ikr, I used to spend most of my allowance on penny arcades when I was a kid, I just never ran into that particular game. Maybe I'm younger than you? or perhaps Salvador's penny arcades got mostly vintage material ?Sinjana wrote:I know, now tell that to my former 9-year old self.
What do these languages have in common?
Re: What do these languages have in common?
- Ser
- Smeric
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
Erm, I played it on an N64... Never seen it in arcades either. According to this, it was published in 1998 for the N64, so it was four years old then...
Oh, I just realized the image I gave wasn't the right one >< , but for some old-ass version of the game or sth. xD
Oh, I just realized the image I gave wasn't the right one >< , but for some old-ass version of the game or sth. xD
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Did it turn out to be impossible to translate?Sinjana wrote:But that's because you speak English, do you think I was relieved to learn English didn't have gender agreement? Nope, I thought things would just be impossible to translate from my native Spanish. It can be quite useful to have to make indirect references to gender all the time. Don't confuse "simplicity" with "closer to English" either. Just think of what it'd be for a language to not distinguish "he/she/it" (as Chinese does). Do you find the distinction between "he/she/it" useful? Why? Or why not? What about the distinction between "you" and "he/she/it"?
By gender agreement, i'm referring to having to know which version of "the" needed if the chair has is butch or femme. By number agreement i mean switching between is and are depending on how many of it/them there are. Do you guys call those something else? i want to get on the same page.
- Salmoneus
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
Stop passive-aggressively reporting every post that doesn't directly reply to you. You aren't the centre of the universe, and you're not a toddler either. Stop wasting my time.
Yng: no, so far as I know he doesn't read the board, or indeed pay attention to anything that isn't himself. He just comes along every now and then to complain that we drive in parkways and park in driveways, and then throws a temper-tantrum when the thread drifts to something actually interesting.
Yng: no, so far as I know he doesn't read the board, or indeed pay attention to anything that isn't himself. He just comes along every now and then to complain that we drive in parkways and park in driveways, and then throws a temper-tantrum when the thread drifts to something actually interesting.
Blog: [url]http://vacuouswastrel.wordpress.com/[/url]
But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!
But the river tripped on her by and by, lapping
as though her heart was brook: Why, why, why! Weh, O weh
I'se so silly to be flowing but I no canna stay!
Re: What do these languages have in common?
My L1 has lots of agreement, but I didn't think about it at all when learning English.Sinjana wrote:But that's because you speak English, do you think I was relieved to learn English didn't have gender agreement? Nope, I thought things would just be impossible to translate from my native Spanish.Apeiron wrote:i'll go by which ever moves toward simplicity. Gender and number agreement don't contribute anything (as far as i can see), so i'll likely ditch them.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
grrrraasdlkfjsdlkjApeiron wrote:i'll go by which ever moves toward simplicity. Gender and number agreement don't contribute anything (as far as i can see), so i'll likely ditch them. But first, i wanna know how they compare. i'm expecting this to be challenging. That's what makes it interesting to me. Plus, i'll learn a great deal along the way.
This really needs to be mandatory reading for anybody interested in making an auxlang.
Redundancy is not a bug, it is a feature! If you take all the redundancy out of your language, we will just have to add it back in to make the language usable!The Wiki, emphasis added, wrote:Redundancy in information theory is the number of bits used to transmit a message minus the number of bits of actual information in the message. Informally, it is the amount of wasted "space" used to transmit certain data. Data compression is a way to reduce or eliminate unwanted redundancy, while checksums are a way of adding desired redundancy for purposes of error detection when communicating over a noisy channel of limited capacity.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Quite so. Though sometime people are a little too quick with the "read the internets noob!" posts, they have a point, and when you annoy people it's smart to figure why, rather than deciding to annoy the mods instead. Besides, the question got answered, so focussing on other posts seems particularly pointless.Salmoneus wrote:Stop passive-aggressively reporting every post that doesn't directly reply to you. You aren't the centre of the universe, and you're not a toddler either. Stop wasting my time.
(Edit: just in case it's not clear, this is addressed to Apeiron, in support of Sal's mod comment.)
