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zompist bboard • View topic - Odd natlang features thread

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:48 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:59 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:33 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:37 pm 
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Thanks. I found of suffixes loaned from Danish (at least I think that it is) which includes some Latinate suffixes.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:04 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:57 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 1:03 am 
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Piitish is great when it comes to stuff like this, so here's an other one I found: In some speakers speech the past participle, the neuter nouns definite article and the verbaliser has become the same, -e, and is only differentiated by the words themselves or the word order.

Also, where Swedish uses an additional definite article, Piitish uses what I believe would be called noun incorporation, with the root unchanged and the adjective simply tacked on before it and the whole word spoken slightly faster.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:59 am 
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Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
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Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:25 am 
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:32 am 
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ugh fiiiine i'll do it

04:18 < Cev> there's a nominative and an accusative word for "and" in Hopi
04:18 < Cev> depending on whether the noun phrase is nom or acc
04:18 < Cev> the two nouns also get case marked

page 4: http://dickgrune.com/Summaries/Languages/Hopi.pdf

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Siöö jandeng raiglin zåbei tandiüłåd;
nää džunnfin kukuch vklaivei sivei tåd.
Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei. Chei.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:22 pm 
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Nūdhrēmnāva naraśva, dṛk śraṣrāsit nūdhrēmanīṣṣ iźdatīyyīm woḥīm madhēyyaṣṣi.
satisfaction-DEF.SG-LOC live.PERFECTIVE-1P.INCL but work-DEF.SG-PRIV satisfaction-DEF.PL.NOM weakeness-DEF.PL-DAT only lead-FUT-3P


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:34 pm 
Smeric
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Something kind of similar is the word for 'because' in Navajo, which can be inflected for person; when it appears in the form 'because X happened' it's always X áhóót’įįd biniinaa, but you could say something like Shiniinaa sits’il 'It broke into pieces because of me' where the only indication of the first person being involved is the inflection on 'because'.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:07 pm 
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Navajo's absurd compactness always amazes me.

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satisfaction-DEF.SG-LOC live.PERFECTIVE-1P.INCL but work-DEF.SG-PRIV satisfaction-DEF.PL.NOM weakeness-DEF.PL-DAT only lead-FUT-3P


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:08 pm 
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this about the language that has chidí naaʼnaʼí beeʼeldǫǫhtsoh bikááʼ dah naaznilígíí for "tank"

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:31 pm 
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Okay, absurd compactness when it comes to native words and not loans.

What does that word for tank literally translate to?

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Nūdhrēmnāva naraśva, dṛk śraṣrāsit nūdhrēmanīṣṣ iźdatīyyīm woḥīm madhēyyaṣṣi.
satisfaction-DEF.SG-LOC live.PERFECTIVE-1P.INCL but work-DEF.SG-PRIV satisfaction-DEF.PL.NOM weakeness-DEF.PL-DAT only lead-FUT-3P


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:34 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:20 am 
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Location: tʰæ.ɹʷˠə.ˈgɜʉ̯.nɜ kʰæ.tə.ˈlɜʉ̯.nʲɜ spɛ̝ɪ̯n ˈjʏː.ɹəʔp
"Hey, we've got to leg it because I just saw a chidí naaʼnaʼí beeʼeldǫǫ..." BANG!!! :o

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:52 am 
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كان يا ما كان / يا صمت العشية / قمري هاجر في الصبح بعيدا / في العيون العسلية

tà yi póbo tsùtsùr ciivà dè!





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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:28 am 
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:56 pm 
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Dibotahamdn duthma jallni agaynni ra hgitn lakrhmi.
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Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro. Irdro.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 11:04 pm 
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Nūdhrēmnāva naraśva, dṛk śraṣrāsit nūdhrēmanīṣṣ iźdatīyyīm woḥīm madhēyyaṣṣi.
satisfaction-DEF.SG-LOC live.PERFECTIVE-1P.INCL but work-DEF.SG-PRIV satisfaction-DEF.PL.NOM weakeness-DEF.PL-DAT only lead-FUT-3P


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:17 am 
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 1:39 pm 
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How about some Amazonian languages with unusual phonologies! (My info comes from Dixon & Aikhenvald's The Amazonian Languages rather than from Wikipedia, though in some cases the inventories Wikipedia gives may well be more accurate and based on better/more complete data...)

Maxakalí's consonants are: /p t tʃ k ʔ/, /b d dʒ ɡ/, /h/.

has already been mentioned.

Xavánte lacks velars: /p t tʃ ʔ/, /b d dʒ/, /w ɾ h/.

Some dialects of Madí (Jamamadi and Banawá) have a pretty unbalanced consonant inventory, especially among the stops: /t k/, /b d ɟ/, /ɸ s h/, /r w/.

Jebero has only two ejectives: /kʼ/ and /ɾʼ/ -- the full consonant inventory is: /p t c k ʔ/, /kʼ/, /s ʃ/, /m n ɲ ŋ/, /ɾ ɹ l ʎ/, /ɾʼ/, /w j/.

Another language with an unbalanced consonant inventory, especially in the area of stops, is Trumai: the stops are /p t̪ t k ʔ/, /t̪ʼ tʼ kʼ/, /d/.


Beyond phoneme inventories, there's interesting phonological processes too. In a number of Amazonian languages, "nasal" is a property of syllables rather than individual segments, and there are various types of nasal harmony and nasal spreading, e.g. Tuyuca: bia-ja (close-IMPER, "close (it)") = [biaja], but põõ-ja (open-IMPER, "open (it)") = [põõɲã].

Kaingáng is especially cool in this respect. Basically, "nasal" stops have different realizations depending on whether they border a nasal vowel, oral vowel, or word boundary. If an oral vowel precedes the stop, the stop's onset is pronounced as an oral stop, which then transitions to a nasal stop; if an oral vowel follows, the nasal stop has an oral stop release. A preceding or following nasal vowel means the stop's onset or release, respectively, is fully nasal. Word boundaries work like nasal vowels in this respect. Some examples:
kanɛ̃ = [kadnɛ̃] "eye"
ɛ̃mɛ = [ʔɛ̃mbɛ] "blue sky"
pãnĩ = [pãnĩ] "back"
nɛn = [ndɛdn] "thing"
no = [ndo] "arrow"
nĩm = [nĩm] "to give a long object"
ti no = [tidndo] "his arrow"
no nĩm = [ndodnĩm] "to give arrows"
kanɛɾ = [kadndɛɾɛ] "smooth"


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 8:31 pm 
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Ju|'hoan (a grammar of which I received recently) has adjectives as a closed class. I'm not sure how unusual it is, but I find it interesting.
There are exactly seventeen words in the language which function as adjectives, as descriptive functions are usually performed by verbs. These are the words for "female"; "male"; "other" as in "remaining"; "other" as in "strange"; "true"; "old"; "new"; "a certain"; "each"; "all"; "some"; and the numbers one through four.


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