminology it represents degree:

girowadiares\ female second cousin
d'eLowadolres\ older male third cousin (remove unspecified).

These terms are very important, because kuzi society is tribal in many ways, and there are laws forbidding consanguinous marriage. The definition varies, but generally first cousin marriage is forbidden, second cousin marriage may be, and in some countries you need a special dispensation to get a fifth cousin marriage.

On the subject of dispensations, the judgement is supposed to be made according to how many cousin marriages have taken place already between those two branches of the family. Occasionally however it is made on baser motives, such as money changing hands, and causes a scandal.

Curiously there are no unique terms for "uncle", "aunt", "niece "and "nephew". They are compounds based on the primary kin terms, thus:

oayat'eLa "fatherbrother" paternal uncle
oayagira "fathersister" paternal aunt
aouagira "mothersister" maternal aunt
aouat'eLa "motherbrother" maternal uncle

oayat'eLa and aouagira also mean, generally "older male relative" and "older female relative", whether that refers to parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles, or older siblings.

Similarly eKanigira means either daughter or niece, (although the term eKanigirowa also exists for a more precise definition) and also generally "younger female relative". The same goes for eKanit'eLa. Here the gender and remove mutations are optional. The young gender forms, eKaniJ\ira and eKaniteLa are terms of endearment.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 4:24 pm 
Avisaru
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This is neither very interesting or particularly complicated, but here are the Khelivega social terms used on Old Verat (v1.05):

"First family" is the one you are born into, while the second are the terms for the birth-family of a woman's husband, as this society was originally patrilocal. Basically, Second would never be used unless Ego was a married woman.

First Family
mādēr - mother
badēr - father
prādēr - brother
svesōr - sister
sunu - son
tuxadēr - daughter
nuso - son's wife
xavō - grandfather
mādrū - mother's brother
nebōd - nephew

Second Family
bodi - husband
inadēr - wife of husband's brother
sveɕuro - parent-in-law “his father”
sveɕrū - parent-in-law “his mother”
ðāivēr - husband`s brother
jelū - husbands sister


anēr - ancestor
goli - boy
mako - child
vēnā - woman, wife
monu - man
evitū - widow

There are some gaps to be filled and improvements to be made, such as no term for "grandmother," or "parent's sister" or anything yet, and I suspect that there would be a general distinction between maternal and paternal relatives. This system will probably be similar to Omaha.

Edit:
Since I just posted these over in Quickies, I'll add them here too.
Naka Kinship

ānəjə - Mother
obəjə - Father
q˓arə - cousin
ɨtɕi - sibling
ɨʃwe - child

This system will probably tend towards being more generational.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:56 pm 
Avisaru
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In Määda:

father - jelä
mother - saala
brother - söma
sister - myla
son - ajalle
daughter - ete
husband - jlella
wife - ella
parent - heta
sibling - some
offspring - älla

Other relations would be expressed using a combination of the above.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:56 am 
Lebom
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The Qaldirin (speakers of Naqabna) don't consider family to be as important as social standing or group identity. Their words for sister and brother are the same as for girl and boy: jāmb /dZ_h{mb/ and nūlā /ny'l{/ respectively. They are usually used with a possesive to clarify relationship. Both are derived from (different) roots meaning "respect" (though different kinds). There is only one word for "child" which I haven't created yet. "Mother" is a basic term, qir /q_hi4/, but father is qirqeç /q_hi4qEtS/ which literally means "male mother" (and is rare in usage). This is because Qaldirin don't get married (though a father must financially support his children) and the mother raises the children herself. Note that Lhirhe (my conrace) females are physically much larger than males, and somewhat stronger because of evolutionary reasons, though the Qaldirin do not have a matriarchy.
Qaldirin consider the concept of grandparents to be irrelevant and so the closest word for grandparent is semb /sEmb/, which means "elder person."
Aunts and uncles are simply "my mother's sister," "my father's brother," etc.
Qaldirin society is considered radically different from other types of Lhirhe society, btw.