Re: What do these languages have in common?
What was the argument that you had in mind at the time (when you were a child/teenager, I assume)?But that's because you speak English, do you think I was relieved to learn English didn't have gender agreement? Nope, I thought things would just be impossible to translate from my native Spanish.
Was it simply this?It can be quite useful to have to make indirect references to gender all the time.
Some more that come to mind:Instead of adding roots, take some time to remove some: find ways to make the word out of other roots (like = love a little; ice = solid water; uncle = parent-sib; six = twice three), or double up (one word could serve for road, route, street, path, way, passage).
- die, kill
- learn, teach, lesson, school
- wood, tree, forest, branch, twig
- water, lake, ocean, snow, river
- friend, love (compare Latin "amícus and "amáre")
- between, middle, center, heart
I think that it'd be interesting to perform an analysis on languages and their entropy per phone/syllable/mora, instead of their letters/characters, which is what I usually see/read.This really needs to be mandatory reading for anybody interested in making an auxlang.
For an auxlang, sure, having less phonemic vowels has the advantage in that more people could say the words, but having more will probably give an utterance more entropy.
Understatement much? Realize this: You will have to make trade-offs. Sometimes there is no perfect answer to a problem.But first, i wanna know how they compare. i'm expecting this to be challenging.
Sure, excluding /?\/ from your consonant inventory is probably safe, but what about keeping /p/? It's not as common as you think. Both Japanese and Arabic have lost it. The former retains it only in geminated cases and loanwords, and the latter only in loanwords, if it's not already Arabized. In both cases it evolved into /f/. (Arabic experts feel free to correct me.) And if you do include it, should you include /f/ too then?
Re: What do these languages have in common?
You are right that Japanese lost /p/ in its native and Sino-Japanese vocabulary except in geminates. However it would be a mistake to say that /p/ is not a living phoneme in Japanese. It occurs not only in a huge number of recent loan words (as you say), but it's also found frequently in native Japanese onomatopoeia and mimetic words, e.g. pichipichi 'tight fitting' or 'quick and full of energy', chupachupa (sucking, e.g. with a straw), patto 'suddenly; briefly'.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Thanks, I forgot about those.You are right that Japanese lost /p/ in its native and Sino-Japanese vocabulary except in geminates. However it would be a mistake to say that /p/ is not a living phoneme in Japanese. It occurs not only in a huge number of recent loan words (as you say), but it's also found frequently in native Japanese onomatopoeia and mimetic words, e.g. pichipichi 'tight fitting' or 'quick and full of energy', chupachupa (sucking, e.g. with a straw), patto 'suddenly; briefly'.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Have you read the various essays by Rick Morneau? His Lexical Semantics is, imo, pretty much THE IAL to end all IALs.Apeiron wrote:English, French, Spanish, Russian, Arabic and Chinese.
For instance, what is the most common word order? Are they mostly agglutinating or gluten free? i'm wondering if there are user affordances i could use to my advantage, or traits to completely avoid. The order of the list indicates the relative weight they should receive. So if i'm choosing between word orders, i'd rather confuse Arabic speakers than French and Russian speakers.
My project is an International Auxlang that would be manageable by the speakers of those languages, or as many as possible.
- Skomakar'n
- Smeric
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
Please tell me chupachupa is a Romance loan and not a coïncidence.clawgrip wrote:You are right that Japanese lost /p/ in its native and Sino-Japanese vocabulary except in geminates. However it would be a mistake to say that /p/ is not a living phoneme in Japanese. It occurs not only in a huge number of recent loan words (as you say), but it's also found frequently in native Japanese onomatopoeia and mimetic words, e.g. pichipichi 'tight fitting' or 'quick and full of energy', chupachupa (sucking, e.g. with a straw), patto 'suddenly; briefly'.
Online dictionary for my conlang Vanga: http://royalrailway.com/tungumaalMiin/Vanga/
#undef FEMALE
I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688
Of an Ernst'ian one.
#undef FEMALE
I'd love for you to try my game out! Here's the forum thread about it:
http://zbb.spinnwebe.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=36688
Of an Ernst'ian one.
