Narin, an alien triconsonantal language

[Vardelm]

It's just attempting to hide behind a façade of "alien" that's the issue.

I would say the issue is saying you want a conlang to be both natural and alien, and then not defining what "alien" means, or having any particular basis for why those features exist. Making a "natural" language means having at least a semi-plausible justification for why each feature is implemented. The ZBB's value lies in evaluating language features for what seems natural and what constitutes "semi-plausible". If you request input on whether your language is "natural" or not and discard that feedback, then the ZBB has no value. Likewise, if you decide that a feature will be "alien", with no attempt to explain it, then there is also not much point in requesting feedback from the ZBB because then there is no objective way to evaluate the language because, by definition, it's not something seen in natural languages. At that point, you're asking "Hey guys, do you like my lang?", and the feedback will be purely subjective, ranging from "Awesome!" to "Sucks."

[DePaw]

Vardhelm,

Thanks. I may go with 'man(erg) see(3S, present)' to be weird, but part of me wants to do a natural ergative language, partially to understand them better.


The Narin and the other races of Hexapodia are indeed aliens in that they live on a different planet and are quite different from Humans. For a start vertebrates evolved with six limbs instead of four, hence the name. The Narin specifically look like cat centaurs (that is a centaur body shape walking on four limbs then going vertically upwards, but cat all over), with two bushy tails.

The intelligent races of Hexapodia mostly have face structures similar to Humans though, hence the human-y phonology. Narin have no labial-dental consonants though as they have sharp carnivorous teeth, for example.

One of the secrets of Hexapodia is that their second sun isn't actually a star but an artificial construct that provides equal apparent brightness to the star Hexapodia, which gives very interesting seasons: summer is characterised with no night, just day for several months, and winter by the existence of nights (spring/autumn have nights of varying lengths). There are also artefacts found across the planet, which seem to be remnants of an ancient and advanced civilisation, possibly from another planet/system. Some religions on Hexapodia believe that this ancient race created life on Hexapodia and worship them as gods.

[Vardelm]

I may go with 'man(erg) see(3S, present)' to be weird, but part of me wants to do a natural ergative language, partially to understand them better.

Have you read grammars of any ergative languages? If not, start looking for some online. You can find quite a few language grammars as PDF files, and Google Books has previews that can be useful as well. If you never actually read through grammars of other languages, your own constructed languages won't have nearly as much quality (read: "naturality").

[DePaw]

Thanks Vardelm.

Been working on a script for Narin, and the Tloko script inspired me, this system is semi-logographic and based on a 4x5 grid with links between dots. Unjoined dots are usually ignored in making the logographic picture, that it they're seen as invisible by the reader, they are seen as part of the picture of certain words though.

Examples:

Anraan berghe sokarh (the narin killed the dog).

anraan berghe sokarh_2.png (547 Bytes) Viewed 3356 times

Naarna dosuroo (the narin talked to each other).

naarna dosuroo_2.png (513 Bytes) Viewed 3356 times

The first three lines are a logograph expressing the word's root (eg n-r-n, b-r-gh), and the bottom two lines express the vowels, the link betweenthe 3rd and 4th line expresses the type of word it is (erg noun, abs noun, verb, or biconsonantal). A link between the 4th and 5th lines makes the noun plural, and is placed on the opposite side to the erg/abs link marker. The erg link is on the left, abs right, verb middle right, bi-root middle left, so a plural erg noun would have the plural marker on the right, and an abs would have it on the left, as in the examples above.

In the first example the root are 'narin' 'dog' and 'to kill'. In the second they are 'narin' 'talk/speak' and '(blank)'. The blank root is used for non-consonantal affixes such as '-oo' (reflexive), and uses the biconsonantal root link marker (middle left).

The Narin is depicted as a creature with three sets of limbs and two tails, that's a head looking backwards on the top right. 'Dog' is a dog's head. 'Kill' is a knive. 'Speak' is two open mouths facing each other. Blank is a spiral.

Here are the vowels:

Vowels: A E I O U

vowels.png (279 Bytes) Viewed 3356 times

[DePaw]

No comments?

[DePaw]

Full tower of Babel story:

Mis utlazh dosru bal pag disra nam rozak.
world(erg) whole(adj,erg) language(abS) one and(nouns) speech(abs) same had(3S PP)
1 Now the whole world had one language and a common speech.

Dasra poshur-rhus sash, tiir som shugpa fomun “Shinri”-varh, pug logh bolhuk-ugh.
people(abs) travel(3P PP)=anti.passive=as east, they(erg) land(abs) flat(adj,abs) find(3P PP) Shinar=in, and(conj) there(abs) live(3P PP)=dynamic
2 As people moved eastwatd, they found a plain in Shinar and settled there.

Toor dosuroo, “Garhush, ghop seruf, pug tor ferur shirh”. Tiir ghop kemna-pib tokugh, pug nedka leshka-pib.
they(abs) speak(3P PP)=reflexive, “come(3P Pr), bricks(abs) make(3P, fut), and(conj) them(abs) bake(3P, fut) thoroughly”. they(erg) brick(abs) stone(abs)=instead.of use(3P PP), and(conj) tar(abs) mortar(abs)=instead.of
3 They said to each other, “Come, let’s make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar.

