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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 2:10 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

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Some more verses from another song. I indicate the mutations I explained last page (lenition, nasal and mixed mutation).

I Blan en-engwasan, digabed valeghen,
[i.'blan ɛ.nɛ.'ŋwa.san di.'ga.bed va.'lɛ:n]
the plan(+len) of-invasion(+mix), deceive-VbN evil(+len),
The plan of invasion, an evil deception,

fengir han min air edh-righen negher
['fɛŋ.giɾ han min ajr ɛ.'ðɾi.ɛn nɛ:ɾ]
made-3P-PAST it-ACC in-the altar-PL of-kingdom(+mix) black
was made in the halls of the dark kingdom

na fortha ybint, na niga hyn il
[na 'fɔɾ.θa 'y.bint na 'ni.ga hyn il]
to steal-INF riches-PL-3PLPOSS to slay-INF them-ACC-M all-PL
to steal their riches, to slay them all,

na fegi hyn ghyna an new now
[na 'fɛ.gi hyn 'y.na a.'n:ɛw now]
to make-INF them-ACC-M kneel-INF for god(+nas) new
to make them kneel for a new god.

I Ghardh escedant i chyvin dhyrvil
[jaɾð ɛs.'kɛ.dant i.'çyvin 'ðyɾ.vil]
the guard wake-up-PAST the man-PL(+nas) sleeping-PL(+len)
The guard woke up the sleeping men

med i hun e-gurn e-mruns.
[med i.'hun ɛ.'guɾn ɛ.'mruns]
with the sound(+len) of-horn(+mix) of-bronze(+mix)
with the sound of a bronze horn.

I Unaveg ia gwin gerchior
['ju.na.vɛg ja gwin 'gɛɾ.çjoɾ]
the enemy already come-3S-PRES close-COMP(+len)
The enemy is getting closer,

ed paral levidh nain assalth!
[ɛ 'pa.ɾal 'lɛ.við najn as.'salθ]
so prepare-PL-IMP 2PL-REF for-the assault
so brace yourselves for assault!

Med phaith mi venint, niganner chuven aech
[med fajθ mi 'vɛ.nint ni.'ga.n:ɛɾ 'çu.vɛn aɛç]
with sword-PL in hand-PL-3PLPOSS(+len) kill-3P-PAST man(+len) each
Swords in their hands they killed each and every man

i aund engwedhi dirrint haint.
[jawnd ɛ.'ŋwɛ.ði 'di.rint hajnt]
REL dare-3S-PAST invade-INF land-PL-3PLPOSS(lent) holy-PL(+len)
who dared to invade their sacred lands.

Cemin e-'withuir althar min nuth,
['kɛ.min e.'wi.θyɾ al.θaɾ min nuθ]
song-PL of-victory(+mix) rise-PL-PRES in-the night
Victory songs are rising in the night,

dhegel furthent ar gurdhaghent umurthel el.
['ðɛ.gɛl 'fuɾ.θɛnt a guɾ.'ða.ɛnt u.'muɾ.θɛl ɛl]
saying(+len) strength-3PLPOSS and might-3PLPOSS immortal all
telling all of their undying strength and might.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 1:43 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:01 am 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain
On to verbal morphology:

Verbs

There are two main conjugation classes: a-verbs or derived verbs (the last is a Sindarin term), which I've related to the Latin first conjugation (-o/-are); and i-verbs or basic verbs (the Sindarin terms), which I've related to the rest of Latin conjugations (-eo/-ere, -o/-ere, -io/-ere, -io/-ire).

I already gave the rules to end up with the useable verbal roots: for the a-verbs, it should end in -a; for the rest, in a consonant. (For example, ava- for to love and hav- for to have).

Verbs indicate tense and number, but not mood or aspect (adverbs should help on that, or other particles). Person is also indicated by means of suffixes closely related to noun possessive suffixes. Among the non-finite forms, there is an infinitive, a verbal noun, and two participles: active and passive. The active participle can act as a gerund. Of all these, only the passive participle should form a plural.

a-verbs

ava-

Infinitive: ava to love
Verbal noun: avad loving, love (n.)
Active participle: avol loving, lover (Latinism avant also happens).
Passive participle: avannen pl. evennin loved

Now I'll give the finite forms in order: 1S, 2S, 3S, 1PL, 2PL, 3PL (Note that 3S and 3PL are also impersonal S and PL, repectively). In parentheses I give the less-preferred forms.