-
- Avisaru
- Posts: 704
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
No? It's onomatopoeic.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Yeah, it's a false cognate, and is onomatopoeic, as Bob Johnson says. But it's a very convenient false cognate for the Chupa Chups company!
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Inb4 someone spots a chupacabra in Japan. (chupayagi?)
Re: What do these languages have in common?
God killed a kitten because of you.Skomakar'n wrote:coïncidence
- Herr Dunkel
- Smeric
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
He is, apparently, French.Astraios wrote:God killed a kitten because of you.Skomakar'n wrote:coïncidence
sano wrote:To my dearest Darkgamma,
http://www.dazzlejunction.com/greetings/thanks/thank-you-bear.gif
Sincerely,
sano
Re: What do these languages have in common?
*cöïncïdëncë
Mëtäl ümläüt rülëz!
Mëtäl ümläüt rülëz!
The conlanger formerly known as “the conlanger formerly known as Pole, the”.
If we don't study the mistakes of the future we're doomed to repeat them for the first time.
If we don't study the mistakes of the future we're doomed to repeat them for the first time.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
He must have done it fore þe æstheticſ.Astraios wrote:God killed a kitten because of you.Skomakar'n wrote:coïncidence
Re: What do these languages have in common?
A native Russian ITT, am glad to answer your questions.
Pretty so: SVO is prevalent (but other variants are pretty common too), LOTS of prefixes and suffixes, mostly adjective-noun, both variants of possessivity, prepositions only. The word order is determined mostly by the topic of the sentence, to accent some important information.Sentence order
(1) VSO, Head initial, many prefixes, noun-adjective, possessed-possessor, prepositions
(5) SOV, Head final, lots of suffixes, adjective-noun, possessor-possessed, postpositions
Russian: 3???
I'd mark Russian with 3+. Vowel system is simple, but most consonants have meaningful palatalized phonemes, for example. Most words tend to be polysyllabic due to the synthetic derivation. But syllables can be rather weird: the first one in встре-ча (a meeting) has 4 consonants and is open, пче-ла (a bee) has stop+affricate, so on.General phonetic inventory size
(1) very simple syllables, few different consonants and vowels, words have lots of syllables
(5) very complex syllables, lots of different consonants and vowels, words have few syllables
Russian: 2~3??
You are right. Traditionally Russian has 6 cases, but vocative (which is common in the informal everyday speech only) could be separated as the 7th.- Russian has case marking (6 or 7 cases if I'm correct)
Please don't forget about unstressed allophones, they are crucial for the normative pronunciation.Russian: 6 (an analysis with 5 vowels is popular too)
(2B)||(!2B)
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Yuuri wrote:Please don't forget about unstressed allophones, they are crucial for the normative pronunciation.Russian: 6 (an analysis with 5 vowels is popular too)
Yuuri wrote:Please don't forget about unstressed allophones, they are crucial for the normative pronunciation.
Yuuri wrote:Please don't forget about unstressed allophones, they are crucial for the normative pronunciation.
Yuuri wrote:allophones
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific
________
MY MUSIC
________
MY MUSIC
Re: What do these languages have in common?
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
It's called tact.
- Ser
- Smeric
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Re: What do these languages have in common?
Since we're comparing languages, we're only considering phonemic analyses of the vowels. I've read analyses of Spanish vowels that go for like 14 allophones for the monophthongs (and only the monophthongs!), but that wouldn't be useful here.Yuuri wrote:Please don't forget about unstressed allophones, they are crucial for the normative pronunciation.Russian: 6 (an analysis with 5 vowels is popular too)
Re: What do these languages have in common?
God! For which variety?Sinjana wrote:languages, we're only considering phonemic analyses of the vowels. I've read analyses of Spanish vowels that go for like 14 allophones for the monophthongs (and only the monophthongs!), but that wouldn't be useful here.
Re: What do these languages have in common?
Thanks for the brief. My deep apologies to Mr. Es·nd·r Ajpṡop for my irrelevant comment.Sinjana wrote:Since we're comparing languages, we're only considering phonemic analyses of the vowels.
(2B)||(!2B)