Edit: changed to BBCode instead of html

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ولا شفى وجد من يصبو إلى وتدِ
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Last edited by Khvaragh on Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:52 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 7:22 am 
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:37 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 3:42 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 11:19 am 
Smeric
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--- genetic kin ---
Parent laey /læj/
Father raely /rælj/
Mother caely /ɕælj/
Brother rild /rild/
Sister cild /ɕild/
Older Brother aeraeld /æræld/
Older Sister aecaeld /æɕæld/
Younger Brother arald /arald/
Younger Sister acald /aɕald/
Son rach /ratʃ/
Daughter cach /ɕatʃ/
--- fictive kin ---
Husband true /try:/
Wife tcue /tɕy:/
Godfather ueraely /yrælj/
Godmother uecaely /yɕælj/
Godson ue-rach /y:ratʃ/
Goddaughter ue-cach /y:ɕatʃ/

I'm not sure though if this culture has godparents and such.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 12:50 pm 
Sanci
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First of, I'd like to quickly describe the basics of how the Kazujishans define kinship and who belongs to a family. Everyone in Kazujisha has a family name, for instance Keianrah. Everyone with this family name is said to be related to each other no matter if they are adopted/from previous relationships/married into it etc.

When two persons get married, they usually take upon the female's family name, though exceptions are possible (often if the male's family is more prestigious or so). Their children get this family name, however they can change it into whatever the other family name was - which is handy if you want to marry someone with your family name, which is taboo.


With that said: Kazujisha uses two different vocabulary sets depending on whether you are speaking about your own family or someone else's.

Your own family:

family (name; relatives) - isutadan
family (where you are a parent) - hanozhava
family (where you are a child) - agalzhava

mother's mother - zhakesti
mother's father - zhakral
father's mother - ralkesti
father's father - ralakral
mother - zhagela
father - ralgetan; valdir

older sister - zhikibana
younger sister - zhivebana
older brother - rakihin
younger brother - ralahin

boyfriend - kebi
girlfriend - gebi
husband - báralan
wife - tsiavi
widow - zhikivan
widower - bakivan
child - vátsu; vaa
daughter - zhitsuje
son - bátsuke

Someone else's family:

family (name; relatives) - sybitadan
family (where you are a parent) - karezhava
family (where you are a child) - kaglazhava

mother's mother - zhugesti
mother's father - zhugral
father's mother - vahakesti
father's father - vahakral
mother - zhagula
father - vaharan

older sister - zhasaba
younger sister - zhaveba
older brother - rakiransa
younger brother - ralansa

boyfriend - skebi
girlfriend - sygebi
husband - bávestu
wife - tsivalha
widow - zhikise
widower - bakise
child - vaa
daughter - zhivelga
son - bátsuvelga

The word used for compounds meaning "adopted" is the same for all, kamitan-, as in kamitanralahin "my adopted younger brother", kamitanralansa "someone else's adopted younger brother"...
The compound word for "biological" is the same for all as well, televe-, as in televezhagela "my biological mother", televezhagula "someone else's biological mother"...

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:38 pm 
Avisaru
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Thank you, Qwynegold, and Avaja.

@Avaja, the Kazujisha feature "Kazujisha uses two different vocabulary sets depending on whether you are speaking about your own family or someone else's.", is interesting. In old-fashioned British English (as opposed to USAmerican real-estate-agent English), one's own house was a "home" but anyone else's was a "house".

Certain Australian and Oceanic languages have "triangular kinterms", which specify both the speaker's and the addressee's relationship to the referent.

In Kazujisha, how does the speaker refer to the second-person's relatives? By the "someone else's relatives" set of terms?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 2:23 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 10:45 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 1:51 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:55 pm 
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I recently scanned in my old Kissi notebook that I typed up from scattered notes during my culture shock phase after returning from Guinea in 1990. I didn't know very much about linguistics at the time (even less than I do now! :wink:) so you may see some interesting things.

I did the best I could with my standard typewriter ... I used a right square bracket to put the leg on my engs, and I used the outdated method of marking open o's as ö. Regular e is ɛ and é is e. Also, I had heard rumors that Kissi was a tonal language, but I didn't really even know what that meant at the time.

I remember quizzing my friend Jean Kamano one long, dreary afternoon during the rainy season. I think we both enjoyed the diversion.

I can't be bothered to retype all of this, so I'll just post the images from my pdfs. There are a few terms that incorporate numbers, and when I say 'etc.' that obviously means to continue in the numerical pattern. Here goes.





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Last edited by Wycoval on Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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