Shuz toor dosur-rhus, “Garhush, khigti seruf zoorh-ner, ten khisgi som nok kughus, ped ziirh suzkho seruf zoorh-ner, shot ziirh nighzu-milh mos zotarh talh”.
then they(abs) say(3P PP)=anti.passive, “come(3P, Pr) city(abs) build(3P, fut) us(abs)=for, with tower(abs) that heaven(abs) reach(3S, fut), so we(erg) name(abs) make(3P, fut) us=for; otherwise we(erg) scattered(abs)=copula(fut) earth(abs) whole(abs) over”
4 Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves; otherwise we will be scattered over the face of the whole earth.”

Dum Kilarda gorhash-rhus shan, khigti shakas-resh, pag khisgi rhuk dasra surif.
but lord(abs) come(3S, PP)=anti.passive down, city(abs) see(inf)=in.order.to, and(noun) tower(abs) that people(abs) build(3P, PI)
5 But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower the people were building.

Kilarda dosar-rhus, “ghaz adsar bal dosru nam dasur, tiir shon gulid, shuz tiir zi-tonh nebus-bak zi-khutma-milh.
lord(abs) say(3S,PP)=anti.passive, “if people(erg) one(erg) language(abs) same(abs) speak(3P,pr), they(erg) this(abs) begin(3P,PI), then they(erg) negative=thing(abs) plan(3P,fut)=passive negative=possible(adj)=copula(fut)
6 The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.

Garhush, zoorh lufan-rhus shan, pug dosru teer zutarh, toor zi-sesunoo-resh.
come(3P,pr), us(abs) go(2P,fut)=anti.passive down, and(conj) language(abs) they(gen) confuse(2P,fut), they(abs) negative=understand(3P,fut)=reflexive=in.order.to
7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

Ped ki-alrad toor noghaz mos-talh nhorh, pug tiir khisgi-sifra tolul.
so lord(erg) them(abs) scatter(3S,PP) earth(abs)=over all(abs), and(conj) they(erg) city(abs)-building(process,abs) stop(3P,pp)
8 So the Lord scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city.

Tir “Bibli” sezikh-vut, vut Kalrad dosru mos tulzha zotarh. Logh Kalrad mos-talh sashka zotarh noghaz.
it(erg) babel(abs) call(3S,pr)=reason, because god=lord(erg) language(abs) world(abs) whole(abs,adj) confuse(3S,PP). there(abs) lord(erg) earth(abs)=over face(abs) whole(abs,adj) scatter(3S,PP)
9 That is why it was called Babel[c]—because there the Lord confused the language of the whole world. From there the Lord scattered them over the face of the whole earth.


I used the root 'B-B-L' for Babel, and 'L-R-D' for Lord, the latter taking the 'k(i)-' honorific for gods.

Some more sentences, the start of the Narin's religious text:

Kimarna sutob-ralh
kimarna(abs) praise(present, 2P)=imperative.mood
Praise Kimarna (their god).

Bilhnhu-malh, rhuk Kamran zorh-nhorh rhutut lhos zoorh ketarh-rhus / lhos katti.
write(abs,abspart)=copula(pres) that(?) kimarna(erg) us(abs)=all judge(fut,3S) when we(abs) die(pres,1P)=anti.passive / when die(instant,abs).
It is written that Kimarna will judge us all when we die / at the moment of death.

Kizpit zoorh rezik-ven.
god=to.be.safe(erg,place) us(abs) hold(3S,pres)=optative.mood
May Haven hold us.

[DePaw]

Been working on the script a bit and come up with a style of it that looks more written while still having the same encoding as the script I've shown previously, now called the 'monument' script. I basically smoothed ends of lines and corners, and deleted unused dots.

Here's some examples.

[Herr Dunkel]

I like the script quite a lot, just chiming in.

[DePaw]

I like the script quite a lot, just chiming in.

Thanks dude!

[DePaw]

Here's the numbers:
1 - bal
2 - dush
3 - ghiz
4 - mem
5 - lonh
6 - reg
7 - palh
8 - nurh

9 - balobal / nurhobal
10 - balodush / nurhobal

Yes, they use base 8, but I'm listing 9 and 10 for the sake of Janko mostly. Unless I write [8] after a number, I'm using base 10.

64 - zod
100 - balamemomem / zodamemomem (144[8])
512 - nib


I've also attached the writing system for numbers.

It reads:
1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8
+8 + 12 + 16 +20 (making 24[10]/30[8] the highest number writeable in a single digit)
1/2 1/3 1/4 1/24
+ - x /
1/2 + 1/4 = 3 x 1/4


They only write fractions as 1/ a number, and get very creative at writing other fractions. The equals symbol is the same as 'to speak', if anyone noticed. Addition is stacking piles, subtraction is taking that top pile away, multiplication is many stacks, and divide is the fraction line.

No vowels are written with maths, and is an easy way to tell that a symbol means a number.

To write a number higher than 24[10]/30[8] then two numbers are written next to each other. For example a 3 then a 6 means 36[8], 3 then a 30[8] would mean 330[8].