Present tense: avon, avach (or avog), ava, avam, aval, avar I love, you love...
Past tense: avannen, avanneg/avannech, avant, avannem, avannel, avanner. I loved, you loved...
Future tense: avathon, avathach (or avathog), avatha, avatham, avathal, avathar I'll love, you'll love...
Conditional tense: avathannen, avathanneg/avathannech, avathant, avathannem, avathannel, avathanner I'd love, you'd love...

Conditional tense is my own extrapolation, it doesn't even exist or is hinted at in Sindarin.

i-verbs

Note: these verbs undergo i-mutation in many of their forms, because of the linking vowel -i- (hence their name).

hav-

Infinitive: hevi to have
Verbal noun: haved a possession, a having
Active participle: havel having, possessor
Passive participle: hammen* had, possessed

*This is going to be explained in the past tense.

Present tense: hevin, hevig/hevich, haf**, hevim, hevil, hevir I have, you have... ** final <f> is /v/ and [v]. Merely orthographical.
Future tense: hevithon, hevithach (or hevithog), hevitha, hevitham, hevithal, hevithar I'll have, you'll have...
Conditional tense: hevithannen, hevithanneg/hevithannech, hevithannem, hevithannel, hevithanner I'd have, you'd have...

Past tense.

Past tense in i-verbs or "primitive" verbs is made by means of n-infixion, generally nasal infixion, if possible. The past participle is like the first person of the past simple, only that with -en rather than -in (it's plural would be equal).

This consists on inserting a nasal before the final, single consonant of the verb's root. However, this is not a modern development, this presumably happened in the proto-language as well. Consequently, we'll see changes that work as if the nasal infixion operated back then and not now, undergoing the historical changes. On with examples:

-Labial roots:

sab- < *sape- to know, past tense: samp (samm-) < *sampe knew
hav- < *habe- to have, past tense: hamb (hamm-) < *hambe had
iv- < *eme- to buy, past tense: im (im-) < *emme bought

So the past tense of hav- was: hemmin, hemmig/hemmich, hamb, hemmim, hemmil, hemmir. I had, you had, ...

-Dental roots:

pid- < *pete- to ask for, past tense: pint (pinn-) < *pente asked for
cadh- < *cade- to fall, past tense: cand (cann-) < *cande fell
can- < *cane- to sing, past tense: cann (cann-) < *canne sang

As you can see, this mechanism can produce mergers in the past tense.

-Velar roots:

deg-- < *dice- to say, past tense: denc* (deng-) < *dince said
agh-- < *age- to perform, past tense: ang (ang-) < *ange performed

plow- < *plogwe- to rain, past tense: plung (plungw-) < *plongwe rained

*I was wrong spelling **deng before, denc is the correct form.

As you can see, phonology and diachronics make a great part of the language.

--

I'm not sure of how to continue from here. I welcome any suggestions in case somebody is interested in a particular part of the grammar or syntax.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 4:05 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain
Oh, I forgot to include L-stems. There the n-infixion, producing *-nl-, develops into -ll- (that's the importance of double L).

So the past tense of gwol (he wants) is gwoll (he wanted).

In case n-infixion can't be carried out because there would result a very complicate cluster, there's an alternative ending -ent mirroring first conjugation's -ant (it treats endings the same way the other one does, as well). For example, nach (he is born) makes its past as nachent (he was born).


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 4:32 pm 
Smeric
Smeric
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:05 pm
Posts: 1273

_________________
Online dictionary for my conlang Vanga: http://royalrailway.com/tungumaalMiin/Vanga/

#undef FEMALE

I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688

Of an Ernst'ian one.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 4:48 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:25 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:07 pm
Posts: 1258
Location: Miracle, Inc. Headquarters
Do you want some texts to translate from Latin? It might be a way for you to figure out what parts of the grammar you should present next.

I have Wheelock's Latin at home, and the Sententiae Antiquae might be a good translation source.

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[bɹ̠ˤʷɪs.təɫ]
Nōn quālibet inīquā cupiditāte illectus hoc agō
Yo te pongo en tu lugar...
Taisc mach Daró


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:44 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 8:02 pm 
Smeric
Smeric
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:05 pm
Posts: 1273

_________________
Online dictionary for my conlang Vanga: http://royalrailway.com/tungumaalMiin/Vanga/

#undef FEMALE

I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688

Of an Ernst'ian one.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:05 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:07 pm
Posts: 1258
Location: Miracle, Inc. Headquarters
I like that English inspired neologisms are present.

I guess I'd vote for nominal clauses, then relative clauses.

