You Are Leaving The American Sector

GreenBowTie · Post by **GreenBowTie** » Fri Oct 11, 2002 2:05 am

(I'm not quite certain if this is the right forum for this type of post, so if it isn't please be kind.)

I've attempted a Verdurian translation of the famous House on Checkpoint Charlie sign ("You are leaving the American sector"), but, since I'm obviously not fluent in Verdurian, I have some questions. About almost every facet of the sentence, actually. I'm quite the beginner. ;-)

Here's what I've got so far:

<BLOCKQUOTE>Tu f?se so am?ricanem nazh.
Tu f?se soa am?rican? sazhuna.
Tu f?se soa am?rican? shana.</BLOCKQUOTE>
Those are the three possibilities I've come up with. My questions are these:

1. Is it correct to use the impersonal "tu" on a sign like that?
2. Is "f?sir" the right verb, and if so, does the place you're leaving take the accusative?
3. What is the adjective for "American"?
4. Were any of those the right word to use for "sector" (which, in this case, is both a political and military context, I'd think)?

Thanks.

So Haleza Grise · Post by **So Haleza Grise** » Fri Oct 11, 2002 3:48 am

Mark can correct me if i'm wrong on any of the following points.

(1) From what I know about the impersonal tu, I'd say: "maybe". It probably would be out of place as a formal "you", but in a general sense ("when people leave this place, they are leaving the American zone") I'd say it works. It's a complicated and subtly nuanced pronoun though, and I'm no visanom.

(2) Yes, well the verb is marked in the dictionary as transitive, so I would say yes. Although I'm pretty sure that you'd also be able to say "from the Verdurian zone" and thus mark the none in the genitive or de. In fact to me, this usage feels right - maybe I'm just getting carried away.

(3) Well, i would most probably say "the zone of America" (Americe), or maybe "the zone of the Americans", with Americans as americiloi.

(4) Although it is a political and military context, it feels wrong to call it a nazh since it's not self-governing or a shana because it's not really a division of a larger unified political unit. To my mind sazhuna might be best out of those, or maybe even just a chel.

You should take these all as suggestions, rather than any sort of definitive answers.

Oh yes, and the queries about every part of the sentence: don't worry. It only shows you're concerned to sound natural

.

--Rhisto Filipei

Post by **zompist** » Fri Oct 11, 2002 11:00 am

For a Xurnese, Haleza, you're doing pretty well with Verdurian.

Impersonal tu is quite right here, as is the verb. And the genitive of Am?rica is most natural here.

As for 'sector', Sazhuna would work; another possibility is keshana 'borough', which doesn't have the military feel to it, but the size is right for the American sector of Berlin (or Barlin as the Verdurians would say).

GreenBowTie · Post by **GreenBowTie** » Fri Oct 11, 2002 7:52 pm

So it would be "Tu f?se soa sazhuna am?ricane"? (And am?ricane keeps the accent, right?)

Post by **zompist** » Sat Oct 12, 2002 12:59 am

GreenBowTie wrote:So it would be "Tu f?se soa sazhuna am?ricane"? (And am?ricane keeps the accent, right?)

Just "am?rice" (genitive of Am?rica).

GreenBowTie · Post by **GreenBowTie** » Sat Oct 12, 2002 1:52 am

Well. I tried it with some other Almean languages as well. I'm not sure how good a job I did, especially with Elkar?l (I'm convinced Mark Rosenfelder is taking some seriously powerful drugs), but here goes:

ISMA?N
Lolr izure se amerik[?n/as] s?ne.

BARAKHINEI
L? faich? (il) thur am?r?kane mashtanach.

CADHINOR
Let scannaa americae feus.

KEBRENI
(Falau) z'ada ebu ameriken [haiknu/gonarei/noh'a].

ELKAR?L
Put n??m tq?l-tora ?melika khakch.

The parentheses are where I wasn't sure whether or not a word was necessary, and the brackets are where I didn't know which word or inflection to use (how come none of these languages have words like "section" and "part"?). I can't believe I spent so much time on this.

pne · Post by **pne** » Sat Oct 12, 2002 4:42 am

GreenBowTie wrote:CADHINOR
Let scannaa americae feus.

Cadhinor, like Verdurian, is pro-drop; since the inflection determines the person, you can leave off the "Let". And I think the ablative makes more sense in Cadhinor if you're leaving "away from" somewhere: Scannad Americae feus. BICBW about the case usage.

Post by **zompist** » Sun Oct 13, 2002 9:18 pm

GreenBowTie wrote:Well. I tried it with some other Almean languages as well. I'm not sure how good a job I did, especially with Elkar?l (I'm convinced Mark Rosenfelder is taking some seriously powerful drugs), but here goes:

ISMA?N
Lolr izure se amerik[?n/as] s?ne.

Assuming the country is Amrice, the adjective would be Amric?n.

GreenBowTie wrote:BARAKHINEI
L? faich? (il) thur am?r?kane mashtanach.

Faichi is irregular, and I'd make the adjective am?rikei, giving:

L? faoch? thur am?rike mashtanach.

For Cadhinor, see Philip (pne)'s post.

GreenBowTie wrote:KEBRENI
(Falau) z'ada ebu ameriken [haiknu/gonarei/noh'a].

I think haiknu 'quarter' would be best... indeed, accurate, since technically there were four sectors in Berlin, one of them being East Berlin. Gonarei 'settlement' would imply an American neighborhood, something like the extraterritorial European sector of pre-war Shanghai.

The Elkar?l seems fine, tho' it does have an R... they'd probably write the name of the country as M?r?ka.

GreenBowTie · Post by **GreenBowTie** » Sun Oct 13, 2002 11:01 pm

zompist wrote:The Elkar?l seems fine, tho' it does have an R... they'd probably write the name of the country as M?r?ka.

Yeah, I was going to use an R, except that I'd think they'd consider the American "r" (and maybe the British "r" as well) to be more like their L than their "r", as it's much more in the front of the mouth. Since they don't use the Roman alphabet and thus wouldn't have the influence of the R in our spelling, I don't see what would make them think the American retroflex sounded anything like their uvular.

Elkar?l, by the way, reminds me of Klingon. And, also, I think you are a genius.