_________________
[bɹ̠ˤʷɪs.təɫ]
Nōn quālibet inīquā cupiditāte illectus hoc agō
Yo te pongo en tu lugar...
Taisc mach Daró


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:39 am 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:39 am 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
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Location: Spain


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:33 pm 
Lebom
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Much of the grammar is based on Sindarin, if I recall correctly. You could base the order of your description on the Sindarin grammar from Ardalambion.
Or any language really, but that one would probably make more sense to use as a guide because it would deal with more of the same things.

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I get a big kick out of playing my own language game–it’s a unique thrill only conlangers know.
- J Burke


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 1:55 pm 
Avisaru
Avisaru

Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:51 pm
Posts: 430
This seems to be going very well. However, could you please write some general explanation for your orthography, sound changes and mutations? They all seem fairly confusing.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 5:46 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
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Location: Spain


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2011 5:14 pm 
Smeric
Smeric

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 2085
Location: Spain
Ok, I'm going to attempt to describe syntax. I apologize in advance if I forget something, since I'll do this a bit chaotic.

General unmarked word order is SVO. For example:

I lob gab i geru.
ART wolf seize-PR ART deer
The wolf hunts the deer.

If you want to emphasize the direct object, you can front it making the word order OVS. In this, since it's going to be definite, you drop the article. By doing this, you can differentiate between:

Geru gab i lob.
(+len.)deer seize-PR the wolf.
As for the deer, the wolf hunts it. (The wolf hunts the deer.)

Ceru gab i lob. (rare, but grammatical)
deer seize-PR the wolf.
A deer hunts the wolf. (rare, but grammatical)

since a direct object always undergoes grammatical lenition where the subject doesn't. With the singular article, this is neutralized (since it lenites); but as long as it is omitted, there's a distinction for nouns which have distinct lenited forms. In other situations, you'll have to make use of context, poetic word order OSV
(Geru i lob gab.), or pronouns to specify it's the object. For example:

Lob so 'wedh.
wolf he see-PR.
A wolf sees.

Lob hon 'wedh.
wolf him see-PR
Somebody sees the wolf (As for the wolf, somebody sees it).

(Yes, the wolf is being treated as an animate male. The lenited form of lob is lob too.)

Since there isn't a proper passive, these strategies above can help emphasize direct objects.

Silladen is pro-drop; in fact, it's "pro-abhorrent". You almost always indicate the subject pronoun in the verb, with an ending, and if you want to emphasize you got emphatic pronouns:

Clavon nin Iohan.
call-PR-1S me Iohan
My name is Iohan.

Im glava nin Iohan.
I-emph call-PR me Iohan
As for me, my name is Iohan.

Direct and indirect object pronouns are almost always differentiated by syntax, as in English, since the "dative clusters" are emphatic, the only one in common use being enni (to me). Normal nouns are introduced by the dative preposition an "for, to". Normal sentence order is SVDI. Both direct and indirect objects undergo lenition (if no other mutation is present).

Imin dhad gin.
buy-PS-1S present (+len.)you
I bought you a present.

Imin han am Mair.
buy-PS-1S it for Mary
I bought it for Mary.

Imin han enni.
buy-PS-1S it for-me
I bought it for myself.

However, if the IO is short and the DO is long, SVID is tolerated:

Dunant hen i gest i-fluir.
give-PS her ART basket ART-flower-PL
He gave her the basket of flowers.

The IO is fronted as many other elements in the sentence; just put it in the front and separate it from the sentence with a comma, replacing it later with a pronoun or omitting it altogether:

Am Mair, dunant hen i gest i-fluir.
for Mary, give-PS her ART basket ART-flower-PL
He gave her the basket of flowers.
As for Mary, he gave her the basket of flowers.

Intransitive verbs work like the above but without all the complications for direct objects. Normally adverbs and the rest of complements are placed after the verb (lenited if directly after) and after the major complements (IO, DO, etc.) Word order is less strict with this and we can also place them before the verb for emphasis..

Gwedhin nain gewithad.
go-PR-1S to-the city
I go to the city.

Gwennin chir.
go-PS-1S (+len.)yesterday
I went yesterday.

Hir gwennin.
yesterday go-PS-1S
Yesterday I went.

Attributive sentences are formed with or without a copula. The copula is na (past nant or ne), which works as an a-verb. The attribute is, as a norm, unlenited, specially copula-less.

I ber vun.
ART boy (+len)good
The good boy. (noun phrase)

I ber bun. or I ber na bun.
ART boy (be-PR)good
The boy is good.

I believe these are the key points for now.


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